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Figured I'd start a thread so folks can share their thoughts on the pandemic. My biggest takeaways watching these briefings is:

 

Jim Acosta is an absolute ass. 

 

Trump says he doesn't want to take credit for his action while continually taking credit for his actions

 

Americans are reacting well as a whole, but there's the occasional asshole.

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7 hours ago, bfine said:

Trump says he doesn't want to take credit for his action while continually taking credit for his actions

 

I'm more concerned about his inaction, which he accepts no responsibility for.

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I mentioned this in a separate thread but I'll repost and add to my thoughts here....

 

A few things we can and should do. Put a moratorium on all rent and utilities being collected until June 1, for those that got laid off. 

Get cash in people's hands right now., which means everyone, Dont means test it you put up red tape that keeps people from getting it who need it. You can tax the richer people to get it back later.

 

Some things to consider for the future

- 3.2 million people out of work now without health insurance, this adds to the problem because people cant be tested or will avoid it, this effects everyone not just these people. We need a healthcare system that covers everyone regardless of ability to pay that isn't tied to employment. We need Medicare for all.

 

- We dont know how long this is going to last with any certainty, China's curve if they are reporting honestly which I doubt, has flattened but they are also starting to see some people who passed the test who are now getting it. That kind of bounce needs to be considered. What this means is it could effect voting, which is why we need same day registration.

 

- Long term we are too reliant on the airlines and trucking for delivery with regard to our infrastructure, we need high speed rail

 

- Because we are forcing the kids to do distance learning, we need to have basic internet for them. I spoke to a few teacher friends of mine and it sounds like Comcast has gone the route of providing it to the kids that have free or reduced lunch costs (and good on the schools for doing lunch pickups) but that means they dont have it right now because their installers arent going around installing it right now. So many of the kids are getting printed out packets. Once this is over they need to install the internet for those kids because there is still the possibility that we face this again in he winter. Also go back to reclassifying the ISPs as a utility. 

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13 hours ago, CincyInDC said:

 

I'm more concerned about his inaction, which he accepts no responsibility for.

I'm more concerned about what Monday Morning QBs call inaction.

 

Acosta wouldn't let it go.

 

Trump's first act was to stop travel to and from China. Jim Acosta and Joe Biden, among many others, called him a Xenophobe. 

 

What exactly should he have done earlier? 

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7 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

I mentioned this in a separate thread but I'll repost and add to my thoughts here....

 

A few things we can and should do. Put a moratorium on all rent and utilities being collected until June 1, for those that got laid off. 

Get cash in people's hands right now., which means everyone, Dont means test it you put up red tape that keeps people from getting it who need it. You can tax the richer people to get it back later.

 

Some things to consider for the future

- 3.2 million people out of work now without health insurance, this adds to the problem because people cant be tested or will avoid it, this effects everyone not just these people. We need a healthcare system that covers everyone regardless of ability to pay that isn't tied to employment. We need Medicare for all.

 

- We dont know how long this is going to last with any certainty, China's curve if they are reporting honestly which I doubt, has flattened but they are also starting to see some people who passed the test who are now getting it. That kind of bounce needs to be considered. What this means is it could effect voting, which is why we need same day registration.

 

- Long term we are too reliant on the airlines and trucking for delivery with regard to our infrastructure, we need high speed rail

 

- Because we are forcing the kids to do distance learning, we need to have basic internet for them. I spoke to a few teacher friends of mine and it sounds like Comcast has gone the route of providing it to the kids that have free or reduced lunch costs (and good on the schools for doing lunch pickups) but that means they dont have it right now because their installers arent going around installing it right now. So many of the kids are getting printed out packets. Once this is over they need to install the internet for those kids because there is still the possibility that we face this again in he winter. Also go back to reclassifying the ISPs as a utility. 

Identifying shortfalls in our society is a result of every crisis. 

 

As to the internet. If the government provides it, should they be able to monitor/ control the content?

 

As to medicare for all. Are countries with Socialized healthcare doing significantly better than those with private healthcare?

 

I totally agree about enhancing the rail infrastructure  

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1 hour ago, bfine said:

Jim Acosta and Joe Biden, among many others, called him a Xenophobe

oh nooooo... but what about Joe Biden?  IDGAF about Jim Acosta or Joe Biden.  They do not speak for me.  Why should they matter?  It's not like Biden stands a chance against the cheetoh in November, anyway.  Honestly, when anyone calls out Trump's racist horseshit he usually just doubles down on it.

