Draft Notes

[alleycat]

Dennard brings a lot of toughness and attitude, along with his ability to cover man to man and his excellent tackling skills/run D, too. I really like his game.

 

THIS in spades.  He was the heart and soul of a VERY nasty defense. I want that guy, and all of what he brings, on my team. 

 

That attitude is probably the number one attribute I look for in this draft.  It's that kind of toughness that this team needs to get over the hump - on both sides of the ball.

 

In fact, I should put a mock together soon that uses that as my 7 round criteria.  Off the top of my head, the guys I can think of are:

 

1st

Dennard

Taylor Lewan

Zack Martin

Calvin Pryor

 

2nd

Carlos Hyde

Tre Mason

Lamarcus Joyner

Gabe Jackson

 

3rd

Andre Williams

 

4th

Chris Smith

[JC]

Dennard is the kind of guy that shuts AJ Green down.  Super physical with you at the line, won't let you release in a timely manner.  Can turn and run.  May not have long speed, but if he can disrupt you long enough at the line, you won't need the long speed if the pass rush is adequate.  I hope like hell he falls.  My favorite guy behind Donald.

[alleycat]

Dennard is the kind of guy that shuts AJ Green down.  Super physical with you at the line, won't let you release in a timely manner.  Can turn and run.  May not have long speed, but if he can disrupt you long enough at the line, you won't need the long speed if the pass rush is adequate.  I hope like hell he falls.  My favorite guy behind Donald.

Ditto.

[alleycat]

This guy was going to be a first rounder next year, but isn't eligible this year because he's a true sophomore:

 

Top 2015 prospect Green-Beckham kicked off Missouri team

Posted by Michael David Smith on April 11, 2014, 4:13 PM EDT

Dorial Green-Beckham, a wide receiver viewed as a likely 2015 first-round draft pick, has been kicked off the Missouri football team.

Green-Beckham, a sophomore who’s talented enough that he could be a first-round pick this year if not for the NFL’s minimum-age rule, has had a string of off-field incidents that have raised concerns about his character. Most recently, he was named as a suspect in a burglary, and although he was not arrested, that was apparently the last straw for Missouri coach Gary Pinkel.

“Dorial’s priority going forward needs to be focusing on getting the help he needs,” Pinkel said in a statement.

The 6-foot-6, 225-pound Green-Beckham is a phenomenal athlete who won state high school championships in the 100 meters and the triple jump, and he had a very good sophomore season at Missouri last year. Although Missouri lost to Auburn in the SEC championship game, Green-Beckham looked like the best player on the field, catching six passes for 144 yards and two touchdowns.

Now the question is where Green-Beckham will take that talent. Transferring to another major college football program seems unlikely, as he would have to sit out a season before playing, and no one believes he’ll play more than one more year at the college level. Green-Beckham could transfer to a lower division and play immediately, or he could simply sit out a year before entering next year’s draft.

No matter what Green-Beckham does, a year from now he’ll be one of the most intriguing prospects in the draft, a receiver with incredible talent who can’t seem to get out of his own way off the field.

[spicoli]

Chris Henry part deux

[Bengals1181]

ha, Hue gets applauded when he says they'll run the ball.  "I'll do whatever it takes to run the ball.  You might see a lot of things you've never seen before this year. I promise you that."

 

Cincinnati Bengals ‏@Bengals  3h

VIDEO: Highlight from #DraftDayMovie Q&A- Hue Jackson is excited about this offense: http://go.bengals.com/1iCooho  #Bengals pic.twitter.com/7qfChAFO5a

[happyrid]

 

ha, Hue gets applauded when he says they'll run the ball.  "I'll do whatever it takes to run the ball.  You might see a lot of things you've never seen before this year. I promise you that."

 

Cincinnati Bengals ‏@Bengals  3h

VIDEO: Highlight from #DraftDayMovie Q&A- Hue Jackson is excited about this offense: http://go.bengals.com/1iCooho  #Bengals pic.twitter.com/7qfChAFO5a

 

 

Nice. Excited to see what kind of guys we can add in the draft to improve the run game. I see 3 realistic options that could really help:

 

-An OL who is an upgrade as a run blocker over Boling/Collins on the left side

-A bigger RB who is an upgrade over BJGE

-A true FB who is an upgrade over Orson Charles

 

Other than those 3 realistic potential draft upgrades, the improvement is going to have to come from within and from better play calling. Hopefully Pollak plays better than Cook. And Zeitler has a little better year. For whatever reason, he seemed to take a small step backward after a really good rookie season. Gio should hopefully improve in year 2. 

