|Bunghole| Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 the arm strength thing continues to be overrated. Last week's game in Baltimore is the only game of Dalton's career where arm strength may have been an issue. His arm strength is plenty strong to succeed in the NFL. The big thing with arm strength is that on certain throws, a stronger arm covers some of your mistakes. ie. the pick six by Hayden yesterday. Dalton threw it late. Maybe a Flacco gets away with throwing that late, maybe not. It wasn't picked because of a lack of arm strength though, but because it was thrown incredibly late, and he wasn't open to boot. I don't think the throw was so much late as it was thrown inside of AJ's left shoulder instead of outside where Hayden wouldn't have been able to grab it at all. Sure, perhaps AJ doesn't get the catch either if it's thrown there but an incompletion is so much better than what ended up happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BronxBengal Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 What defenders at the feet of Dalton? I thought this line was rated one of the highest in the league......I believe this line is over rated and average at best. It is one of the reasons the offense is struggling and a lack of run game proves it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Hmmm... I think I'd have to see that. I don't recall many long completions. There was the hail mary to AJ in Baltimore. I don't know what it is now, but going into the Cleveland game Dalton led the league in completions over 20yds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 I don't think the throw was so much late as it was thrown inside of AJ's left shoulder instead of outside where Hayden wouldn't have been able to grab it at all. Sure, perhaps AJ doesn't get the catch either if it's thrown there but an incompletion is so much better than what ended up happening. yea it was a little behind, but it was simply a bad read. Even if he throws it on time, he has to throw it PAST two guys who could have jumped it if they read it right. There was surely someone more open on the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBeaverHunter Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Arm strength matters...especially on the picks that Dalton throws the most. The comebacks or curls. His ball doesn't have enough zip to get to the WR in time and the CB can react and jump it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Arm strength matters...especially on the picks that Dalton throws the most. The comebacks or curls. His ball doesn't have enough zip to get to the WR in time and the CB can react and jump it. his issues haven't really been comebacks and curls. Both pick sixes were an out routes. 2 were on seam routes that the WR dropped. the first in Chicago was on a slant. In baltimore, it was a seam route, a post route and the one with marvin jones (that was on jones) was a short zone sitdown read. Buffalo one was a slant. New England was a scramble. Green Bay was an out route. First cleveland game was also a zone sitdown read that got tipped in the air. I don't think a single one has been on a comeback or curl. And its not a matter of arm strength. On many of them its been about bad location and throwing it late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange 'n Black Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 his issues haven't really been comebacks and curls. Both pick sixes were an out routes. 2 were on seam routes that the WR dropped. the first in Chicago was on a slant. In baltimore, it was a seam route, a post route and the one with marvin jones (that was on jones) was a short zone sitdown read. Buffalo one was a slant. New England was a scramble. Green Bay was an out route. First cleveland game was also a zone sitdown read that got tipped in the air. I don't think a single one has been on a comeback or curl. And its not a matter of arm strength. On many of them its been about bad location and throwing it late. He's already thrown 15 picks this year, 1 off his career high. I really don't recall him throwing these types of picks in the previous two years - I wonder if this is due to the coaches opening up more of the playbook for him? It would make sense if he hasn't been making these throws much previously in his career, and is still learning how to make them. That might be an interesting analysis to do on a bored weeknight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 He's already thrown 15 picks this year, 1 off his career high. I really don't recall him throwing these types of picks in the previous two years - I wonder if this is due to the coaches opening up more of the playbook for him? It would make sense if he hasn't been making these throws much previously in his career, and is still learning how to make them. That might be an interesting analysis to do on a bored weeknight. yea there's definitely a little more going on. Some of it seems to be be fluky like the two tipped ones, but there were also 5-6 fluky ones last year. The good thing is, most of them aren't coming on bad reads. The one against Buffalo and the pick six against Cleveland are really the only two bad reads. to go through all of them: chicago 1: picked on a slant, consensus seems to be AJ ran a lazy route chicago 2: AJ dropped it and it bounced up in the air Green Bay: bad location, threw it behind AJ Cleveland: tipped pass of a zone read sitdown. can argue it should have been caught, can argue pass could have been a little better New England: bad decision not to throw it away while scrambling Buffalo: bad read. never saw the safety in the middle of the field Jets: fluky play, great play by the defender Miami 1: per gruden and green, AJ ran his route wrong Miami 2: bad throw by Dalton throwing behind the WR on the out route Miami 3: drop by Sanu Baltimore 1: (the order may be off on these three) overthrew Aj on a post route. may or may not have been wind aided Baltimore 2: overthrew Eifert. per Eifert, Dalton said it sailed on him, but it looked like they weren't on same page Baltimore 3: Marvin Jones got it ripped out of his hands