Carson Palmer not attending player organized workouts

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Bengal Migration' timestamp='1307501906' post='996532']
Put him on ignore. Trust me, you can get through reading the site in half the time if you do
[/quote]


I still enjoy you as a poster too.


I've never had a problem with you, not sure why you all of a sudden have one with me. I'd love to chat about it.

[scharm]

The truth about Carson is Bengal fans and the Organization were so horny to have some success at the QB position after so many failures. He had a GREAT run in a short time and we all rushed to put him in that elite category. Top 3, Top 5 was thrown around all the time.

The reality is he has never validated that status once his surrounding cast of players began to age and turnover. He walked into an established offensive core that probably didn't get enough credit and of course the QB got too much. That core even helped Jon Kitna to his best stat season as a pro QB. It was loaded and experienced.

Since that period the pre pro knocks on Carson have played out. There's not a whole lot of emotion from him. Leadership, I think he has his way but I wouldn't call him the lead barking dog. It seems for years after games there's this standard debate about who's running the right route or throwing the right route? I don't know. Bottomline it has happened alot since the glory days of his pro bowl years. So you got to question can Carson really go into a situation not already set up and improve it? Unfortunately that's the situation we are in today.

Is Carson the best chance to win in 2011? I don't know. Aside from a couple games with Simpson and Caldwell last year there isn't a whole lot of track record for Carson as a pro developing and leading an offense from ground zero. Since he's been a bengal his early success came in an established system with players. Once that started to turnover there is this constant state of being predictable, stale, and just being off.

Then there is the physical tools. They sure as hell look like they've declined if you take 2009 and 2010. He floats balls. His decision making seems to have declined. His accuracy sure as hell looks like it declined.

Carson apologist need to move off this Carson is the savior bullshit. He had good seasons, but the guy stood on the shoulders of an established cast to get the savior title. He has never once validated it once the cast started to change.

At face value I don't know if he's the best chance to win. He had 2 fringe HOF WR, that produced decent numbers. He had a TE that looks to be a stud. His line protected him. They threw the ball and put it in his hands. There were too many negative plays out of the passing game and it was a big reason for 4 wins. To trump it all, he has been in the system for a long time with the same coaches.

[BengalsOwn]

[quote name='bengalbutch' timestamp='1307498017' post='996516']
forgive me but I will think anyone who has ever posted on this board has more football knowledge than you
[/quote]

The fact that you think this team is better off without Carson Palmer as the quarterback makes you, and anyone else, look like a complete idiot, and it's embarrassing to be associated with people like you.

Everyone acts like it's so easy to replace a quarterback. Does anyone not remember what happened between Boomer leaving and Carson Palmer being drafted?

[WRAPradio]

[quote name='scharm' timestamp='1307392572' post='996216']
Yeah Andre Smith. I think media is allowed to attend some sessions. I'd like to get a feel for his condition if possible.
[/quote]

Rumor has it he was down to about 325 which I find hard to believe, but if it's true, that's great.

[scharm]

[quote name='BengalsOwn' timestamp='1307537811' post='996558']
The fact that you think this team is better off without Carson Palmer as the quarterback makes you, and anyone else, look like a complete idiot, and it's embarrassing to be associated with people like you.

Everyone acts like it's so easy to replace a quarterback. Does anyone not remember what happened between Boomer leaving and Carson Palmer being drafted?
[/quote]

The very definition of bungalized. Hold on to mediocre results because of the 90s. Hey, you are absolutely right the QB situation from Boomer until Carson absolutely sucked.

Prior to Carson being drafted the QB situation post Boomer and the former failed draft picks like Akili and Klingler were often mentioned. It was dumb back then to use that criteria to not select Carson back then and it's dumb to use it as fear from moving on from Carson today.

The only relevant facts to Carson Palmer is what he was recently. He is in fact disgruntled and wants a trade. He in fact had a poor season with a very good surrounding cast and a system he was used to.

The only thing that makes him the best chance at winning is memories of 2005. Which is equally dumb as to say we should fear moving on from Carson because they couldn't find a QB in the 90s.

[Khatmandude]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1307502603' post='996536']
I still enjoy you as a poster too.


