One Player the Bengals Won't Take: Vernon Gholston

[CTA513]

[quote name='Bengals1181' post='624625' date='Jan 18 2008, 09:39 PM']since when?


And IMO, he won't be converted to a LB, but if he is, he started his career as a LB.

I don't get why people get hung up on size. [b]At 6'3 264lbs [/b]he's just as big, if not bigger, than Dwight Freeney, Robert Mathis, [b]Robert Geathers[/b], Osi Umineyiora, Michael Strahan, Jevon Kearse, and Jason Taylor.[/quote]


Almost the exact same size Geathers is listed at except Gholston is 1 pound lighter.

[bengalbutch]

Reason enough to like him.

[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/Gholston.jpg[/img]

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='624666' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:10 PM']An assisted tackle, 2 solo tackles, and a sack for a 15 yard loss...

yeah, he played like a bitch...

I didn't watch him every play but the few times that I did manage to pay attention he seemed to play well.[/quote]

Did you tape it .... or have access to a tape of that game?

Poor performance especially when you know your NFL draft status and the team's championship are on the line.

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

[quote name='Francisco' post='624658' date='Jan 18 2008, 10:57 PM']'Go' himself.

Yes, the master moderator guru guy.

He could kill Gholston in arm wrestling.

This guy is a card carrying PUSQUIT.[/quote]





Sad, but true.

Especially if they are fighting over a stack of waffles from Waffle House.

[bengalbutch]

I have a copy & will watch him on every play if I get time this weekend. I honestly don't know if he had a good game or not. It is comical how many Buckeye haters are out there. I could give a crap if a guy plays division 3, just so he excels as a Bengal !


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston3.jpg[/img]


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston2.jpg[/img]


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston.jpg[/img]

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

Who said I was a Buckeye hater. I like Malcom Jenkins.

[Bengal Chris]

Bucks rule end of story.

I would gladly take VG with open arms on the bengals. At least wed have a bit more defense.

[claptonrocks]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624679' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:38 PM']Who said I was a Buckeye hater. I like Malcom Jenkins.[/quote]

So your basing your comments about him on one game ???
I take it if he'd tackled the runner and had a sack then he'd be the number one pick in
the draft by that reasoning...
Do you not take his whole body of work this season into account?
Ill leave it at that......

[spicoli22]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624672' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:21 PM']Did you tape it .... or have access to a tape of that game?[/quote]

apparently you didn't watch too closely. LSU couldn't do a thing with Gholston, he was in the backfield on pretty much every play. They simply ran away from his side of the field on almost every play and when they didn't, he made them pay.

The Buckeye haters can bitch about the guy all they like. It's not gonna change the fact however, that when it's all said and done, he's going to be one of the 4 highest rated defensive players in the entire draft along with Dorsey, Long and Ellis. He's going to be a beast in the NFL and I'm willing to bet that he ends up a Bengal.

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

[quote name='claptonrocks' post='624692' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:54 PM']So your basing your comments about him on one game ???
I take it if he'd tackled the runner and had a sack then he'd be the number one pick in
the draft by that reasoning...
Do you not take his whole body of work this season into account?
Ill leave it at that......[/quote]

Not at all .... I have tape that encompasses every game he has played. But, whatever BUCKEYES FOREVER!! YOU DUN KNOW SHIT!! BIG DADDY RULEZ!!!

[Jamie_B]

When is the coin flip to decide between the three teams for their positions? Someone said before draft day, but it seems to me they should to it before FA so it gives teams ideas of what they will do in FA vs the Draft.

I want Ellis, which means we probabally wolnt get him.

[claptonrocks]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624698' date='Jan 19 2008, 12:16 AM']Not at all .... I have tape that encompasses every game he has played. But, whatever BUCKEYES FOREVER!! YOU DUN KNOW SHIT!! BIG DADDY RULEZ!!![/quote]

then why do you supposed he was the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year and
AP 2nd team All-American?
maybe they didnt watch the film.....

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='claptonrocks' post='624703' date='Jan 19 2008, 12:31 AM']then why do you supposed he was the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year and
AP 2nd team All-American?
maybe they didnt watch the film.....[/quote]


and? Wilkerson won awards for being the top Center in the nation.

It's not the same game on the NFL level.

[claptonrocks]

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='624706' date='Jan 19 2008, 12:37 AM']and? Wilkerson won awards for being the top Center in the nation.

It's not the same game on the NFL level.[/quote]

true but He had a serious injury no? I read where he couldnt rehab his legs properly and he had no leg drive.. I thought he was soft...'
I havent heard Gholston is soft have you?
Im not saying what his future holds but to base his abilities on one game is ridiculous..

