Tedy Bruschi on Carson Palmer

[BengalsFanFromNY]

[quote name='BigDawgBengal' timestamp='1284419318' post='918491']
Carson led the team on two game wining drives at the end of the game against Pit and Balt last year. I would say that has to make a statement. Carson is confident in himself. I just think it is the people around him he is not so confident in.
[/quote]


Good QB's put the game away before the last 2 minutes.

Were they great comebacks? YES

Is this how you want your QB to win every game? NO

[BengalsFanFromNY]

[quote name='cincity' timestamp='1284423756' post='918521']
Also the final drive to clinch the AFC North championship against the Chiefs.
[/quote]


Chiefs are terrible! If you can't put away the Chiefs early on then how the hell are we going to do against playoff teams?

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='BengalsFanFromNY' timestamp='1284444376' post='918629']
Chiefs are terrible! If you can't put away the Chiefs early on then how the hell are we going to do against playoff teams?
[/quote]

They beat San Diego last night pretty convincingly...

[oldschooler]

[quote name='BengalsFanFromNY' timestamp='1284444033' post='918627']
[b]Good QB's put the game away before the last 2 minutes.
[/b]
Were they great comebacks? YES

Is this how you want your QB to win every game? NO
[/quote]




I guess you just started watching football yesterday?
A lot of the great QBs win in the last 2 minutes.
Google it and find out. It is true, I tell ya.

And if my QB wins every game, does it really matter how?

[BengalsFanFromNY]

[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1284469183' post='918696']
I guess you just started watching football yesterday?
A lot of the great QBs win in the last 2 minutes.
Google it and find out. It is true, I tell ya.

And if my QB wins every game, does it really matter how?
[/quote]


Yes, alot of great QB's win game in the last 2 minutes but they also win games by putting teams away early on.

[scharm]

Yeah, Carson Palmer should be able to stop the other team from scoring.


Sunday can't get here fast enough.

[bengaled]

[quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1284468502' post='918695']
They beat San Diego last night pretty convincingly...
[/quote]


i too was real impressed with them, and glen dorsey appears to be "getting it" now. he was a monster last night dominating the inside much as he did in college. he and and sedrick ellis are both coming of age and looking worthy of their draft positions. sigh......

[|SF2|]

The great QBs normally put bad teams away in the first 45 minutes.
They also don't normally start off the game slow but rather execute the first 15 scripted plays well.
They also do win their share of the big games late against good to great teams.
They are usually still in the big games late.

Of course the OC has a lot to do with this.

[bengaled]

[quote name='SF2' timestamp='1284481885' post='918773']
The great QBs normally put bad teams away in the first 45 minutes.
They also don't normally start off the game slow but rather execute the first 15 scripted plays well.
They also do win their share of the big games late against good to great teams.
They are usually still in the big games late.

Of course the OC has a lot to do with this.
[/quote]


give up, you'll never win this fight...you're outnumbered.

[scharm]

[quote name='SF2' timestamp='1284481885' post='918773']
The great QBs normally put bad teams away in the first 45 minutes.
They also don't normally start off the game slow but rather execute the first 15 scripted plays well.
They also do win their share of the big games late against good to great teams.
They are usually still in the big games late.

Of course the OC has a lot to do with this.
[/quote]

How many "Great" Qb would you claim have ever played the game in your lifetime?

Because I got to say, it seems very few NFL games on a week to week basis are ever over by the 3rd qtr. I would guess a 14 point lead going into the 4th quarter has been beaten many of times in the NFL.

What's a margin at the end of the 3rd that you would need to have to declare the game over at the end of the 3rd? 7? 10? 14? 17? The first line seems kinda squishy.

[bengaled]

[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1284482421' post='918777']
How many "Great" Qb would you claim have ever played the game in your lifetime?

Because I got to say, it seems very few NFL games on a week to week basis are ever over by the 3rd qtr. I would guess a 14 point lead going into the 4th quarter has been beaten many of times in the NFL.

What's a margin at the end of the 3rd that you would need to have to declare the game over at the end of the 3rd? 7? 10? 14? 17? The first line seems kinda squishy.
[/quote]


like brady did last sunday?