[happyrid]

Just thinking out loud here...

 

Any chance that the reason the Bengals have held onto BJGE and don't seem (at least in public comments) too worried about him or the RB position is just a smokescreen so that they don't tip their hand that they are looking for a RB relatively early again (round 2 or 3)?

 

Bengals usually aren't bullshitters when it comes to the draft, so probably not. Most likely going to keep BJGE for another year and draft a RB round 4 or later. But still something interesting to think about. Somebody like Hyde would be a really nice addition to the offense. But can you pass on a potential starter at a premium position like OT or CB in round 2 to take a RB?

[Bengals1181]

Just thinking out loud here...

 

Any chance that the reason the Bengals have held onto BJGE and don't seem (at least in public comments) too worried about him or the RB position is just a smokescreen so that they don't tip their hand that they are looking for a RB relatively early again (round 2 or 3)?

 

Bengals usually aren't bullshitters when it comes to the draft, so probably not. Most likely going to keep BJGE for another year and draft a RB round 4 or later. But still something interesting to think about. Somebody like Hyde would be a really nice addition to the offense. But can you pass on a potential starter at a premium position like OT or CB in round 2 to take a RB?

 

 

well there's no reason not to hang on to BJGE at this point.  Outside of a workout bonus of $200K, there's no significan financial gain to cutting him now rather than in say September.  You hang on to him now, until you have his replacement on the team.

 

I think the difference with him, instead of say Cook and Harrison is that Cook was injured and they weren't confident he'd recover, and I think Harrison it was more of out of respect for a future HOF to give him as much time as possible to find another team.  

[Bengals1181]

@NFLosophy: So reports from team sources crushing Bridgewater & praising Manziel. Sounds like teams like Bridgewater & not Manziel

[JC]

Seeing smoke on roto about Dennard falling.  Really hope there is fire to this one.  I didn't think there would be a chance we would be able to get a shot at him.

[Khatmandude]

Seeing smoke on roto about Dennard falling.  Really hope there is fire to this one.  I didn't think there would be a chance we would be able to get a shot at him.

 

Revis was drafted in the 20s if I'm not mistaken.....Dennard is very Revis like in his game.  Maybe he falls to 24.  Doubt it, but not out of the question. 

[Khatmandude]

 

 

well there's no reason not to hang on to BJGE at this point.  Outside of a workout bonus of $200K, there's no significan financial gain to cutting him now rather than in say September.  You hang on to him now, until you have his replacement on the team.

 

I think the difference with him, instead of say Cook and Harrison is that Cook was injured and they weren't confident he'd recover, and I think Harrison it was more of out of respect for a future HOF to give him as much time as possible to find another team.  

 

That's kinda against how the Bengals function though.....they don't typically hold on to guys that are not in their plans so to give that person a chance to catch on with another team.  With additional cuts that will be made then, it's unlikely he'll catch on with another team, especially considering the position he plays, if he's cut that late.  Kinda like Cook.....no reason to cut him now as he didn't require financial compensation until later on in the year but they cut him now anyways.  

 

Holding onto him until last minute, while knowing you want to go a different direction doesn't really fit the pattern the Bengals have developed over the years, in regards to how they handle player personnel decisions.

 

If BJGE is the starting tailback this year, with the options that were available to the team in FA, it will have been an opportunity missed IMO. 

[Bengals1181]

That's kinda against how the Bengals function though.....they don't typically hold on to guys that are not in their plans so to give that person a chance to catch on with another team.  With additional cuts that will be made then, it's unlikely he'll catch on with another team, especially considering the position he plays, if he's cut that late.  Kinda like Cook.....no reason to cut him now as he didn't require financial compensation until later on in the year but they cut him now anyways.  
 
Holding onto him until last minute, while knowing you want to go a different direction doesn't really fit the pattern the Bengals have developed over the years, in regards to how they handle player personnel decisions.
 
If BJGE is the starting tailback this year, with the options that were available to the team in FA, it will have been an opportunity missed IMO.

Right but you won't know until after the draft if BJGE is still in your plans or not. If you don't get an upgrade, you still need him.