[-Dan_Bengals_FL-]

[quote name='claptonrocks' post='624709' date='Jan 19 2008, 12:42 AM']true but He had a serious injury no? I read where he couldnt rehab his legs properly and he had no leg drive.. I thought he was soft...'
I havent heard Gholston is soft have you?
Im not saying what his future holds but to base his abilities on one game is ridiculous..[/quote]

Gholston made a fine college player, but will not be worthy of a number nine pick at the NFL level. That is my point. There are plenty of players who fall into that category. Big Daddy was great in college, but was not so in the pros. Ben Wilkerson was amazing in college, but was not physically built big enough to move players at this level.

[claptonrocks]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624710' date='Jan 19 2008, 12:44 AM']Gholston made a fine college player, but will not be worthy of a number nine pick at the NFL level. That is my point. There are plenty of players who fall into that category. Big Daddy was great in college, but was not so in the pros. Ben Wilkerson was amazing in college, but was not physically built big enough to move players at this level.[/quote]


What makes you think Gholston wont be a very good pro player?
Could you elaborate on that in more depth ?

[Captain Awesome]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624611' date='Jan 18 2008, 09:07 PM']Just a heads up for all you guys who make the Bengals draft boards, etc. One player that the Bengals won't take (at least at this stage in the game) is Vernon Gholston with the ninth pick.

The guy was a very good college football player, but will likely be a hack in the NFL, especially at the nine spot. A lot of teams will want him to move to LB (since he comes in at 264lbs), but if you have seen this guy on tape or watched him a lot, you will notice he gets beat in the big games and gets destroyed with juke moves by runningbacks.

If your all for a defensive player that can't tackle well in the open field and will get ripped up by L.T., Adrian Peterson and any quality running back any time we play .... by all means pimp the hell out of Gholston.

He's definitely not worth the pick at the nine spot.[/quote]




Since it's the opinion of a good portion of the message board that the Bengals actually need to go with a linebacker in the first, second, and third rounds, then if Gholston is going to be moved to LB by NFL teams then it would seem that would be a good choice then. A 6'4" 265lbs OLB that runs a 4.75/40yd. But the only teams that are going to move Gholston to OLB are those teams that run a base 3-4 defense.

In a 3-4 defense you are correct that he is too small to play DE. But in a 4-3 defense then he is right about the average size of a cross section of some of the top DEs in the NFL. He's actually larger than some of the top DEs that are featured in 4-3 defense. I got all their stats from NFL.com;

John Abraham | #55 | DE
Atlanta Falcons | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 266 Age: 29

Jared Allen | #69 | DE
Kansas City Chiefs | Official Team Site
Height: 6-6 Weight: 270 Age: 25

Dwight Freeney | #93 | DE
Indianapolis Colts | Official Team Site
Height: 6-1 Weight: 268 Age: 27

Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila | #94 | DE
Green Bay Packers | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 247 Age: 30

Tamba Hali | #91 | DE
Kansas City Chiefs | Official Team Site
Height: 6-3 Weight: 275 Age: 24

Aaron Kampman | #74 | DE
Green Bay Packers | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 270 Age: 28

Jevon Kearse | #93 | DE
Philadelphia Eagles | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 265 Age: 31

Patrick Kerney | #97 | DE
Seattle Seahawks | Official Team Site
Height: 6-5 Weight: 272 Age: 31

Robert Mathis | #98 | DE
Indianapolis Colts | Official Team Site
Height: 6-2 Weight: 245 Age: 26

Adewale Ogunleye | #93 | DE
Chicago Bears | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 260 Age: 30

Justin Smith | #90 | DE
Cincinnati Bengals | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 275 Age: 28

Michael Strahan | #92 | DE
New York Giants | Official Team Site
Height: 6-5 Weight: 255 Age: 36

Jason Taylor | #99 | DE
Miami Dolphins | Official Team Site
Height: 6-6 Weight: 255 Age: 33

Osi Umenyiora | #72 | DE
New York Giants | Official Team Site
Height: 6-3 Weight: 261 Age: 26

Kyle Vanden Bosch | #93 | DE
Tennessee Titans | Official Team Site
Height: 6-4 Weight: 278 Age: 29

[|Tigers Johnson|]

[quote name='GoBengals' post='624634' date='Jan 18 2008, 09:53 PM']yea michigan was really good this year.. starting QB did well, starting RB had a great injuury free year... beating michigan .. he had 4 tackles... all for a loss and all, but its not like michigan running game was that good anyway... just ask Appalachian state..[/quote]

Uh they beat Florida...an OMG SEC team.....give me a minute to fawn over them....ok I am back...a little flustered but back....and punished Tim T-bone. Chad Henne also went off on Florida.

[JC]

[quote name='Vol_Bengal' post='624666' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:10 PM']An assisted tackle, 2 solo tackles, and a sack for a 15 yard loss...

yeah, he played like a bitch...

