Bengals cut Myers, IR Santucci

[oldschooler]

[quote name='CougarQuest' post='693987' date='Sep 1 2008, 08:47 AM']I think you're mistaken on that. They have at least 3 just from this years draft and college free agent signings don't they, in Mario Urrutia, Jason Shirley, and Maurice Purify?[/quote]



Oooops. I forgot Shirley. So make it 3.


The other players are not on the 53 (54 counting Henry) man roster.

And simply being arrested doesn`t mean someone is guilty of anything.
Or that they are a 'knucklehead'.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='CougarQuest' post='693987' date='Sep 1 2008, 09:47 AM']I think you're mistaken on that. They have at least 3 just from this years draft and college free agent signings don't they, in Mario Urrutia, Jason Shirley, and Maurice Purify?[/quote]


yes, but neither one of them have shown any reason to be in the "shithead" category or any kind of locker room problem.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='693981' date='Sep 1 2008, 09:14 AM']Exactly... which is something that we haven't done.

Let's face it, as of right now 2005 looks the the exception and NOT the norm. The shitheads are dragging us further away from where we want to go.[/quote]



where are these shitheads (plural)? Henry's the only one close to being a shithead left on the team.

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='Bengals1181' post='693992' date='Sep 1 2008, 10:59 AM']where are these shitheads (plural)? Henry's the only one close to being a shithead left on the team.[/quote]
Think about it... as a couple of people have referred to, Willie wasn't exactly the "leader" everyone thought and
Rudi was a negative energy on the team too. We all know what Chad has done and then there is still Henry.
Is there anyone else in that locker room that isn't helping but hurting? Is Shirley a Henry waiting to happen?

We shall see... I hope and pray that I'm wrong, because I want to see a championship team in Cincinnati just like we all do,
but our track record doesn't bode well for that... does it?

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='693996' date='Sep 1 2008, 10:08 AM']Think about it... as a couple of people have referred to, Willie wasn't exactly the "leader" everyone thought and
Rudi was a negative energy on the team too. We all know what Chad has done and then there is still Henry.
Is there anyone else in that locker room that isn't helping but hurting? Is Shirley a Henry waiting to happen?

We shall see... I hope and pray that I'm wrong, because I want to see a championship team in Cincinnati just like we all do,
but our track record doesn't bode well for that... does it?[/quote]


so you're basically making rash judgements about certain players that you've never met?

[CougarQuest]

I am kind of surprised that Angelo Craig and Eric Henderson haven't been signed (yet) to the practice squad. I wonder if they are weighing their options with another team?

[VonBlade]

53 players in the locker room, 2 idiots (CJ, Slim).

I reckon it's overrated as a problem.

If there were 50+ guys where you work and one bellend, would your output be vastly affected by them?

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='Bengals1181' post='693998' date='Sep 1 2008, 11:21 AM']so you're basically making rash judgements about certain players that you've never met?[/quote]

rash judgements?

LOL!

A hypothesis is a theory or guess made with information garnered from past performance or history.


My hypothesis is that we are not out of the woods yet. If you choose to be an ostrich and stick your head in the
sand and ignore the problem, then so be it. My hypothesis has a basis in fact, the facts presented by this team
for the past 3 yeas minimum, and going all the way back to the assholes like Pickens.

What is your opinion based on... hope 1181?

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me...

[texbengal]

[quote name='CougarQuest' post='694000' date='Sep 1 2008, 09:27 AM']I am kind of surprised that Angelo Craig and Eric Henderson haven't been signed (yet) to the practice squad. I wonder if they are weighing their options with another team?[/quote]

That'd be my guess. Actually, I expected some combination of Henderson, Craig, and Maxwell. And if someone caught their eye between now and the first game, maybe Castille or Jordan Palmer. (Edit: that Palmer or Castille would be relegated to the PS if they picked up someone else that went on the 53)

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='VonBlade' post='694002' date='Sep 1 2008, 11:28 AM']53 players in the locker room, 2 idiots (CJ, Slim).

I reckon it's overrated as a problem.