[happyrid]

 

Revis was drafted in the 20s if I'm not mistaken.....Dennard is very Revis like in his game.  Maybe he falls to 24.  Doubt it, but not out of the question. 

 

Revis went 14 or 15. The Jets traded up in front of the Steelers (who ended up taking Timmons). We picked 18th that year and took Hall. 

 

Hard to tell what was true but the rumors that year were we loved both Revis and Hall and hoped either one would fall to us. Just rumors, but supposedly backup plan was Jarvis Moss. I think Denver traded up 1 spot ahead of us and took Moss. 

[Khatmandude]

Right but you won't know until after the draft if BJGE is still in your plans or not. If you don't get an upgrade, you still need him.

 

That's the thing....you can STILL get an upgrade at RB over BJGE today.  Finding one after the draft wouldn't be hard either.  Especially after the cuts that will undoubtedly happen.  And considering their MO in the past, doesn't seem to me that's what the thinking is.   I think that BJGE is the starting tailback for the Bengals in 2014-15. 

 

I definitely could be wrong and hope that I am but it would be going against past behavior. 

 

 

Revis went 14 or 15. The Jets traded up in front of the Steelers (who ended up taking Timmons). We picked 18th that year and took Hall. 

 

Hard to tell what was true but the rumors that year were we loved both Revis and Hall and hoped either one would fall to us. Just rumors, but supposedly backup plan was Jarvis Moss. I think Denver traded up 1 spot ahead of us and took Moss. 

 

Moss was hot garbage, fermenting.    

[bigboi]

 

ha, Hue gets applauded when he says they'll run the ball.  "I'll do whatever it takes to run the ball.  You might see a lot of things you've never seen before this year. I promise you that."

 

Cincinnati Bengals ‏@Bengals  3h

VIDEO: Highlight from #DraftDayMovie Q&A- Hue Jackson is excited about this offense: http://go.bengals.com/1iCooho  #Bengals pic.twitter.com/7qfChAFO5a

 

 

my Q&A for Hue Jackson,would be if the Bengals where going to run the ball then why did the cut John Conner a fullback who was more then capable on not only being the starting fullback on the,but why would you force Orson Charles to be fullback when he should have been in the number three tight-end position and Alex smith should have been cut.

[Oldcat]

 

my Q&A for Hue Jackson,would be if the Bengals where going to run the ball then why did the cut John Conner a fullback who was more then capable on not only being the starting fullback on the,but why would you force Orson Charles to be fullback when he should have been in the number three tight-end position and Alex smith should have been cut.

 

Hue wasn't OC then.  Call Washington for that info.

[sparky151]

 

Hue wasn't OC then.  Call Washington for that info.

 

No, Gruden complained about it on Hard Knocks. It was Hue's decision as the RB coach that kept Charles instead of Conner. Marvin went with Hue instead of Gruden.

[bigboi]

 

Hue wasn't OC then.  Call Washington for that info.

 

here is the whole transcript of what happened between Marvin Lewis,Hue Jackson and Jay gruden.

 

Marvin Lewis: How about John Connor and Orson?

Hue Jackson: John is the better fullback today but Orson played better last night he really did. He did some decent things but if you had to play today 20 play or 30 play regular football team then you gotta go with John Connor but that's not who we are.

Marvin Lewis: Darrin?

Darrin Simmons: Just talking strictly for special teams with the two fullbacks Orson has had better production.

Marvin Lewis: Jay I want you to go ahead and get it off your chest.

Jay Gruden: I think fullback. Clearly the best fullback is John Connor but the difference between the two isn't that significant that I have to ya know go to war.

[happyrid]

 

That's the thing....you can STILL get an upgrade at RB over BJGE today.  Finding one after the draft wouldn't be hard either.  Especially after the cuts that will undoubtedly happen.  And considering their MO in the past, doesn't seem to me that's what the thinking is.   I think that BJGE is the starting tailback for the Bengals in 2014-15. 

 

I definitely could be wrong and hope that I am but it would be going against past behavior. 

 

 

Moss was hot garbage, fermenting.    

 

We dodged a bullet there. We supposedly really liked Derrick Harvey a couple years later and Jacksonville traded up 1 spot ahead of us to save us from ourselves. We ended up picking Keith Rivers who was almost as big a bust though.

