bengaled Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 and yet you still havent learnt to not click the threads ;) dink ;) yeah alley, how come you haven't learnt that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleycat Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 yeah alley, how come you haven't learnt that? According to MichaelWeston it's because I am a bad person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'll take Em's side on this one, Gio DOES need to gain some strength and as the season has gone on it has become obvious that that is indeed happening, early on in the season from a purely running the ball perspective Gio did leave some to be desired in this aspect of his game, that has changed and I feel like alot of that has to do with him getting stronger, with a full offseason in an NFL Strength and Conditioning program I think Gio will be the next Ray Rice (when Ray was in his prime), but if you watch the tape on him early in the season he was not as strong as he seems to be now. I think that's what Em was getting at, he just didnt choose his words as well as he could have. I'm not sure what expectations you can reasonably have out of a back that stands 5'8" and weighs 200lbs dripping wet. Of COURSE he's going to get wrapped up at first contact (I feel dirty saying that now) by the likes of Ngata when he runs right into him. Gio can spend 5 million hours in the weight room and conditioning program and he isn't going to increase his size by very much. His game is being SHIFTY and ELUSIVE, and adding more weight isn't going to help that. The fact that he's been so special in the passing game just opens up the offense for everyone else since when he's in the game, defenses simply aren't going to be sure what play we are calling. Running between the tackles is NEVER going to be his strongest suit and with the NFL and it's "RB by committee" approach unless your name is Adrian Peterson is the way things are and GIo benefits from having a stablemate like BJGE to take pressure off him and get the tough yards here and there until Gio comes in and cleans house. Some of you are spectacularly stupid when it comes to expectations for Bernard. He's NEVER going to be a bell cow, that's not what he's built for nor is it why we drafted him. No offense, Jamie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengal27 Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 According to MichaelWeston it's because I am a bad person. Uh oh, you're gonna bring MW out of hibernation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble In the Jungle Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'm not sure what expectations you can reasonably have out of a back that stands 5'8" and weighs 200lbs dripping wet. Of COURSE he's going to get wrapped up at first contact (I feel dirty saying that now) by the likes of Ngata when he runs right into him. Gio can spend 5 million hours in the weight room and conditioning program and he isn't going to increase his size by very much. His game is being SHIFTY and ELUSIVE, and adding more weight isn't going to help that. The fact that he's been so special in the passing game just opens up the offense for everyone else since when he's in the game, defenses simply aren't going to be sure what play we are calling. Running between the tackles is NEVER going to be his strongest suit and with the NFL and it's "RB by committee" approach unless your name is Adrian Peterson is the way things are and GIo benefits from having a stablemate like BJGE to take pressure off him and get the tough yards here and there until Gio comes in and cleans house. Some of you are spectacularly stupid when it comes to expectations for Bernard. He's NEVER going to be a bell cow, that's not what he's built for nor is it why we drafted him. No offense, Jamie. I'm on board with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Why wouldn't I click on the threads? The videos are another matter entirely. No danger there. Oh I dont know, to not be looking for an argument. ;) You see there is a difference between disagreeing and being disagreeable, and at this point you arent coming to one of these threads to disagree are you? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Â Â yeah alley, how come you haven't learnt that? Â According to MichaelWeston it's because I am a bad person. Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'm not sure what expectations you can reasonably have out of a back that stands 5'8" and weighs 200lbs dripping wet. Of COURSE he's going to get wrapped up at first contact (I feel dirty saying that now) by the likes of Ngata when he runs right into him. Gio can spend 5 million hours in the weight room and conditioning program and he isn't going to increase his size by very much. His game is being SHIFTY and ELUSIVE, and adding more weight isn't going to help that. The fact that he's been so special in the passing game just opens up the offense for everyone else since when he's in the game, defenses simply aren't going to be sure what play we are calling. Running between the tackles is NEVER going to be his strongest suit and with the NFL and it's "RB by committee" approach unless your name is Adrian Peterson is the way things are and GIo benefits from having a stablemate like BJGE to take pressure off him and get the tough yards here and there until Gio comes in and cleans house. Some of you are spectacularly stupid when it comes to expectations for Bernard. He's NEVER going to be a bell cow, that's not what he's built for nor is it why we drafted him. No offense, Jamie. Ray Rice seems to do just fine as the "bell cow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BengalBacker Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Sigh Diggy dude, just watch this and admit you were wrong about Gio going down on first contact. I think that's all anyone wants you to do, say the words. "I was wrong". http://youtu.be/Tpbz4isvU4g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Dub Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Ray