A crazy idea that may not be so crazy

[bengaled]

 

Actually I was thinking of those movies in which a quote goes something like," it's quiet in here."    And the response is automatically,  "Yeah too quiet."

 

 

ahhh, got ya. had a suspicion that might be the case.

 

carry on! :lol:

[bengaled]

Why would he not be on the field as much as possible if the base set was a 2 TE set?

 

 

but we won't always be in a base set, that's the point.

[scharm]

The problem is not in the formation my friends.   The problem is the number of snaps.

 

It has been this way since Gio was taken in the second round.

 

The crux of the problem is not what label you place on a player or the formation.   It's simply generating a unit that moves the chains that creates first downs that occupies the ball.    If that happens you'll work in your weapons in.    If it doesn't we are going to have a bunch of hungry birds to feed in one nest.

[coup000]

I think everyone may need to pump the brakes on Eifert a bit. I think and hope he'll do very well, but for people to be throwing around comments suggesting he'll be harder to cover than AJ is a little much. The defense he is going against every day hasn't exactly been stellar in stopping TEs over the last few years.

[Jamie_B]

 

 

but we won't always be in a base set, that's the point.

 

 

Sorry a misread on Jason's post on my part.

 

Even so I would think he would be on the field if the situation calls for it and not if not, just like anyone else.

 

I'm not sure Marvin is big on relying on rookies to be the focal points of the team unless he absolutely has to. And we aren't in that position like we were in 2011.

[Jamie_B]

I think everyone may need to pump the brakes on Eifert a bit. I think and hope he'll do very well, but for people to be throwing around comments suggesting he'll be harder to cover than AJ is a little much. The defense he is going against every day hasn't exactly been stellar in stopping TEs over the last few years.

 

 

This is exactly why it's silly to get too excited over anyone during training camp, and to a lesser extent preseason. Give it time and see how they preform during the regular season.

[bengaled]

I think everyone may need to pump the brakes on Eifert a bit. I think and hope he'll do very well, but for people to be throwing around comments suggesting he'll be harder to cover than AJ is a little much. The defense he is going against every day hasn't exactly been stellar in stopping TEs over the last few years.

 

 

well, you have to put all that in perspective to what area of the field each guy would be working. we're not going to send AJ on 10 yd slants consistently, where we'd be exposing him to getting busted up by a linebacker. also, eifert's a bigger target who'll tower over his defender more, and likely has better hands than AJ. i didn't make the contention that he's a more valuable player. so i hope your not confusing my point. 

[Tigris]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7914821/nfl-two-tight-end-set-latest-copycat-trend
 

Except for Pittsburgh didn't make the playoffs.

[|Numbers|]

Except for Pittsburgh didn't make the playoffs.

 

When the article was wrote (2012) they were referring to the 2011 season.  Steelers did make it that year.

 

By  John Clayton | ESPN.com  Originally Published: May 10, 2012

[snarkster]

My Base set would be:

 

TE: Gresham

TE: Eifert

WR: Green

WR: Sanu/Jones

RB: BJGE

 

Drop Gresham or Charles into the backfield as a FB on shortyardage.  Sub Gio for the Firm on passing downs.

[Oldcat]

 

Had Ross not gone to the USFL maybe but that duo never materialized.  When one was playing the other was sitting for the most part.

 

Source for the following info was obtained from http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/RossDa00.htm and http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrM.00.htm

 

Dan Ross:  Games Started / total receiving yards

 

1979:  0, 516
1980:  16, 724
1981:  16, 910
1982:  9, 508
1983:  15, 483
No 1984 NFL Info (was with New Orleans Breakers of the USFL)
1985 (2 NFL teams, Bengals/Sea Hawks):  Bengals:  0, 63  Sea Hawks:  5, 72  Was also with Portland Breakers of the USFL during the year.

 

 

ML Harris:  Games Started / total receiving yards

 

1980:  0, 137
1981:  0, 181
1982:  0, 103
1983:  1, 66
1984:  16, 759
1985:  0, 123

 

I was just trying to remember a second TE on any Bengals team that might fit.   Trumpy and ? was a bit before my time, if we had anyone.  I don't remember if we had a good second TE opposite Holman.  Pat McInally was a TE/P.

 

So every so often we have had a good TE weapon.  Don't think we've had two. or three if you count Charles - which I guess you can't, now.

[|Numbers|]

 

I was just trying to remember a second TE on any Bengals team that might fit.   Trumpy and ? was a bit before my time, if we had anyone.  I don't remember if we had a good second TE opposite Holman.  Pat McInally was a TE/P.

 

So every so often we have had a good TE weapon.  Don't think we've had two. or three if you count Charles - which I guess you can't, now.

 

Trumpy and our beloved Bruce Coslet...  Not dynamic, funny but not dynamic.  Harris and Holman would have been dynamic if Harris could have done what he did in 1984 except did it in 1985.  I guess there were never two TE's that performed reasonably well at the same time.  Does look good for us this year and probably (without too much guessing going on because of our previous examples) will have the best set of TE's the Bengals have ever had on the team at the same time...

 

I may be missing something in regards to the two TE's on the Bengals.  I seem to remember Coslet or Brown saying something about how well the two TE set worked.  There was even a name for the package.

[Jason]

I never understood why ML Harris didn't get more of a chance.  He had good size, huge, capable hands and good speed.  He always impressed me when he played.  But I was just a kid.

[bengaled]

 

I was just trying to remember a second TE on any Bengals team that might fit.   Trumpy and ? was a bit before my time, if we had anyone.  I don't remember if we had a good second TE opposite Holman.  Pat McInally was a TE/P.