I've never had a problem with you, not sure why you all of a sudden have one with me. I'd love to chat about it.
[/quote]

You have an abrasive/combative posting style. I can understand why others would want to avoid your posts even if it means not getting to read the majority which are actually fairly decent posts.

That, and you have to get the last word EACH AND EVERY TIME (argument/discussion). Relentless in this pursuit.

Anyways, hope that answers why some may choose to ignore you.

And yes, I can speak for others as I am the People's Champ (tm) and bengalbutch and BengalMigration are my people.

[scharm]

[quote name='WRAPradio' timestamp='1307543454' post='996568']
Rumor has it he was down to about 325 which I find hard to believe, but if it's true, that's great.
[/quote]

That would be sweet.

[|Lucid|]

Last I heard, Andre was still recovering from foot surgery, and would not be participating in these "mini camps".

[Khatmandude]

[quote name='BengalsOwn' timestamp='1307537811' post='996558']
The fact that you think this team is better off without Carson Palmer as the quarterback makes you, and anyone else, look like a complete idiot, and it's embarrassing to be associated with people like you.

Everyone acts like it's so easy to replace a quarterback. Does anyone not remember what happened between Boomer leaving and Carson Palmer being drafted?
[/quote]

So let me get this straight........you think a QB who ranks in the bottom 7 in key QB categories from 2008 - 2011 is irreplaceable?

There certainly is someone looking like a complete idiot........but its not bengalbutch.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='IKOTA' timestamp='1307543546' post='996570']
You have an abrasive/combative posting style. I can understand why others would want to avoid your posts even if it means not getting to read the majority which are actually fairly decent posts.

That, and you have to get the last word EACH AND EVERY TIME (argument/discussion). Relentless in this pursuit.

Anyways, hope that answers why some may choose to ignore you.

And yes, I can speak for others as I am the People's Champ (tm) and bengalbutch and BengalMigration are my people.
[/quote]


I can be abrasive at times, yes. Rarely unprovoked, or commenting on something completely outlandish. I also think some infer "abrasiveness" in posts where there is none. Something I've been guilty of doing to others as well. Tough to tell tone on the internet.

As for getting the last word, I've walked away from more arguments on this site than you can ever imagine. Most arguments get boring pretty quick. Last night is a good example. After being told to "go screw myself" among other things, did I strike back? No. All because I made a sarcastic post about a pretty silly comment.


If there's one thing I've learned, especially on this site, is that you take everything with a grain of salt. I GUARANTEE every single poster on this site with more than 10,000 posts has other posters who has issues with them. It's just reality. When you post a lot you increase your chances of rubbing someone the wrong way.

As for Bengalbutch and Bengal Migration, I've never had a problem with either, the latter of which I actually considered a friend, as far as the internet goes (and the only person on this site I've met in person).

If they have issues with me, so be it. I'd love to chat with them about it. But I don't have issues with them.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='WRAPradio' timestamp='1307543454' post='996568']
Rumor has it he was down to about 325 which I find hard to believe, but if it's true, that's great.
[/quote]


that would be great. Where'd you hear that?

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='BengalsOwn' timestamp='1307537811' post='996558']
The fact that you think this team is better off without Carson Palmer as the quarterback makes you, and anyone else, look like a complete idiot, and it's embarrassing to be associated with people like you.

Everyone acts like it's so easy to replace a quarterback. Does anyone not remember what happened between Boomer leaving and Carson Palmer being drafted?
[/quote]


I get the feeling if Carson does leave and Dalton takes over were going to be talking about if we should go after Luck or if its just a case of a rookie playing like a rookie next offseason.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Jamie_B' timestamp='1307546487' post='996581']
I get the feeling if Carson does leave and Dalton takes over were going to be talking about if we should go after Luck or if its just a case of a rookie playing like a rookie next offseason.
[/quote]


makes signing Benson even more important. I'd also think Gruden is creative enough that he'll protect Dalton as much as he can with high percentage throws and a power running game.

[|kennethmw|]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1307544448' post='996574']
I can be abrasive at times, yes. Rarely unprovoked, or commenting on something completely outlandish. I also think some infer "abrasiveness" in posts where there is none. Something I've been guilty of doing to others as well. Tough to tell tone on the internet.

As for getting the last word, I've walked away from more arguments on this site than you can ever imagine. Most arguments get boring pretty quick. Last night is a good example. After being told to "go screw myself" among other things, did I strike back? No. All because I made a sarcastic post about a pretty silly comment.