 

1 hour ago, bfine said:

I'm more concerned about what Monday Morning QBs call inaction.

You're right.  It was a mix constant lying and inaction.

 

1 hour ago, bfine said:

What exactly should he have done earlier? 

  • Lock down infected cities
  • Make testing a priority
  • Get funding for respirators/masks/tubes/etc. lined up
  • Not downplay the dangers for the entire month of February and well into March

Basically, he should have listened to epidemiologists or maybe even anyone who understands compounding interest. 

 

Here is how a leader addresses his or her country in a crisis: difficult truths, honesty, science-based facts, and a plan based on those facts.

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1 hour ago, CincyInDC said:

oh nooooo... but what about Joe Biden?  IDGAF about Jim Acosta or Joe Biden.  They do not speak for me.  Why should they matter?  It's not like Biden stands a chance against the cheetoh in November, anyway.  Honestly, when anyone calls out Trump's racist horseshit he usually just doubles down on it.

 

You're right.  It was a mix constant lying and inaction.

 

  • Lock down infected cities
  • Make testing a priority
  • Get funding for respirators/masks/tubes/etc. lined up
  • Not downplay the dangers for the entire month of February and well into March

Basically, he should have listened to epidemiologists or maybe even anyone who understands compounding interest. 

 

Here is how a leader addresses his or her country in a crisis: difficult truths, honesty, science-based facts, and a plan based on those facts.

I'll take you at your word that you didn't side with many on the left and considered Trump banned travel to and from China to be Xenophobic; I'm certain you applauded the move.

 

You further applaud Merkle for not doing any of the things you said Trump should do. Is she "downplaying" it by not quarantining citizens like many other EU countries.

 

Merkle is a "leader" because she has addressed the German citizenry once and said they must do their part?

 

You cannot make this stuff up. 

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4 hours ago, bfine said:

Identifying shortfalls in our society is a result of every crisis. 

 

As to the internet. If the government provides it, should they be able to monitor/ control the content?

 

As to medicare for all. Are countries with Socialized healthcare doing significantly better than those with private healthcare?

 

I totally agree about enhancing the rail infrastructure  

Thing is much like gun control we should not be talking about these things after a crisis, but beforehand so that were not in the situation we are in. I know this is a "black swan" but I really do believe that if we had a better government we might not have lost 3.2 million jobs (numbers still coming in as I know 2 people in the Cincy area that were layed off) St Louis Fed today said that  66 million are in "high risk" for job loss with this thing. This Politico article talks about the neglect we had at the state level for not getting funds for unemployment insurance. 

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/01/unemployed-workers-benefits-coronavirus-159192 

 

We've had decades of "government is not the solution to our problems, government is the problem" propaganda that now we are in the middle of a crisis and government is ill funded and ill prepared to fully handle it.

 

Speaking to my teacher friends, I think the solution of letting the private ISPs implement it while getting supplements from the government to pay back the costs for  said services, and we still need to reclassify these ISPs as utilities imho.

 

As to the medicare for all question, it really just boils down to this for me. We are about to have massive unemployment, potentially the levels of the Great Depression. Now I hope this doesn't last long, but in a Pandemic we can't know that. As such tying healthcare to employment in a situation where unemployed people who cant be tested due to lack of insurance can just as easily pass this on to employed people, is insanity to me. We need to be covering everyone, and I think you have to untie it from employment.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

Thing is much like gun control we should not be talking about these things after a crisis, but beforehand so that were not in the situation we are in. I know this is a "black swan" but I really do believe that if we had a better government we might not have lost 3.2 million jobs (numbers still coming in as I know 2 people in the Cincy area that were layed off) St Louis Fed today said that  66 million are in "high risk" for job loss with this thing. This Politico article talks about the neglect we had at the state level for not getting funds for unemployment insurance. 

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/01/unemployed-workers-benefits-coronavirus-159192 

 

We've had decades of "government is not the solution to our problems, government is the problem" propaganda that now we are in the middle of a crisis and government is ill funded and ill prepared to fully handle it.

 

Speaking to my teacher friends, I think the solution of letting the private ISPs implement it while getting supplements from the government to pay back the costs for  said services, and we still need to reclassify these ISPs as utilities imho.