If there were 50+ guys where you work and one bellend, would your output be vastly affected by them?[/quote]

Wouldn't that depend on how much shit that one or two guys (at a minimum) could cause, and what position they were in?

We have one or two KNOWN shitheads, maybe more or maybe not.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='694007' date='Sep 1 2008, 10:36 AM']rash judgements?

LOL!

A hypothesis is a theory or guess made with information garnered from past performance or history.


My hypothesis is that we are not out of the woods yet. If you choose to be an ostrich and stick your head in the
sand and ignore the problem, then so be it. My hypothesis has a basis in fact, the facts presented by this team
for the past 3 yeas minimum, and going all the way back to the assholes like Pickens.

What is your opinion based on... hope 1181?

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me...[/quote]



I think VonBlade summed it up pretty well, and Slim's not even a locker room problem. Hell, Chad barely is. Everyone gets way too worked up into thinking that players care that much what other players do off the field and that it effects on-the-field play.


My opinion? We have more than plenty young leaders in Whitworth, Hall, Joseph, Ndukwe, Peko, Rivers, and Geathers mixed in with veteran leaders like Carson, TJ, JT, and Dhani. This team has locker room leaders. For all we know, the vets that were cut were keeping some of the young leaders from stepping up. IMO, you're just buying into the media's perception of the team. Other than Henry, who is a bad character player on the team?


As far as on the field matters, my concerns are the running game and CB depth (now that deltha's gone). The DL is loaded with young talent that hasn't even hit their prime yet. Odom, Geathers, Peko, Sims, and Shirley are all locked up for the next 4yrs. In some of their cases, 5yrs. Not to mention Fanene for 3. None of them (listed) are over the age of 26. In the secondary, I'm content with Hall, Joseph, White, Ndukwe, and Lynch and think they can really be a dynamic group. I also like David Jones, but wish they'd bring in a vet to be the #3 so he doesn't have to put both feet into the fire just yet. At LB, I feel alright with this year, but definately think they need to plan longterm. Only Rivers and Dhani have more than 1yr on their contract, and Dhani's not a longterm answer.


On the offensive side of the ball, the key is the OL. They need to improve in the running game, I think the pass protection will be fine once Chad and TJ return to practice this week, preventing teams from blitzing so much. That's been part of the problem this preseason. If defenses don't respect your WR's, they are going to blitz the hell out of you. The young WR's just need time to develop like the DL does. At TE, we're as good as we've ever been. No need to elaborate on that. At RB, while I appreciate what Rudi's done, his style doesn't fit here anymore. Our OL can't provide the big holes he needs. We need RB's like the ones we have who can create their own "magic" so to speak. Rudi's not that type. At QB, you know what we've got in Carson.


So no, I don't think the "ship is sinking" or that we have attitude issues on the team. For all we know, Marvin did exactly what he said he was going to do, get rid of some of the "me-first" guys. If he really wanted to, Willie could have taken the new deal they offered him Friday. Instead, he felt like he should still be paid like a starter even though he isn't anymore.


Good enough?

[Spinylumpsucker]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='693996' date='Sep 1 2008, 10:08 AM']Think about it... as a couple of people have referred to, Willie wasn't exactly the "leader" everyone thought and
Rudi was a negative energy on the team too. We all know what Chad has done and then there is still Henry.
Is there anyone else in that locker room that isn't helping but hurting? Is Shirley a Henry waiting to happen?

We shall see... I hope and pray that I'm wrong, because I want to see a championship team in Cincinnati just like we all do,
but our track record doesn't bode well for that... does it?[/quote]


On the bright side the number of shitheads has been significantly reduced. Yes the team brought Henry back, they drafted Shirley, and they still have Rucker. Henry is likely on his last chance. We'll have to see what he does. Shirley was a fifth round pick. At that point in the draft, I don't blame any team for taking a flier on a player of his talent. So far the kid is doing OK. Rucker has done a lot recently to change his image for the better. He has been involved in almost every team philanthropy and he even befriended and gave his time to a dying kid and his family. He has stayed in Cincy to work closely with the training staff to get him in better shape and to stay away from his distractions back home. Knowing that, I am hopeful for Rucker.