I didn't watch him every play but the few times that I did manage to pay attention he seemed to play well.[/quote]

Are you talking about the sack where LSU's QB mishandled the ball out of the shotgun and Gholston just tapped him?


Well since there is no chance were taking Gholston, is there any chance we trade up for Chris Long or Sedrick if we don't think there going to be there?

[akiliMVP]

[quote name='JC' post='624750' date='Jan 19 2008, 09:45 AM']Are you talking about the sack where LSU's QB mishandled the ball out of the shotgun and Gholston just tapped him?


Well since there is no chance were taking Gholston, is there any chance we trade up for Chris Long or Sedrick if we don't think there going to be there?[/quote]
I think most people believe that Miami is going to take Long with the first pick, so no way we trade up to 1. I doubt we trade up for Ellis either. We would have to give up way too much to move up only a few spots.

[ccartman2]

[quote name='bengalbutch' post='624674' date='Jan 18 2008, 11:28 PM']I have a copy & will watch him on every play if I get time this weekend. I honestly don't know if he had a good game or not. It is comical how many Buckeye haters are out there. I could give a crap if a guy plays division 3, just so he excels as a Bengal !


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston3.jpg[/img]


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston2.jpg[/img]


[img]http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n224/blaine95/VernonGholston.jpg[/img][/quote]

While your watching, count how many times he was held as well. I think he was held at least 3 times, one in which he still made the tackle. (Before the buckeye haters jump on me, I think they had a terrible umpire in the game, as the Bucks got away with several holds as well and I don't believe there was one hold called on either oline the entire game). I'm also not trying to say we should draft Gholston. I think he will be a decent pro, but I don't know if he is worth a top 10 pick. If they traded up, it should be for Dorsey.

[JC]

[quote name='akiliMVP' post='624754' date='Jan 19 2008, 10:27 AM']I think most people believe that Miami is going to take Long with the first pick, so no way we trade up to 1. I doubt we trade up for Ellis either. We would have to give up way too much to move up only a few spots.[/quote]
Oh well i was assuming Dorsey was going first. I had no clue Long was being considered first over Dorsey.


That sucks. Longs going to be a badass.

[texbengal]

I like Gholston, and he looks athletic enough to play 3-4 rush LB... but I would put him at end. As 1181 said, there are a lot of ends with his approximate size who play well in the NFL, unless you're playing a 3-4. My question would be whether he can hold up vs. the run for 16 games, but I have the same question about Derrick Harvey, who I like better as a pass rusher (but Gholston might be a better run defender).

Whether #9 is "too rich" for him, I'm not sure. I would expect that he'll work out extremely well, and given the premium for pressure players on D, he'll likely be highly prized, along with Chris Long, Derrick Harvey, and Lawrence Jackson.

[Inigo Montoya]

[quote name='Dan_Bengals_NJ' post='624611' date='Jan 18 2008, 09:07 PM']Just a heads up for all you guys who make the Bengals draft boards, etc. One player that the Bengals won't take (at least at this stage in the game) is Vernon Gholston with the ninth pick.

The guy was a very good college football player, but will likely be a hack in the NFL, especially at the nine spot. A lot of teams will want him to move to LB (since he comes in at 264lbs), but if you have seen this guy on tape or watched him a lot, you will notice he gets beat in the big games and gets destroyed with juke moves by runningbacks.

If your all for a defensive player that can't tackle well in the open field and will get ripped up by L.T., Adrian Peterson and any quality running back any time we play .... by all means pimp the hell out of Gholston.

He's definitely not worth the pick at the nine spot.[/quote]


Gholston OWNED Jake Long and the rest of the Michigan d-line in 2007. I stopped reading after you said he gets beat in big games. IF we drafted him, he would be an impact pass rusher. I could care less about the rest of his game.

[Tigris]

[quote name='Francisco' post='624653' date='Jan 18 2008, 10:49 PM'][b][u]I saw a picture of Vernon Gholston the other day.

I was like 'shit that guys looks bad ass, what a monster...'

I wanted to check out the hype so I watched him VERY closely against LSU in the National Title Game.[/u]

Jesus, whoever Gholson's back up is, HE should have been in the game.

Yes, the guy looks cool. Yes he is from Ohio State, Yes he has a sweet ass name and is really REALLY buff..

BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY

NO, he cant tackle (just what we need, a Bengal that cant tackle). NO, he wont EVER be a Bengal and [u]YES[/u] I would rather have Black Jesus himself (the poster, not Marvin) play DE on this team more than I would want Vernon -that 245running back just broke my ankles with a sidestep- Gholston.[/b]

[/quote]

I did the EXACT same thing and thought the same... I saw him just totally get blown up one play. I know it was only one play, but whenever I watched him individually, I was not impressed.