If there's one thing I've learned, especially on this site, is that you take everything with a grain of salt. [b]I GUARANTEE every single poster on this site with more than 10,000 posts has other posters who has issues with them. [/b] It's just reality. When you post a lot you increase your chances of rubbing someone the wrong way.

As for Bengalbutch and Bengal Migration, I've never had a problem with either, the latter of which I actually considered a friend, as far as the internet goes (and the only person on this site I've met in person).

If they have issues with me, so be it. I'd love to chat with them about it. But I don't have issues with them.
[/quote]

Shit, I bet it's 50 posts.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1307547048' post='996585']
Shit, I bet it's 50 posts.
[/quote]

[Tigris]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1307544448' post='996574']
I can be abrasive at times, yes. Rarely unprovoked, or commenting on something completely outlandish. I also think some infer "abrasiveness" in posts where there is none. Something I've been guilty of doing to others as well. Tough to tell tone on the internet.

As for getting the last word, I've walked away from more arguments on this site than you can ever imagine. Most arguments get boring pretty quick. Last night is a good example. After being told to "go screw myself" among other things, did I strike back? No. All because I made a sarcastic post about a pretty silly comment.


If there's one thing I've learned, especially on this site, is that you take everything with a grain of salt. I GUARANTEE every single poster on this site with more than 10,000 posts has other posters who has issues with them. It's just reality. When you post a lot you increase your chances of rubbing someone the wrong way.

As for Bengalbutch and Bengal Migration, I've never had a problem with either, the latter of which I actually considered a friend, as far as the internet goes (and the only person on this site I've met in person).

If they have issues with me, so be it. I'd love to chat with them about it. But I don't have issues with them.
[/quote]
I agree with Ikota, and I disagree with your "unprovoked" stance.

Twice in the past few weeks you've called me an "internet tough guy" and "idiot" or something along those lines. Then I noticed the other day you told a poster that he "cries a lot" - that's all your response read. While the poster may be replying to one of your posts (I don't really know), I definitely was not directing a word towards you until you decided to be rude and I replied to your intitial attack. Even if someone is in the wrong, instead of wording it kindly, you just name call.

I'm not going to put you on ignore or anything, but I understand why others would.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1307547402' post='996587']
[b]I agree with Ikota, and I disagree with your "unprovoked" stance.[/b]

Twice in the past few weeks you've called me an "internet tough guy" and "idiot" or something along those lines. Then I noticed the other day you told a poster that he "cries a lot" - that's all your response read. While the poster may be replying to one of your posts (I don't really know), I definitely was not directing a word towards you until you decided to be rude and I replied to your intitial attack. Even if someone is in the wrong, instead of wording it kindly, you just name call.

I'm not going to put you on ignore or anything, but I understand why others would.
[/quote]


hence the "or commenting on something completely outlandish". I suggest you re-read what you posted.


As for the other example, that would be under the "provoked" category. And outlandish for that matter.


If someone says something stupid, I'll comment on it, just as anyone here would. That's different than attacking someone's opinion just because you don't agree with it.

[|kennethmw|]

[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1307547402' post='996587']
I agree with Ikota, and I disagree with your "unprovoked" stance.

Twice in the past few weeks you've called me an "internet tough guy" and "idiot" or something along those lines. Then I noticed the other day you told a poster that he "cries a lot" - that's all your response read. While the poster may be replying to one of your posts (I don't really know), I definitely was not directing a word towards you until you decided to be rude and I replied to your intitial attack. Even if someone is in the wrong, instead of wording it kindly, you just name call.

I'm not going to put you on ignore or anything, but I understand why others would.
[/quote]

Tigris, I would imagine we all have those kind of posts in our history. 1181, is no better nor any worse than anyone else on here. We all have opinions, and like assholes, they all ocasionally stink. I know that I have vehemently disagreed with posters on this site, on one opinion, and vehemently agreed with that same poster on another, often the same day. You might notice 1181 more, but only because he posts more.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1307548342' post='996594']
Tigris, I would imagine we all have those kind of posts in our history. 1181, is no better nor any worse than anyone else on here. We all have opinions, and like assholes, they all ocasionally stink. I know that I have vehemently disagreed with posters on this site, on one opinion, and vehemently agreed with that same poster on another, often the same day. You might notice 1181 more, but only because he posts more.
[/quote]


+1

you and I have chatted about this exact thing. Each conversation stands on its own, and its silly holding a grudge from one conversation to the next.