Also, the team has a lot of high character players who should step up as leaders on and off the field. Palmer is the face of the franchise and he gives back a lot to both OH and CA communities. Whitworth took charge and rallied many of his fellow LSU players to help those affected by Katrina. It has been mentioned that he has taken it upon himself to be a vocal leader on the Bengals. Peko risked injury pulling an elderly man from an overturned car a year ago. He has become one of the leaders on the DL and recently hosted a party for the team. There is also Utecht, Kelly, Hall, Dhani, JT, Williams, Odom, Duke, and even Chad and TJ give of themselves and work hard on and off the field.

I think the team has learned their lesson to an extent in terms of drafting character. It is folly to use a pick in the first 3 rounds on any player with character issues. Even using a 4th round pick on one is iffy. Even if the team takes a flier on another Shirley late on day two, they should be fine as long as most of the other picks are high character players.

[USN Bengal]

To answer both 1181 and SLS together... I'm hoping that what we've just seen is Marvin sweeping the locker room out clean.

I'm hoping that the rest of the players in the locker room can deal with/eradicate any bad apples that come along. I'm not holding
my breath, because my forty years of being a Bengals fans has taught me NOT to, but I will continue to have hope.

If I didn't, how the hell could I be a Bengals fan after all?

I also appreciate the debate and no one lowering themself down to name calling... although I AM an asshole,
I like to pretend that I'm NOT sometimes...



Spinlylumpsucker... you still in the Bering Sea? Fisherman, Coastie, Navy, or Deadliest Catch castmember?

[Cricket]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='694020' date='Sep 1 2008, 12:11 PM']..I also appreciate the debate and no one lowering themself down to name calling... although I AM an asshole,
I like to pretend that I'm NOT sometimes...[/quote]

...just blame it on a bad leg.

















...hi, Mully

[JC]

[quote]The Bengals voted for their five team captains on Monday, they are T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Dexter Jackson, Dhani Jones, Carson Palmer and Bobbie Williams.

Also, DE Eric Henderson, a second-year player from Georgia Tech, was added to the practice squad. The Bengals now have seven players on the practice squad and permitted nine, including international practice squad player Carl-Johan Bjork.[/quote]


Per Trent.

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='Cricket' post='694033' date='Sep 1 2008, 01:08 PM']...just blame it on a bad leg.



...hi, Mully

[/quote]



You're just wrong Cricket...

[globetrotter]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='694049' date='Sep 1 2008, 01:04 PM']

You're just wrong Cricket...[/quote]


Any idea what Harris and Davis's contracts are like?

[Bengals1181]

a draft profile of Harris:

[quote]Position: Defensive Tackle
School: Miami (FL)

Status: Senior

Height: 6-4

Weight: 302

40-Yard Dash: 5.20 (EST)

Positives:

[b]He is your prototypical defensive tackle that can stop the run and get after the quarterback.[/b] Orien has all the potential in the world and for the most part he has lived up to the hype. He is a very unselfish player that does whatever is asked of him. Though his stats don't show it, he is a great pass rusher.
Negatives:

Orien has the size you look for, but doesn't take on blockers very well. He has no trouble at getting in the backfield, but rarely produces any sacks.[b] He needs to polish his defensive moves as well.[/b]
Overview:

Orien Harris has all the potential in the world, and I think he will be a great defensive tackle. Has a nose for the ball and is constantly causing havoc in the backfield. He will make an impact on any team right away and is my sleeper pick. Watch out for this kid. He could be one of the best at his position in a couple years.