 

As to the medicare for all question, it really just boils down to this for me. We are about to have massive unemployment, potentially the levels of the Great Depression. Now I hope this doesn't last long, but in a Pandemic we can't know that. As such tying healthcare to employment in a situation where unemployed people who cant be tested due to lack of insurance can just as easily pass this on to employed people, is insanity to me. We need to be covering everyone, and I think you have to untie it from employment.

 

 

Not sure you really answered either question I asked:

 

If the government pays my internet bill should they be allowed to monitor/control the content?

 

Have countries with socialized healthcare fared better than those with private healthcare?

 

 

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1. No and you can do it without giving them that right. 

 

2. Hard question to answer in the midst of the crisis, I'm sure that data will come out afterwards. But doesn't really cover what I am talking about with regard to tying healthcare to employment especially as so many are about to lose their jobs.

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12 hours ago, bfine said:

I'm certain you applauded the move.

I'm gonna have to go ahead and ask you to climb ALL THE WAY off my back here.  Keep it in mind that you don't know me.

 

12 hours ago, bfine said:

You further applaud Merkle for not doing any of the things you said Trump should do. Is she "downplaying" it by not quarantining citizens like many other EU countries.

Who is Merkle?  We don't have a curfew, but everything except groceries and pharmacies are closed.  Most borders are closed except to goods and commuters, and the ones that aren't closed have already been closed by the neighbor, anyway (France, Denmark, Czech Repbublic, etc.).  If you can work from home, that is what you have to do.  The only reason to be out and about is going to work, grocery, pharmacy, or doctor.  You can take a walk in the fresh air if you like, but only if you employ social distancing and keep it to no more than 2 people, who have to be cohabitants.  So yes, I applaud Merkel because her science-based approach to the problem is working.  Germany is not running out of ventilators, hospital beds, or morgue space yet.  If analysis shows that these things can become a problem, policies will change.

 

12 hours ago, bfine said:

Merkle is a "leader" because she has addressed the German citizenry once and said they must do their part?

I especially like how she sticks to facts and doesn't stand in front of reporters and spout bullshit just to stroke her fragile ego.  I also like how her government put a moratorium on the export of medical protective equipment when it became clear we were going to need it. 

 

12 hours ago, bfine said:

You cannot make this stuff up. 

I agree with you on this one. 

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I have to applaud grocery workers..

On the front line and having ti cope with 

total moronic grerdy customers..

Kroger put lines 6 feet apart to stand in checkout areas..

You think these idiots are standing there?

No...still bunch up together and talking in each others face for the most part...

To me these employees are heroes of another kind...

Thank them for serving our country as well.

Why kroger and other chains havent given these people masks is criminal..

 

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6 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

I have to applaud grocery workers..

On the front line and having ti cope with 

total moronic grerdy customers..

Kroger put lines 6 feet apart to stand in checkout areas..

You think these idiots are standing there?

No...still bunch up together and talking in each others face for the most part...

To me these employees are heroes of another kind...

Thank them for serving our country as well.

Why kroger and other chains havent given these people masks is criminal..

 

Dude you can't get those folks to follow 8 items or less for the express lane. You think you can get them to practice social distancing.

 

I too applaud the workers. I was walking into Dollar General the other day to help look for TP for a coworker who is running low (I still don't get the fascination with TP). I passed by the Coke delivery man and simply said "thanks for what you're doing". He was stunned. 

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10 hours ago, CincyInDC said:

I'm gonna have to go ahead and ask you to climb ALL THE WAY off my back here.  Keep it in mind that you don't know me.

 

Who is Merkle?  We don't have a curfew, but everything except groceries and pharmacies are closed.  Most borders are closed except to goods and commuters, and the ones that aren't closed have already been closed by the neighbor, anyway (France, Denmark, Czech Repbublic, etc.).  If you can work from home, that is what you have to do.  The only reason to be out and about is going to work, grocery, pharmacy, or doctor.  You can take a walk in the fresh air if you like, but only if you employ social distancing and keep it to no more than 2 people, who have to be cohabitants.  So yes, I applaud Merkel because her science-based approach to the problem is working.  Germany is not running out of ventilators, hospital beds, or morgue space yet.  If analysis shows that these things can become a problem, policies will change.

 

I especially like how she sticks to facts and doesn't stand in front of reporters and spout bullshit just to stroke her fragile ego.  I also like how her government put a moratorium on the export of medical protective equipment when it became clear we were going to need it. 

 

I agree with you on this one. 