 

So every so often we have had a good TE weapon.  Don't think we've had two. or three if you count Charles - which I guess you can't, now.

 

 

if memory serves me trumpy was always the sole TE, especially of accomplishment, and even then they used him more like a WR than a TE in the routes he ran.

 

i believe mcinally was a WR, not a TE. he was too fragile for that role, plus they tried to keep him clean for punting duties. he was more of a gimmick receiver than anything.

[scharm]

During the time of Rodney Holman you had  a slew of Running Backs that were productive including fullbacks.

 

That dynamic under Sam pretty much robbed any significant production a no. 2 TE could have.    Although they would use 2 or 3 TEs at times it was typically Eric Katus or Riggs.

 

 

 In the 80s they seemed to always have a slew of big Fullback hybrid Halfbacks that he would use in combination with a scat back type.

[bengaled]

I never understood why ML Harris didn't get more of a chance.  He had good size, huge, capable hands and good speed.  He always impressed me when he played.  But I was just a kid.

 

many older than you questioned that very same thing. the guy was money in the bank.

[|Numbers|]

I never understood why ML Harris didn't get more of a chance.  He had good size, huge, capable hands and good speed.  He always impressed me when he played.  But I was just a kid.

 

I remember more of the Hollywood Bengals (Esiason, Brooks, etc...) than I did of Harris that many years ago.

 

With a group that included Brooks, Kinnebrew, Alexander, Jennings, Brown, Collinsworth, Holman, Martin, Ross, etc... that were catching passes from Esiason, Anderson, and even Schonert then I guess you could say they did not have enough ball to go around.  According to what I am seeing, even Munoz caught one that year and James Brooks also through one too.

 

Holman appeared to be a more consistent player statistically than Harris but it does appear that when Harris had his chance he was a very capable player.

[Bengals1181]

 

I remember more of the Hollywood Bengals (Esiason, Brooks, etc...) than I did of Harris that many years ago.

 

With a group that included Brooks, Kinnebrew, Alexander, Jennings, Brown, Collinsworth, Holman, Martin, Ross, etc... that were catching passes from Esiason, Anderson, and even Schonert then I guess you could say they did not have enough ball to go around.  According to what I am seeing, even Munoz caught one that year and James Brooks also through one too.

 

Holman appeared to be a more consistent player statistically than Harris but it does appear that when Harris had his chance he was a very capable player.

 

 

ironically, I was just reading this.

 

 

 

You get the feeling around the Bills that whatever they do on offense—and no one knows yet, because they’ve been doing a bit of everything at practice—it’s going to be fun, and it’s going to be fast. Coach Doug Marrone brought a hybrid system, and Hackett, with him from Syracuse. Before the 2012 season, Marrone and Hackett studied fast-twitch offenses (Oregon, Missouri, Toledo) and another very interesting one: the Jim Kelly Bills of a generation ago. “We wanted more explosive plays, and we looked wherever we could to find them,’’ Marrone told me. “We would have watched the Bengals, with Boomer Esiason at quarterback, because they did a lot of innovative things, but we couldn’t find that film. What we did was keep the playbook but changed the tempo to go faster.’’

 

 

http://mmqb.si.com/2013/07/31/ej-manuel-buffalo-bills-camp/

[|Numbers|]

 

 

ironically, I was just reading this.

 

Marrone told me. “We would have watched the Bengals, with Boomer Esiason at quarterback, because they did a lot of innovative things, but we couldn’t find that film. What we did was keep the playbook but changed the tempo to go faster.’’

 

http://mmqb.si.com/2013/07/31/ej-manuel-buffalo-bills-camp/

 

Guess they didn't ask the right people to get film.  If the Bills successfully pull it off they may just surprise a few people this season.  Just not sure they have the personnel necessary.

[Oldcat]

 

Guess they didn't ask the right people to get film.  If the Bills successfully pull it off they may just surprise a few people this season.  Just not sure they have the personnel necessary.

 

Or they may shock themselves.  It seemed the Wyche Bengals always took the first month of the season to get things working, starting out 0 for September, then doing well enough to come up short of the playoffs.  You'd think with the talent they had they could do better without all the screwing around.

[Cricket]

...plus there are the dynamics of pre-snap motion.  Eifert could initially line up at TE, then slide out to WR...or vice versa.  Ditto for Charles with the TE and FB positions.  I also think I read something about Eifert lining up in the backfield at camp.  The team ought to be able to create some mismatches on the field...and that should lead to some great opportunities. 

 

Here's hoping that Gruden's creativity and the team's performance live up to my expectations...

[|Numbers|]

 

Or they may shock themselves.  It seemed the Wyche Bengals always took the first month of the season to get things working, starting out 0 for September, then doing well enough to come up short of the playoffs.  You'd think with the talent they had they could do better without all the screwing around.

 

You had to go bringing up  0 for September didn't you ?  Damn you.  I was getting excited this year and you go and remind me of these things...  It sure did seem that way when a person is forced to live through those days.  However, it does remind me of what a beautiful year 1988 was and how strong that start was.  Sam had two of those 0'fors years out of 8.  By comparison, Marvin only had one in ten year, 2008 (come to think of it that was an 0-8 to start the season year).

 

Sam Wyche 1984-1991

 

Year by year record in September

 

1984:  0-4
1985:  1-3
1986:  2-2
1987:  1-1
1988:  4-0
1989:  2-1
1990:  3-0
1991:  0-4

 

Total:  13-15

 

 

The line it is drawn
The curse it is cast
The slow one now
Will later be fast
As the present now
Will later be past
The order is
Rapidly fadin'
And the first one now
Will later be last
For the times they are a-changin'.

 

Bob Dylan 1963/1964