[b]NFL Comparison: A young Warren Sapp[/b][/quote]

[url="http://football.about.com/od/nationalfootballleague/p/orienharris.htm"]http://football.about.com/od/nationalfootb...orienharris.htm[/url]

[Bengals1181]

[quote]Could Orien Harris be a steal?
by Kirkendall on Sep 1, 2008 11:52 AM EDT in Analysis

After the weekend, the Bengals roster is set. The roster you see today, is the roster that the Bengals figure will give them the best chance to win in 2008. Moves went down that we didn't agree with. In the poll attached to the related piece, 84% of 339 votes agreed that cutting Anderson does not help this football team. It's not that our old right tackle projected as the Willie Anderson of early 2000. However, most of us figured that Willie would contribute into the team's depth chart. You could apply the same with Deltha O'Neal, or a linebacker or two.

Either way, none of that matters. This is your 2008 Bengals. Are you happy? I like that the Bengals kept Jordan Palmer over Jeff Rowe -- and that's purely a sympathetic, good-story type of reason; nothing to do with the field. And if you don't like it, ask yourself this. If the Bengals have to go to their third quarterback, does it really matter who it is? Sure, there's a fantasy that could be applied that some third-string quarterback rises above impossible odds and takes the team to the Super Bowl. But let's be honest, there's a reason why they're third-string quarterbacks.

I'm not sure what the difference is between Orien Harris and Michael Myers, other than Myers being a 32-year old senior citizen, while Harris is a 25-year old pup from Miami that recorded 11 sacks, and 159 tackles in his Hurricane career. Oh, and Myers was scheduled to make $830,000 while Harris looks to make below $400,000.

Here's Harris' Miami Hurricanes biography page.

[quote]CAREER: One of the premier defensive tackles in college football and potentially one of the most dominating players in the country...Has been a stalwart in the middle for Miami the last two seasons...Tough, durable and athletic...Annually among the team's leaders in tackles...Has shown versatility as a pass rusher or a run stopper...In three seasons, has started 22 of 36 games played, recording 130 tackles, 21 tackles for loss, 6.5 sacks and one fumble recovery...Moved into the playing rotation as a redshirt freshman in 2002 following a seasonending injury to Santonio Thomas, then took over as a starter in 2003...Criminology major.

2004 (JUNIOR): Started all 12 games at defensive tackle...Voted the team's Defensive Lineman of the Year as a junior...Ranked second among the defensive linemen with 55 tackles (16 solo), adding 12 tackles for loss, 14 QB pressures and 1.5 sacks...Voted honorable mention All-ACC and selected firstteam All-ACC by Rivals.com...Made 2 tackles and 3 QB pressures in the season opener vs. Florida State...Registered 1 tackle and 2 QB pressures vs. Louisiana Tech...Made 5 tackles, 1 tackle for loss and 3 QB pressures at Houston...Notched 4 tackles and 2 QB pressures at Georgia Tech...Made season-high 9 tackles and 1 tackle for loss vs. Louisville...Tallied 3 tackles and 1 tackle for loss at NC State...Recorded 7 tackles, including 3 tackles for loss at North Carolina...Against Clemson, made 5 tackles, including 1 tackle for loss. Got his first sack of the season...Recorded 4 tackles at Virginia...Made 2 tackles and 1 tackle for loss vs. Wake Forest...Posted 8 tackles, 1 tackle for loss and 2 QB pressures vs. Virginia Tech...In the Peach Bowl vs. Florida, made 5 tackles (3 solo), including 3 tackles for loss and 1 QB pressure.

2003 (SOPHOMORE): Started 10 of 11 games in which he played...recorded 39 tackles (14 solo), eight tackles for loss (34 yards), four sacks (23 yards) and 18 quarterback hurries, ranking second on team...made four tackles in the season opener at Louisiana Tech...registered a career-high eight tackles (three solo), one tackle for a loss, and one sack against Florida...had seven tackles (one solo) and 1.5 tackles for a loss versus East Carolina...six assists versus East Carolina set a career-high...third in tackles against ECU with 1.5 TFLs (five yards) and one quarterback hurry...recorded four tackles and two quarterback hurries at Boston College...had three tackles and one sack (seven yards) against West Virginia...made five tackles, including two tackles for loss (10 yards) and one sack (eight yards) in UM's 22-14 win at Florida State...two tackles and one TFL against Temple...registered one tackle before leaving the game with an injured knee after being rolled up from behind at Virginia Tech...had arthroscopic surgery on the knee the following week and missed the next two games (Tennessee, Syracuse)...returned against Rutgers to record two quarterback hurries...made three tackles (one solo), 1.5 tackles for loss (eight yards) and one sack (six yards) at Pittsburgh...made one assist in the FedEx Orange Bowl Classic victory over Florida State...left the game with an elbow injury.