Cleveland 1: per AJ, he ran his route wrong and cut in when he should have cut out. Cleveland 2: bad read by Dalton, there were 2 guys between aj and the flight of the ball so yea, really just two bad reads. A couple bad throws, and 3 that the WR's have done a better job of holding on to. To me, it seems they are running a lot more of hot reads and zone plays than in years past, and when everyone's on the same page they work great and when they aren't they lead to INT's and incompletions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khatmandude Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Arm strength matters...especially on the picks that Dalton throws the most. The comebacks or curls. His ball doesn't have enough zip to get to the WR in time and the CB can react and jump it. It can't be. The people on this site who have never played football say arm strength isn't an issue so it must be true. The best part is them trying to explain football hahaha. Quite humorous. It's so bad I don't even respond anymore, just laugh. We were wrong about Palmer, Brat and now Dalton. Oh wait, definitely wasn't wrong on Palmer or Brat. When time proves it with Dalton as well, I wonder what the excuses will be. There is something to be said though about "yelling the loudest" and making 50 posts in each thread re-inforcing the same point......the more a human being hears something, the more difficult it is to discern that thing from the actual truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|kennethmw| Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 It can't be. The people on this site who have never played football say arm strength isn't an issue so it must be true. The best part is them trying to explain football hahaha. Quite humorous. It's so bad I don't even respond anymore, just laugh. We were wrong about Palmer, Brat and now Dalton. Oh wait, definitely wasn't wrong on Palmer or Brat. When time proves it with Dalton as well, I wonder what the excuses will be. There is something to be said though about "yelling the loudest" and making 50 posts in each thread re-inforcing the same point......the more a human being hears something, the more difficult it is to discern that thing from the actual truth. So, how much football have you played, kat? Inquiring minds want to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Kyle Boller, now he had some arm strength... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooky Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Baltimore 3: Marvin Jones got it ripped out of his hands It looked like PI to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 19, 2013 Report Share Posted November 19, 2013 Baltimore 3: Marvin Jones got it ripped out of his hands It looked like PI to me. yea it was, and they threw the flag, but he also caught it and lost it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooky Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 yea it was, and they threw the flag, but he also caught it and lost it. I wasn't arguing that. That was another play that Dierdorf wouldn't shut up about how awesome the defense was and it was pretty clear PI to me. Was that the play where they picked up the flag and said no PI without an explanation why it wasn't? I remember it happening, but couldn't remember which play it was. did they pick up the flag because the ball was uncatchable, even though it was intercepted by a guy hanging over him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 I wasn't arguing that. That was another play that Dierdorf wouldn't shut up about how awesome the defense was and it was pretty clear PI to me. Was that the play where they picked up the flag and said no PI without an explanation why it wasn't? I remember it happening, but couldn't remember which play it was. did they pick up the flag because the ball was uncatchable, even though it was intercepted by a guy hanging over him? yea they threw a flag and then picked it up after the INT and simply said "there is no flag for pass interference on the play." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 yea they threw a flag and then picked it up after the INT and simply said "there is no flag for pass interference on the play." A tipped ball is the usual reason for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eva4ben-gal Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 It can't be. The people on this site who have never played football say arm strength isn't an issue so it must be true. The best part is them trying to explain football hahaha. Quite humorous. It's so bad I don't even respond anymore, just laugh. We were wrong about Palmer, Brat and now Dalton. Oh wait, definitely wasn't wrong on Palmer or Brat. When time proves it with Dalton as well, I wonder what the excuses will be. There is something to be said though about "yelling the loudest" and making 50 posts in each thread re-inforcing the same point......the more a human being hears something, the more difficult it is to discern that thing from the actual truth. You seem to be at odds with the Bengals coaches and front office. Embrace the ginger, you're stuck with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairOnFire Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 You seem to be at odds with the Bengals coaches and front office. Embrace the ginger, you're stuck with him. Or at the very least, Khat might swallow his hatred until a more appropriate time. The run up before the draft and free agency come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Tigre Posted November 20, 2013 Report Share Posted November 20, 2013 Anyone notice his TD passes go up every year too...including this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvilleBengal Posted November 21, 2013 Report Share Posted November 21, 2013 I have to do this: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted November 21, 2013 Report Share Posted November 21, 2013 I have to do this: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: :2dedhorse: you were born to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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