Just seems you're a little biased on your applause/condemnation. But that's probably just me seeing it wrong. 

 

As to the US: It's an interesting dynamic to see the liberal cursing Trump for not taking away enough individual liberties. 

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6 hours ago, bfine said:

 

 

As to the US: It's an interesting dynamic to see the liberal cursing Trump for not taking away enough individual liberties. 

 

Is anyone that criticizes Trump a liberal, or how do you make that distinction? 

 

I think it's an "interesting dynamic" that some people would rather dig for these Gotcha Moments & focus on perceived hypocrisy rather than the total void in leadership.

 

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to be completely honest i am just hoping i dont die

 

i have asthma and. a few other minor conditions that would have me at a significant risk. i havent left my house in over a week, but my wifes job is "essential", so 5 days a week someone is leaving the house and coming in some contact with 10 others, and coming home.

 

i think its possible that she, and both of my kids have already had it, all 3 got pretty sick early in march, all for about 7 days or so. I had my wife move into the guest bedroom, i have her coming home tossing clothes in washer and washing up before interacting with everyone..

 

my kids are in some important formative years, one will border on being good enough to play college sports, the other is going through adjusting to the middle school to soon be in high school transition, i dont want to die from this because we ordered some food out or we ran out of toilet paper or whatever the fuck yanks us into contact with the general public.

 

 

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8 hours ago, bfine said:

Just seems you're a little biased on your applause/condemnation.

Is it bias when you listen to someone constantly and demonstrably lie, and then call that person a liar?  Hint: the answer is no.

 

 

8 hours ago, bfine said:

But that's probably just me seeing it wrong.

awww well shucks.

 

 

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6 hours ago, GoBengals said:

to be completely honest i am just hoping i dont die

 

i have asthma

 

 

With you there - that's terrifying when you hear what people without those conditions who got the virus describe. I'm asthmatic as well and we have been staying home, but the wife had to travel because her mother is dying - and they have a LOT of family visiting and helping. Just hoping when she comes back that I am not fucked.

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11 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

Is anyone that criticizes Trump a liberal, or how do you make that distinction? 

 

I think it's an "interesting dynamic" that some people would rather dig for these Gotcha Moments & focus on perceived hypocrisy rather than the total void in leadership.

 

Nope I criticize Trump and am not a liberal. I was just speaking to society as a whole. Many professed liberals suggest Trump should "do more" to include quarantines. 

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10 hours ago, GoBengals said:

to be completely honest i am just hoping i dont die

 

i have asthma and. a few other minor conditions that would have me at a significant risk. i havent left my house in over a week, but my wifes job is "essential", so 5 days a week someone is leaving the house and coming in some contact with 10 others, and coming home.

 

i think its possible that she, and both of my kids have already had it, all 3 got pretty sick early in march, all for about 7 days or so. I had my wife move into the guest bedroom, i have her coming home tossing clothes in washer and washing up before interacting with everyone..

 

my kids are in some important formative years, one will border on being good enough to play college sports, the other is going through adjusting to the middle school to soon be in high school transition, i dont want to die from this because we ordered some food out or we ran out of toilet paper or whatever the fuck yanks us into contact with the general public.

 

 

You do bring the human factor into the equation and that's why I hate the constant political bias that is being introduced. I believe as a country we are responding well, but there's a price to be paid for being the largest economy in the world. Stay safe and I pray for an end to the pandemic and our doctors find treatment/vaccines. 

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8 hours ago, CincyInDC said:

Is it bias when you listen to someone constantly and demonstrably lie, and then call that person a liar?  Hint: the answer is no.

 

 

awww well shucks.

 

 

No that's not bias. Bias is more like applauding one person while condemning another when the basically are doing the same thing. 

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18 hours ago, bfine said:

Just seems you're a little biased on your applause/condemnation. But that's probably just me seeing it wrong. 

 

As to the US: It's an interesting dynamic to see the liberal cursing Trump for not taking away enough individual liberties. 

I dont think any one wants their individual liberties taken away permanently, but in the short term we need to be thinking about the good of the collective.

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1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

I dont think any one wants their individual liberties taken away permanently, but in the short term we need to be thinking about the good of the collective.

I have 0 issues with measures being taken as I an well stocked, it's just the wife and I, and I can work from home without missing a paycheck. Folks not sure where their family's next meal is coming from may not be as big on a fan with forced quarantine 

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