2002 (FRESHMAN): Became one of the team's most productive defensive linemen as the season progressed...made 36 tackles (14 solos), one sack, one tackle for a loss, 14 quarterback hurries and a fumble recovery...made two tackles against Virginia Tech...had two stops in the win at Syracuse...had four tackles, including a season-high three solo stops, and a sack at Tennessee...had two tackles at Rutgers...had seven tackles, including two solos, and recovered a fumble against West Virginia...recorded two tackles (one solo) in the game against Boston College...played in Miami's win at Florida, but did not register a tackle...saw his first game action as a Hurricane in the season opener against Florida A&M and made one tackle.

2001 (REDSHIRT): Sat out the 2001 season with a redshirt and played on the Hurricanes' scout team.[/quote]
Harris came into the league after the Pittsburgh Steelers drafted him in the fourth round, then moving to Cleveland, back to Pittsburgh, then New Orleans. The word that best characterizes Harris is "potential" -- which is an upgrade over what we knew of Myers. While a decent contributor, his ceiling passed him long ago.

Before waiving him, Saints head coach Sean Payton said of Harris, "He's been one of those guys that's been durable. He's been steady. He's a try-hard guy that gives a lot of effort on each play. So he's caught the attention of a lot of us, the guys on defense and myself included. He comes to work every day, and he showed that last week in the game."

This very much could be a David Jones type of acquisition; claimed off the waiver wire, eventually making the 53-man squad. Ironically, Jones (2007 fifth-round pick) was claimed from New Orleans also. David liked Harris when the defensive tackle came out in 2006, and thinks highly of his abilities translating well with the Bengals.
[/quote]


[url="http://www.cincyjungle.com/2008/9/1/605404/could-orien-harris-be-a-st"]http://www.cincyjungle.com/2008/9/1/605404...-harris-be-a-st[/url]

[Bengals1181]

[quote]Scouting Report: Frank Davis
by Tom Kowalski
Saturday July 19, 2008, 12:00 AM
FRANK DAVIS

2008 Scouting Report

The first-ever Panamanian to earn a roster spot in the NFL (in 2006) is already at the crossroads of his young career. During his rookie season, he started three games at the end of the year (at left guard) and played well enough for the coaches to believe he was a keeper.

Davis, though, suffered a knee injury in preseason last year and was placed on the injured reserve list. At 6-4 and 325 pounds, Davis is very athletic and strong, but he's raw and missed a lot of valuable development time.


Coming into this season, he'll be facing a lot of competition. Stephen Peterman has the edge to win the starting right guard spot, but that's not etched in stone. Landing a backup gig won't be easy either because the Lions brought in veteran Corey Hulsey and still have last year's fourth-round pick Manny Ramirez.

Davis can help himself a great deal if he can also learn the backup center position. There isn't much versatility with Detroit's current crop of guards and Davis needs to give himself an edge.

If Davis can pick up where he left off in 2006 - and pick up the new zone-blocking schemes that require more athleticism - he'll be right in the mix at decision-making time. Unlike the other offensive line positions, there could be a fine line at right guard between the starter and the guy who gets cut. That's how brutal the numbers game can be in the NFL.[/quote]

[url="http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2008/07/scouting_report_frank_davis.html"]http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2008/...rank_davis.html[/url]

[Bengals1181]

from his bengal profile:

[quote]Played in 11 games with three starts in 2006, after making the Lions roster as a college free agent. He was on the Reserve/Injured list last season, due to a knee injury suffered in preseason, but he came back this year to play in all four Lions preseason games, with two starts at LG.[/quote]


so he can play RT, RG, and I guess MAYBE LG?