[scharm]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1284481995' post='918774']
give up, you'll never win this fight...you're outnumbered.
[/quote]

It's already lost. It's simple, the conversation went in a direction to take digs at Carson on the basis of being a good QB. Judging by SF's response he went directly to "Great" as the standard.

I would guess that's the direction of all discussions concerning Carson go. Which is very telling and accurate.

Carson's good enough to only not be considered great. I would agree with that.


Unfortunately, Bengalfan from New York attempted to remove Carson Palmer from the "Good" category. My question to you would be. Do you not think Carson is a "GOOD" QB?

If you think he's good, then isn't the original point a loss?

[scharm]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1284482671' post='918779']
like brady did last sunday?
[/quote]

like Carson did against the Bears last season? or Ravens? Like Carson against the Titan in 07?

Carson has those games under is belt. What QB does that for the majority of weeks? Not many I would guess.

[bengaled]

[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1284482817' post='918781']
It's already lost. It's simple, the conversation went in a direction to take digs at Carson on the basis of being a good QB. Judging by SF's response he went directly to "Great" as the standard.

I would guess that's the direction of all discussions concerning Carson go. Which is very telling and accurate.

Carson's good enough to only not be considered great. I would agree with that.


Unfortunately, Bengalfan from New York attempted to remove Carson Palmer from the "Good" category. My question to you would be. Do you not think Carson is a "GOOD" QB?

If you think he's good, then isn't the original point a loss?
[/quote]

yes, carson palmer is a good QB.

[scharm]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1284483299' post='918787']
yes, carson palmer is a good QB.
[/quote]

See that was easy. He's not a "Great" QB, hasn't proven enough.

[bengaled]

[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1284483725' post='918789']
See that was easy. He's not a "Great" QB, hasn't proven enough.
[/quote]


no argument from me.

[|SF2|]

[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1284482421' post='918777']
How many "Great" Qb would you claim have ever played the game in your lifetime?

Because I got to say, it seems very few NFL games on a week to week basis are ever over by the 3rd qtr. I would guess a 14 point lead going into the 4th quarter has been beaten many of times in the NFL.

What's a margin at the end of the 3rd that you would need to have to declare the game over at the end of the 3rd? 7? 10? 14? 17? The first line seems kinda squishy.
[/quote]

The point margin isn't as important as the ability to confidently move the chains. Again, the OC, depending on the team has influence on this. One only needs to have witnessed in person the San Diego debacle a few years ago to understand what I mean. We couldn't get a first down to save our lives much of the 2nd half. Horrible play selection that kept stopping the clock. Guys running out of bounds to avoid a hit?

BTW, I never mentioned Carson or anyone in my original post. A great OC and GM can make an average QB very good and a good one great. People rave about Brady but he has TIME to throw to OPEN receivers year in year out. Thats good drafting/FA selection and good schemes. Brady and Welker are joined at the hip and that is reps and coaching not some magical Tom Brady fairy dust from Michigan. Brady does the most with the good talent around him.

Great teams rarely blow a 14 point lead in the 4th.

Last Sunday I had a flicker of hope at one point (homerism) but honestly nobody thought the Pats would blow that lead and they didn't come close. Every possession, even if they did not score, took huge chunks of time off the clock.

Carson does not have the personel around him or the athletic ability to be a great QB on this current team unless something changes quickly on the offensive line. He isn't Vick and he doesn't have the Patriot's protection.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='SF2' timestamp='1284481885' post='918773']
The great QBs normally put bad teams away in the first 45 minutes.
[b]They also don't normally start off the game slow but rather execute the first 15 scripted plays well.[/b]
They also do win their share of the big games late against good to great teams.
They are usually still in the big games late.

Of course the OC has a lot to do with this.
[/quote]



I hate coming out with scripted plays. For the most part it disregards what the defense may or may not be doing, and you always have to account for that. Sure there's the ability to audible, but even those are set plays.


I think you can come out with a designed tempo, set and scheme, but IMO its a bad idea to come out with certain plays already decided.