Rice seems to do just fine as the "bell cow" "Did", maybe. His numbers for this season were pretty sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Lucid| Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Sigh Diggy dude, just watch this and admit you were wrong about Gio going down on first contact. I think that's all anyone wants you to do, say the words. "I was wrong". http://youtu.be/Tpbz4isvU4g One thing that stands out to me when watching this again, is while he may not break a lot of tackles (although more than what one might expect) he almost always gets additional yardage after contact. He's very good at slipping/keeping his legs moving to get the that xtra 1 or 2. He's also very good at positioning his body at the point of contact to prevent defenders from getting solid hits on him very often, which should help lengthen his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Sigh Diggy dude, just watch this and admit you were wrong about Gio going down on first contact. I think that's all anyone wants you to do, say the words. "I was wrong". http://youtu.be/Tpbz4isvU4g Actually granted this is highlights which show the best of him, but watching it by the eyeball test you can see where he does early on in the season and as the season has gone on you see less and less of it. It was a pretty popular opinion even among some of the sites bigger homers that Gio would need a year to be LaSean McCoy like, and if Diggy had said that I dont think many would be getting the grief he gets, it's been awesome from a fan perspective to see how quickly he has come on as that type but at the same time paraphrasing Dennis Green, I dont think we can crown him that just yet, though I do think he will get there and do think hes ahead of where a number of us, homers included, expected him to be on that. Now Diggy's opinion on where he would have picked him and who he would have picked ahead of him, I completely disagree with, but then that's not been the running joke around here either. "Did", maybe. His numbers for this season were pretty sad. Completely agree, that's why I said in his prime (in the initial comparison in this thread) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 One thing that stands out to me when watching this again, is while he may not break a lot of tackles (although more than what one might expect) he almost always gets additional yardage after contact. He's very good at slipping/keeping his legs moving to get the that xtra 1 or 2. He's also very good at positioning his body at the point of contact to prevent defenders from getting solid hits on him very often, which should help lengthen his career. I would suggest that he has gotten better as the season has gone on at breaking tackles though. Will he ever be AP or Marshawn Lynch? No but he can be a #1 "bell cow" in the mold of McCoy, Rice, Jones-Drew, Doug Martin. All guys who dont carry defenders on their back (like Law Firm did a few weeks ago, or like Lynch seems to do all the time) but all guys that dont go down on first contact either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WRAPradio Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Like someone mentioned earlier, there will be very few times when Gio breaks a tackle when he's hit head on just based on his size. Most of his broken tackles are due to his quickness and shiftiness and people not being able to get a clean hit on him which is a good thing; we don't want him taking a lot of shots. Gio gets from 0-60 very quickly (almost as quickly as Hawkins) and that will ruin a lot of angles the defenders are taking. Bottom line is Gio is a good back who will only get better; we've already seen 100% improvement on his pass blocking. He CAN be the bell cow and be very successful, but I'm not sure if that's the best way to use him. If you use him in a 50/50 timeshare I think he will be most effective so he can stay fresh though out the game and the season. If he's getting 20+ carries per game it will be easier for defense to get used to his quickness and take the proper angles. My only concern with Gio is how much he leaves his feet to get that extra yard. I love the desire, but I'm still convinced he hurt his ribs diving into the end zone vs. Miami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleycat Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Now Diggy's opinion on where he would have picked him and who he would have picked ahead of him, I completely disagree with, but then that's not been the running joke around here either. C'mon, man, after saying he's not as good as Jonathan Franklin he said he compares favorably to REX BURKHEAD, and he saw their battle for playing time something to watch in the preseason. Rex Burkhead is a power back if there ever was one, so you can see how I'm confused. First Gio can't break tackles, then he's more like Rex Burkhead. The guy just says dumb shit and then finds himself having to back it up after time and so he says even more dumb shit. There's really no other way around that. And I don't mind dumb shit. I say dumb shit often enough. But I don't invite myself over to your house and then say dumb shit about you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleycat Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'm not sure what expectations you can reasonably have out of a back that stands 5'8" and weighs 200lbs dripping wet. Of COURSE he's going to get wrapped up at first contact (I feel dirty saying that now) by the likes of Ngata when he runs right into him. Gio can spend 5 million hours in the weight room and conditioning program and he isn't going to increase his size by very much. His game is being SHIFTY and ELUSIVE, and adding more weight isn't going to help that. The fact that he's been so special in the passing game just opens up the offense for everyone else since when he's in the game, defenses simply aren't going to be sure what play we are calling. Running between the tackles is NEVER going to