[-GoBengals-]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='693958' date='Sep 1 2008, 09:26 AM']You always do this Go, and I think your blind homerism is funny.

It doesn't matter if they changed the rules or not, the fact is that we have done a shitty job taking chances on pieces pf shit.

Why?

Mike Brown the redeemer? Trying to close the gap between our talent base and the rest of the league?

It doesn't matter, and yes Go... if we and the Chargers need to use better judgement and/or get a bigger scouting department to make sure we find out about the knuckleheads.. it needs to happen.

The real joke are those people who don't want to admit it is a major problem, especially for us. The biggest problem are the kids still coming up through the system that are hoping to get to the NFL. If they see that you can be a total fuck up and STILL get to play because you have talent, the NFL's problem will never end.

Go ahead and belittle the problem... it sure as hell won't change it.


cwing - I only address the Bengals because they are my team... yes it is a league-wide problem.[/quote]


you have no idea what your talking about... at all.. if character isnt a factor, which it wasnt, marvin won a superbowl with some super thugs in baltimore. we wouls have never been without slim and never without thurman, MAYBE 4 games total between them lost.. HUGE different..

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='GoBengals' post='694199' date='Sep 1 2008, 08:21 PM']you have no idea what your talking about... at all.. if character isnt a factor, which it wasnt, marvin won a superbowl with some super thugs in baltimore. we wouls have never been without slim and never without thurman, MAYBE 4 games total between them lost.. HUGE different..[/quote]
That's just it Go... 2000 was eight years ago and the changes that have come didn't happen overnight. There has been a call for the NFL to clean up ther act since about 2000... when the rats made being a thug the way to go.
You say I have no idea what I'm talking about, but I say you have no realistic viewpoint of what they should've seen coming.
If the Bengals and you couldn't see that this shit was destined to happen, and soon, then they/you were blind by choice.
Think it really would've been such a huge difference?
I don't, because 2006 our big problem was stopping the run AND giving up big pass plays. Thurman was consistently out of position and who is to say he would've improved? His drug & alcohol problems could've very well stunted any growth he might've had. Same with Henry, his immaturity could've very well prevented him from improving from season to season.

It's all conjecture on your part as well as on mine, with the exception of being able to forecast that this shit was going to happen.

I may very well have no idea what I'm talking about, but just the same... neither do you.

[-GoBengals-]

[quote name='USN Bengal' post='694208' date='Sep 1 2008, 08:45 PM']That's just it Go... 2000 was eight years ago and the changes that have come didn't happen overnight. There has been a call for the NFL to clean up ther act since about 2000... when the rats made being a thug the way to go.
You say I have no idea what I'm talking about, but I say you have no realistic viewpoint of what they should've seen coming.
If the Bengals and you couldn't see that this shit was destined to happen, and soon, then they/you were blind by choice.
Think it really would've been such a huge difference?
I don't, because 2006 our big problem was stopping the run AND giving up big pass plays. Thurman was consistently out of position and who is to say he would've improved? His drug & alcohol problems could've very well stunted any growth he might've had. Same with Henry, his immaturity could've very well prevented him from improving from season to season.

It's all conjecture on your part as well as on mine, with the exception of being able to forecast that this shit was going to happen.

I may very well have no idea what I'm talking about, but just the same... neither do you.[/quote]




changes were made by tags from doing absolutely nothing, to doing very little. no one saw the jackhammer, the bengals arent alone, nor are they the biggest violator. ...

[oldschooler]

[quote][b]Lineman in line:[/b] The Browns, Bengals and Patriots were persistently trying to get offensive line help from the waiver wire. The Browns put in claims on six linemen and ended up getting Scott Young from the Eagles. [b]The Bengals put in five claims and got Frank Davis of the Lions[/b]. The Patriots put in claims on three linemen and got Mark LeVoir of the Rams. The most wanted offensive lineman was Andy Alleman of the Saints, a former third-round choice. Seven teams put in claims. Because the Dolphins finished 1-15 last year, they got Alleman. Overall, 32 players had waiver claims, and 22 were awarded to teams.[/quote]



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