[|Numbers|]

Most of the shit he talked about did not come from where he stated. It comes out of some sorta psycho analysis done on multiple QB's from both coasts some time back. Nothing new he is stating and with stuff like this, it could apply to any one of the QB's in the league in a similar situation.

Not sure where to find this analysis anymore but I am sure there are others here that may remember it better than I do.

[claptonrocks]

Maybe Bruschi has some valid points and alot of you are so into the CP apologetic mode as allways that
you dont want to hear it..
Maybe Carson is a jugs gun and nothing more....he hasnt been the same since the injury ..
maybe he never will...

hope Im wrong but it isnt panning out .....great physical tools ...cerebral part of his game....not so good.

[scharm]

[quote name='claptonrocks' timestamp='1284501904' post='918863']
Maybe Bruschi has some valid points and alot of you are so into the CP apologetic mode as allways that
you dont want to hear it..
Maybe Carson is a jugs gun and nothing more....he hasnt been the same since the injury ..
maybe he never will...

hope Im wrong but it isnt panning out .....great physical tools ...cerebral part of his game....not so good.
[/quote]

There's no hoping, you are wrong. The question is and will remain how much of or if Carson is an elite QB.

Not working out? Cerebral? Right.

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

[quote name='BengalsFanFromNY' timestamp='1284444033' post='918627']
Good QB's put the game away before the last 2 minutes.

Were they great comebacks? YES

Is this how you want your QB to win every game? NO
[/quote]


[quote name='claptonrocks' timestamp='1284501904' post='918863']
Maybe Bruschi has some valid points and alot of you are so into the CP apologetic mode as allways that
you dont want to hear it..
Maybe Carson is a jugs gun and nothing more....[b]he hasnt been the same since the injury ..
maybe he never will...[/b]

hope Im wrong but it isnt panning out .....great physical tools ...cerebral part of his game....not so good.
[/quote]

It's posts like this that give message boards a bad name and make me want to bang my head against a rock.

[savagehenry54]

[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1284411513' post='918445']
[b]3. [/b][url="http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=4459"][color="#225fb2"][b]Carson Palmer[/b][/color][/url][b]'s struggles.[/b] With the addition of all the Bengals' offensive weapons, I felt that Carson Palmer would be a better quarterback. When we played Palmer earlier in his career, we were able to confuse him by disguising our coverages. Over the course of a quarterback's career, he'll start to figure things out, but Palmer still hasn't done that. The Patriots showed Palmer one coverage pre-snap and executed a different coverage post-snap, and Palmer looked lost. I read Pete Carroll's book and when Palmer was at USC, he had self-confidence issues. After throwing two interceptions in the spring game, according to the book, he said to Carroll, "It's just so typical. I always play well and then screw it up when it matters most." He is still that same guy. Until he is able to win the big game that makes a statement, and this was one of those games, defensive coordinators will always see him as a quarterback that can be fooled.



[url="http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/columns/story?columnist=bruschi_tedy&id=5567524"]http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/columns/story?columnist=bruschi_tedy&id=5567524[/url]
[/quote]


Hmm, is Bruschi talking about 2004, when in Palmer's first year starting, the soon to be Super Bowl champ Patriots only beat the Bengals...at home, due to a Rudi Johnson fumble inside the five?

It was Palmer's first year starting, how confused had Palmer appeared when Bellicheck came off the field saying "They're tough to stop" as Bill and his at the time top rated defense stole a victory thanks to an unforced error by Rudi?

Bruschi is a jackass who retired cuz he got stiff armed by Ocho in a preseason game. He is a jersey shore dooshbag who played football good....in the 90's and early 2000's. Why does it not surprise me that he found a way to take some shit from Carroll's book out of context and then just flat out lie about the Qb who threw the pass to the "soft" receiver that punked his bitch ass into retirement in a preseason game of all things.

I wonder how the convo with Bellicheck went after that game?

I lend zero credence to this dude's analysis.

He's clearly a half retarded "situation" wannnabe who could not be more irrelevant if he tried.