 

Probably the luckiest thing that has happened to this franchise in the past 5-10 years was not being able to trade up to select Taylor Mays. We were trying really hard to move up in round 2 to grab him, but couldn't pull off the deal. We instead had to settle for staying put and drafting Carlos Dunlap. We also held onto our extra picks later in the draft because our offer to move up wasn't enough. One of those picks was used on Geno Atkins.

 

Can you imagine if we ended up with Mays instead of Dunlap and Atkins? That's a real franchise changing non-trade where we were really saved from ourselves...

 

 

As for BJGE, I don't think he is going to start. It'll be Gio. The question is if he ends up as the #2 RB and gets 150 or 200 carries. The thing that makes me think we are probably going to keep him this year is that they respect him so much as a person that I think they'd have cut him early if that was what they were leaning towards doing so he could find a job elsewhere. 

[sparky151]

 

here is the whole transcript of what happened between Marvin Lewis,Hue Jackson and Jay gruden.

 

Marvin Lewis: How about John Connor and Orson?

Hue Jackson: John is the better fullback today but Orson played better last night he really did. He did some decent things but if you had to play today 20 play or 30 play regular football team then you gotta go with John Connor but that's not who we are.

Marvin Lewis: Darrin?

Darrin Simmons: Just talking strictly for special teams with the two fullbacks Orson has had better production.

Marvin Lewis: Jay I want you to go ahead and get it off your chest.

Jay Gruden: I think fullback. Clearly the best fullback is John Connor but the difference between the two isn't that significant that I have to ya know go to war.

 

There was also a bit where Gruden was driving somewhere in his truck and made it clear he didn't get to pick the players.

[Bengals1181]

 

Revis went 14 or 15. The Jets traded up in front of the Steelers (who ended up taking Timmons). We picked 18th that year and took Hall. 

 

Hard to tell what was true but the rumors that year were we loved both Revis and Hall and hoped either one would fall to us. Just rumors, but supposedly backup plan was Jarvis Moss. I think Denver traded up 1 spot ahead of us and took Moss. 

 

 

pretty sure it was another gator, Reggie Nelson, that the Bengals were high on.  It became a talking piece after they later picked up Nelson via trade.

[Oldcat]

 

There was also a bit where Gruden was driving somewhere in his truck and made it clear he didn't get to pick the players.

 

He had his input.  As Hue said  - if we were going to run 20 or 30 times then Connor but that "wasn't who we are".  The person who defines that is the Offensive Coordinator.

[Khatmandude]

 

Hue wasn't OC then.  Call Washington for that info.

 

Riiiiight......so the look of disgust on Gruden's face during Hard Knocks when Hue insisted on keeping Charles over Conner was because that was really his decision.   Gotcha.  Makes perfect sense.  

 

When trying to be a smartass, it's generally helpful to know what the fuck you're talking about.    

 

 

We dodged a bullet there. We supposedly really liked Derrick Harvey a couple years later and Jacksonville traded up 1 spot ahead of us to save us from ourselves. We ended up picking Keith Rivers who was almost as big a bust though.

 

Probably the luckiest thing that has happened to this franchise in the past 5-10 years was not being able to trade up to select Taylor Mays. We were trying really hard to move up in round 2 to grab him, but couldn't pull off the deal. We instead had to settle for staying put and drafting Carlos Dunlap. We also held onto our extra picks later in the draft because our offer to move up wasn't enough. One of those picks was used on Geno Atkins.

 

Can you imagine if we ended up with Mays instead of Dunlap and Atkins? That's a real franchise changing non-trade where we were really saved from ourselves...

 

 

As for BJGE, I don't think he is going to start. It'll be Gio. The question is if he ends up as the #2 RB and gets 150 or 200 carries. The thing that makes me think we are probably going to keep him this year is that they respect him so much as a person that I think they'd have cut him early if that was what they were leaning towards doing so he could find a job elsewhere. 

 

Great post and yes, got VERY lucky that they couldn't trade up for Mays.  Sometimes, the Bengals can't get out of their own way but everyone needs luck on their side at times.  That was very fortunate.  The Ravens would have probably drafted Dunlap and the Steelers Atkins in that worst case scenario haha.  

 

The last paragraph makes sense actually....I hadn't thought it through fully so didn't realize Gio is going to "start"/get the bulk of work......but I do think, for the same exact reasons you mentioned, that BJGE has a place on this team as I've said as much in my previous posts.   He and his $3mil/yr will be on this team once the season starts IMO.