happyrid Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Sigh, Dumervil now in our division. I just don't get how these teams with cap problems still manage to sign people like him, while we re-sign our own and stay with the status quo instead of targeting key areas and trying to get better there over what we have. I hate that Dumervil is in the division also and think it was a great signing. But let's not get too overboard. They had to let Paul Kruger walk in free agency and Dumervil is just a cheaper replacement at the same position. It would be the same thing as if the Bengals let Andre walk and then signed Eric Winston. Not necessarily a bad move, but not targeting key areas for improvement either. The Ravens backloaded the Flacco deal with a first year cap hit of under ten million and let 8 or 9 starters walk in free agency. It is only due to those two things that they have some money to go looking for bargains in the second and third week of FA. Still an impressive move by Ozzie though. Since he was cut, he doesn't count in figuring comp picks. So the Ravens will get a 3rd round comp pick next year for Kruger and got Dumervil for 15 million less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akiliMVP Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 I hate that Dumervil is in the division also and think it was a great signing. But let's not get too overboard. They had to let Paul Kruger walk in free agency and Dumervil is just a cheaper replacement at the same position. It would be the same thing as if the Bengals let Andre walk and then signed Eric Winston. Not necessarily a bad move, but not targeting key areas for improvement either. The Ravens backloaded the Flacco deal with a first year cap hit of under ten million and let 8 or 9 starters walk in free agency. It is only due to those two things that they have some money to go looking for bargains in the second and third week of FA. Still an impressive move by Ozzie though. Since he was cut, he doesn't count in figuring comp picks. So the Ravens will get a 3rd round comp pick next year for Kruger and got Dumervil for 15 million less. This just illustrates further how fucking stupid the Browns are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zins30 Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 I hate that Dumervil is in the division also and think it was a great signing. But let's not get too overboard. They had to let Paul Kruger walk in free agency and Dumervil is just a cheaper replacement at the same position. It would be the same thing as if the Bengals let Andre walk and then signed Eric Winston. Not necessarily a bad move, but not targeting key areas for improvement either. The Ravens backloaded the Flacco deal with a first year cap hit of under ten million and let 8 or 9 starters walk in free agency. It is only due to those two things that they have some money to go looking for bargains in the second and third week of FA. Still an impressive move by Ozzie though. Since he was cut, he doesn't count in figuring comp picks. So the Ravens will get a 3rd round comp pick next year for Kruger and got Dumervil for 15 million less. And I think Dumervil is not a downgrade to Kruger, probably an upgrade other than maybe age (2 years) . They got a bargain for sure, especially at about $7M /per, which is less than what Kruger signed for. Going back to a 3-4 could be a nice change for him too. Scary move really... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyrid Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 And I think Dumervil is not a downgrade to Kruger, probably an upgrade other than maybe age (2 years) . They got a bargain for sure, especially at about $7M /per, which is less than what Kruger signed for. Going back to a 3-4 could be a nice change for him too. Scary move really... Yeah, it could be even better as it actually sounds like the $7M per year is only if he hits a bunch of incentives. His deal is actually just a little over 5 million per year, which seems like a huge bargain for a pass rusher as good as he is. And they are going to be loaded with mid round compensatory picks next year. They aren't going anywhere. Pittsburgh on the other hand...they could be in for a stretch of down years if they don't start knocking these next few drafts out of the park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 I hate that Dumervil is in the division also and think it was a great signing. But let's not get too overboard. They had to let Paul Kruger walk in free agency and Dumervil is just a cheaper replacement at the same position. It would be the same thing as if the Bengals let Andre walk and then signed Eric Winston. Not necessarily a bad move, but not targeting key areas for improvement either. The Ravens backloaded the Flacco deal with a first year cap hit of under ten million and let 8 or 9 starters walk in free agency. It is only due to those two things that they have some money to go looking for bargains in the second and third week of FA. Still an impressive move by Ozzie though. Since he was cut, he doesn't count in figuring comp picks. So the Ravens will get a 3rd round comp pick next year for Kruger and got Dumervil for 15 million less. Dumervil is a much better player than Kruger, both last year and over his career. Kruger only became a starter last year, when Jarrett Johnson left for San Diego in free agency. The Ravens have upgraded their other pass rushing OLB spot opposite Suggs at a fairly cheap price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scharm Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 This just illustrates further how fucking stupid the Browns are Yeah that's the ultimate punchline. Although the Ravens kinda lucked out with Dumerville being available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scharm Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Sigh, Dumervil now in our division. I just don't get how these teams with cap problems still manage to sign people like him, while we re-sign our own and stay with the status quo instead of targeting key areas and trying to get better there over what we have. there is no one right or wrong way to do it. Just isn't. The bengals haven't gotten it done like the Ravens and thus your point of view is understandable. The demise of the Ravens is greatly overstated. Sure they may be down next year but long term? Don't know. I'd like to think the Bengals are doing it a right way as well, but you have to invest a little more faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zins30 Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 The only good news with the Dumervil deal is if his $7M salary helps out with MJ's long term deal. Dumerville is no longer getting his $12M or even his $8M salary from Denver...hopefully this lowers the number for MJ's deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted March 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 The only good news with the Dumervil deal is if his $7M salary helps out with MJ's long term deal. Dumerville is no longer getting his $12M or even his $8M salary from Denver...hopefully this lowers the number for MJ's deal. hmm I wonder how that works. That lowers the franchise tag amount for DE's, but since MJ had already signed his contract it may be set in stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 hmm I wonder how that works. That lowers the franchise tag amount for DE's, but since MJ had already signed his contract it may be set in stone. I doubt it will have any impact on MJ's franchise tender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted March 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 I doubt it will have any impact on MJ's franchise tender. doubt it, since he's signed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaydenM Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Sigh, Dumervil now in our division. I just don't get how these teams with cap problems still manage to sign people like him, while we re-sign our own and stay with the status quo instead of targeting key areas and trying to get better there over what we have. Are you serious? Have you been paying attention to how many players the ravens had to get rid of or let go to sign Dumervil? Would you be happy if the bengals did something similar and got rid of Whitworth, Michael Johnson, Reggie Nelson, Vontaze Burfict, Leon Hall, Andre Smith, and AJ Green in order to sign a guy like Dumervil? Always amazes me how people always talk about other teams signing big name free agents but fail to mention he big name free agents that same team loses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyrid Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 hmm I wonder how that works. That lowers the franchise tag amount for DE's, but since MJ had already signed his contract it may be set in stone. The amount is determined as of the first day of the new league year. Which was March 4th or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaydenM Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 I doubt it will have any impact on MJ's franchise tender. Franchise tag numbers have already been set Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Are you serious? Have you been paying attention to how many players the ravens had to get rid of or let go to sign Dumervil? Would you be happy if the bengals did something similar and got rid of Whitworth, Michael Johnson, Reggie Nelson, Vontaze Burfict, Leon Hall, Andre Smith, and AJ Green in order to sign a guy like Dumervil?Always amazes me how people always talk about other teams signing big name free agents but fail to mention he big name free agents that same team loses. What are you talking about? Go read the AFCN thread, a number of people have commented on how many guys the Ravens lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValleyBengal Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Are you serious? Have you been paying attention to how many players the ravens had to get rid of or let go to sign Dumervil? Would you be happy if the bengals did something similar and got rid of Whitworth, Michael Johnson, Reggie Nelson, Vontaze Burfict, Leon Hall, Andre Smith, and AJ Green in order to sign a guy like Dumervil? Always amazes me how people always talk about other teams signing big name free agents but fail to mention he big name free agents that same team loses. Not a fair comparison. The people the ravens lost are hardly in the league of a Whitworth, Hall or AJ Green. And Dumervil is an upgrade over Kruger in my book. I'd not bitch about losing Reggie Nelson if it would have meant to bring in Dashom Goldson. And the Ravens won two Superbowls. I wouldn't bitch about a post Superbowl win salary dump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValleyBengal Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Plus we resigned Quinn,Tate and Roland. I'd rather get rid of those gap fillers and improve at least our depth. There are always those who believe that keeping your own is better - my argument is you can never get better if you don't improve your talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Not a fair comparison. The people the ravens lost are hardly in the league of a Whitworth, Hall or AJ Green. And Dumervil is an upgrade over Kruger in my book. I'd not bitch about losing Reggie Nelson if it would have meant to bring in Dashom Goldson. And the Ravens won two Superbowls. I wouldn't bitch about a post Superbowl win salary dump. Those guys were seen by the Ravens to be better than the guys they kept, because they were starting over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcat Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Plus we resigned Quinn,Tate and Roland. I'd rather get rid of those gap fillers and improve at least our depth. There are always those who believe that keeping your own is better - my argument is you can never get better if you don't improve your talent. Getting rid of your depth players by definition decreases your depth. Why not let this get worked out in training camp like usual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyrid Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Plus we resigned Quinn,Tate and Roland. I'd rather get rid of those gap fillers and improve at least our depth. There are always those who believe that keeping your own is better - my argument is you can never get better if you don't improve your talent. I think the opposite argument is that if you basically bring back everyone you want and aren't losing many key guys to retirement, the way you improve is with your 10 draft picks and also through your young guys improving. If you look at LB as an example. Assume they also bring Thomas Howard back. You have Howard, Rey, Vontaze, Lamur, etc. you hope that your young guys like Burfict and Lamur improve in year 2. You also likely add both an early round draft pick and a 5th or 6th rounder. Even though you didn't do anything at all in terms of bringing in outside FAs, you still have a great shot at an improved LB group. The same is likely at WR. We have everyone back. You expect improvement from Sanu and Jones in year 2 and even AJ in year 3. By keeping your own FAs at other positions, you have the opportunity to add another talented WR to the mix with an early draft pick. You could see big improvement without a single outside FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted March 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 The four-year contract will pay $8.25 million Vollmer guaranteed, and it will have a base value of $17 million. Another $9 million will be available in playing-time incentives and roster bonuses, along with a $1 million Pro Bowl bonus. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/25/volmmer-deal-will-have-8-25-million-guaranteed/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cincity Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Well I guess it's about time for Andre to come in... IF!!! and that's a big "IF" they can find his fucking agent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyrid Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 [font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]The four-year contract will pay $8.25 million Vollmer guaranteed, and it will have a base value of $17 million. Another $9 million will be available in playing-time incentives and roster bonuses, along with a $1 million Pro Bowl bonus.[/size][/font] http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/25/volmmer-deal-will-have-8-25-million-guaranteed/ Wow, that is pretty low. $4.25 per year base. Max of $6.75 per year if he hits all incentives and makes the Pro Bowl. This can't help Andres bargaining position at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 That's affordable, poor Andre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cincity Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 What makes it worse, is, the Bengals probably were willing to give him more than where he's kinda slotted now... He's lost on both of his contract negotiating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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