be his strongest suit and with the NFL and it's "RB by committee" approach unless your name is Adrian Peterson is the way things are and GIo benefits from having a stablemate like BJGE to take pressure off him and get the tough yards here and there until Gio comes in and cleans house. Some of you are spectacularly stupid when it comes to expectations for Bernard. He's NEVER going to be a bell cow, that's not what he's built for nor is it why we drafted him. No offense, Jamie. Very nice post. Hair, who has somewhat disappeared it seems, brought up the term "Air Back" coined (IIRC) by Peter King. That's what Gio is. He's probably not even going to turn into a LeSean McCoy type of 25 carries a game runner. In fact, we may regularly see him getting more yards receiving than running. Which is fine (although I DO think the comparisons to Darren Sproles aren't very favorable to Gio, as I think he DOES bring more to the running game, which includes a portfolio of speed, agility, and yes, some getting low and delivering power skills). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble In the Jungle Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 C'mon, man, after saying he's not as good as Jonathan Franklin he said he compares favorably to REX BURKHEAD, and he saw their battle for playing time something to watch in the preseason. Rex Burkhead is a power back if there ever was one, so you can see how I'm confused. First Gio can't break tackles, then he's more like Rex Burkhead. The guy just says dumb shit and then finds himself having to back it up after time and so he says even more dumb shit. There's really no other way around that. And I don't mind dumb shit. I say dumb shit often enough. But I don't invite myself over to your house and then say dumb shit about you. Only we are allowed to say dumb shit about us in our house :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleycat Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Only we are allowed to say dumb shit about us in our house :lol: :D yup. And he's not we. He only drops his Football Gameplan turds here and then disappears until the next time he takes a dump. Be a part of the community - especially if you're going to retaliate to criticism - and then I'll treat you with a little less disdain. But just a little. :25: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 C'mon, man, after saying he's not as good as Jonathan Franklin he said he compares favorably to REX BURKHEAD, and he saw their battle for playing time something to watch in the preseason. Rex Burkhead is a power back if there ever was one, so you can see how I'm confused. First Gio can't break tackles, then he's more like Rex Burkhead. The guy just says dumb shit and then finds himself having to back it up after time and so he says even more dumb shit. There's really no other way around that. And I don't mind dumb shit. I say dumb shit often enough. But I don't invite myself over to your house and then say dumb shit about you. Right, but that hasnt been the running joke has it? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 He didn't say he had trouble breaking tackles, he said he goes down on first contact. And, yeah, that's kinda a running joke at this point. But you like defending the indefensible , so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alleycat Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 He didn't say he had trouble breaking tackles, he said he goes down on first contact. My mistake. Even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 He didn't say he had trouble breaking tackles, he said he goes down on first contact. And, yeah, that's kinda a running joke at this pint. But you like defending the indefensible , so... And in many cases you can see that, especially early on in the year, now not as much, as I have said the eyeball tests shows he's gotten more physical and stronger as the year has gone on, which leaves me excited about what he can do when he has had a full offseason in an NFL strength and conditioning program. And you're wrong, if I was defending the indefensible I would be agreeing with him regarding where Gio got picked and who he would have taken ahead of him. There is a search feature on here (that works shitty mind you) you can go back and look, I wanted Gio very early on and was pretty happy when and where we got him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Just stop defending him then, Jeebus. He had an evaluation he was just plain wrong on. He could have dealt with this months ago with a simple "yeah, he's better than I thought", but here we are. People that can admit they were wrong have value. People that double down on being wrong are Westons. Stop defending someone who is Westoning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 Just stop defending him then, Jeebus. He had an evaluation he was just plain wrong on. He could have dealt with this months ago with a simple "yeah, he's better than I thought", but here we are. People that can admit they were wrong have value. People that double down on being wrong are Westons. Stop defending someone who is Westoning. Except he hasnt been completely wrong, and a few of you have been insistent on saying otherwise, it hasn't been an all or nothing discussion, so stop making it one, conversations can leave room for nuance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
membengal Posted January 4, 2014 Report Share Posted January 4, 2014 No , he was completely wrong . At no point had gio been a "first contact" runner since the action started . We all knew he would need a year to bulk up, but I was among those making ray rice comps early on with him. The notion that he lacked toughness or was an easy tackle was bogus from the outset. Hell , in one of the first preseason games he was slamming into the line and taking plenty of contact and not going down. It is what it is. Of course he can get stronger, but the tag on him from diggy was just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.