There's posters on this board that agree about most everything in the Bengals forums, but are at each others' throats in the politics section.

[Tigris]

It's not that one disagrees or agrees, it's that when you don't agree, you're called a name or you're labeled as something negative (and I know it's not just 1181, I've read tons of stuff on here, I just know that 1181 has directed his negative comments towards me a couple times). Personally, it's not something I dwell on and I know my chances of actually "real life friending" the people here are slim, but it's still something you don't want to read especially when you're trying to debate in a civil manner.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Tigris' timestamp='1307551765' post='996598']
It's not that one disagrees or agrees, it's that when you don't agree, you're called a name or you're labeled as something negative (and I know it's not just 1181, I've read tons of stuff on here, I just know that 1181 has directed his negative comments towards me a couple times). Personally, it's not something I dwell on and I know my chances of actually "real life friending" the people here are slim, but it's still something you don't want to read especially when you're trying to debate in a civil manner.
[/quote]


I stand by the comment (internet tough guy was accurate in that case), but if it offended you I apologize.

[Tigris]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1307547788' post='996589']
hence the "or commenting on something completely outlandish". I suggest you re-read what you posted.


As for the other example, that would be under the "provoked" category. And outlandish for that matter.


If someone says something stupid, I'll comment on it, just as anyone here would. That's different than attacking someone's opinion just because you don't agree with it.
[/quote]
I know what I posted. I posted Carson was a complete bitch for taking orders from his wife and that I think that he has to grow a pair of balls. You then called me an internet tough guy. I don't need reminded.

And I provoked you for saying that this was an internet message board and tons of non-politically correct posts and slurs get thrown around without second thought and one shouldn't be bothered by it? If the post made about being retarded was directed solely at the poster when the sensitivity was already known, then fine, he has a right to complain, but it wasn't. You can't expect hundreds of people to know exactly what has happened in each individual's lives in terms of saying something that may offend them.

When multiple have complaints about one person, that one person usually has a problem.

[JC]

Everyone just needs to take a step back and think WWSD?

What would Sois do?

[|Lucid|]

In my estimation "stupid" is often times in the eye of the beholder. It's often the case that those with an esteemed opinion of their own opinion tend to be struck with the "stupidity" of dissenting opinions.

It's also my observation that rational mature debate becomes all but impossible once the line between idea and the thinker has been crossed and the attacks become personally targeted to the individual rather than the idea.

Sometimes it may seem entirely appropriate to verbally smack an "idiot", but the question should be addressed... Is it worth it? What is the value here, and what is the cost?

Keep in mind, that I am guilty as well.. That doesn't mean I think it's a good thing.

[Khatmandude]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1307547788' post='996589']
hence the "or commenting on something completely outlandish". I suggest you re-read what you posted.


As for the other example, that would be under the "provoked" category. And outlandish for that matter.


If someone says something stupid, I'll comment on it, just as anyone here would. That's different than attacking someone's opinion just because you don't agree with it.
[/quote]

My purpose (and I would imagine Tigris's purpose also as I know him) in telling you why someone puts you on ignore was so that you could recognize the reasons and hopefully limit the abrasiveness. Often, its very difficult to "self criticize" as its rarely done in an honest manner so that's why I chimed in ........ it was none of my business really but felt the need to reply.

Unfortunately, in trying to defend yourself, you came off combative once again when you replied:
[quote]I suggest you re-read what you posted.[/quote]

Do you see how?

Anyways, I've thought about putting you on ignore but have never actually done it because, like I said, you bring value to this board and your posts are more often than not, filled with substance. Substance is good. But it's the confrontational style that turns me off just as it seems to have turned others off.

And what Kenneth says is also valid.......you're more "visible" as you post often. But with that, comes a responsibility to not "bully" others as the board will suffer from this.

I think the biggest thing I try to keep in mind when posting is that I will post only what I would say to you to your face......otherwise I'm being fake and allow myself leeway to be a dick. I don't want that although I would say it happens at times as I am human......barely.

Hope this helps.