where is the freedom of speech ?

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='NASTYNATI' post='582577' date='Oct 31 2007, 11:06 PM']I wear my "I fuck on the first date" tshirt all the time, ive only ever been kicked out of the mall...lol [/quote]


[img]http://doraj.com/wp-images/2005/08/i-fuck-on-the-first-date.jpg[/img]

[-GoBengals-]

[quote name='MrOrange1219' post='582184' date='Oct 31 2007, 10:16 AM']I think another point that people are missing is that you have these freedoms as long as you don't impeed on other people's right to their freedom or do other people harm.

You have "freedom of religion", but you can't walk into the street and murder someone and say it's your religious belief.

Likewise, you have "freedom of speech" but only as long as it doesn't offend others who don't wish to hear/see it. I'm sure that wearing that shirt, although you aren't forcing people to read it, doesn't give them much choice as they go about their day.[/quote]


thats ridiculous. you can wear what you want in public as far as bad words and get in no trouble. has nothing to do with the other peoples freedoms.

if my motherfucking right to breath smoke free air isnt more important than motherfuckers rights to kill themselves, then bad words sure as hell dont fall under "dont bother others"


PS: my rant hits home as my neighbor smokes like a crack whore 24/7 and it seeps into my apartments and has gone as far as making my kids clothes and room stink of smoke. constantly running my furnace fan and hypoallergenic filters on the registers ahve cut it down, but some days its still intolerable. i think they will move the whore here shortly. wtf is wrong with people...

[Gordon Wood]

Actually, obscenity does not receive protection under the 1st Amendment guarantees of freedom of expression. State and local governments may apply "community standards" (just like this board btw) as a part of their power to promote public morals (like laws about when bars and liquor stores close etc). So, your ability to wear a shirt with an obscene word on it depends on local or state laws and ordinances. Before you confidently proclaim your right to wear you "favorite" shirt in Fountain Square you might check on the local ordinances. The Supreme Court views obscenity as a very touchy subject and (particularly with the conservative court we have now) is more than likely going to support a local law.

Also, you might think about growing up. My Pop always told me that "the ones talking the most about it are the ones doing it the least." I dont want to have to explain to my kids what your shirt means just because you think its funny to wear a dirty word on your shirt.

I think its a shame that I have to consider the "risks" of exposing my kids to drunkeness and obscene shirts and behavior when deciding whether or not to take my kids to a football game. Personally, I dont get offended by shirts like the ones being discussed and can even see the humor in them. But I also use them as a means of evaluating the intelligence and maturity of the wearer.

[Actium]

[quote name='Gordon Wood' post='582714' date='Nov 1 2007, 08:28 AM']...The Supreme Court views obscenity as a very touchy subject and (particularly with the conservative court we have now) is more than likely going to support a local law...[/quote]

Also bear in mind the Supreme Court only takes about 100 cases per year and there are many, many that don't get heard. So in all likelihood the ruling of the highest state court you would be in would control. I doubt if even the Ohio Supreme Court would hear it--I'm sure they have plenty of existing precedent on it and don't see the need to have another hearing.

The Supreme Court isn't in the business of remedying instances of small injustices, or single cases. It is in the business of choosing only those cases that can create a sweeping and far-reaching paradigm shift in the law.

[NASTYNATI]

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='582580' date='Oct 31 2007, 11:14 PM'][img]http://doraj.com/wp-images/2005/08/i-fuck-on-the-first-date.jpg[/img]





[/quote]


[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v23/LSPOOLN/owned13.jpg[/img]

Thats more like it...

[claptonrocks]

[quote name='Jamie_B' post='582580' date='Oct 31 2007, 11:14 PM'][img]http://doraj.com/wp-images/2005/08/i-fuck-on-the-first-date.jpg[/img]





[/quote]
How many sandwiches you think that kid has squeezed in that lunchbox?
Im thinking a half dozen laong with 2 or 3 twinkies ... and he wont waste a one!

[Rumble In the Jungle]

thanks for everyones opinion, but im a grown man, and i wear what ever the fuck i want, thanks. if you bring your kids to the game and they get exposed to me wearing my shirt or some drunk dude dropping "F" bombs then thats your fucking business to deal with not mine. i know im not bringing my kids to the game till their old enough. they don't need to see this shit.

[Gordon Wood]

[quote name='Actium' post='582748' date='Nov 1 2007, 09:26 AM']Also bear in mind the Supreme Court only takes about 100 cases per year and there are many, many that don't get heard. So in all likelihood the ruling of the highest state court you would be in would control. I doubt if even the Ohio Supreme Court would hear it--I'm sure they have plenty of existing precedent on it and don't see the need to have another hearing.

The Supreme Court isn't in the business of remedying instances of small injustices, or single cases. It is in the business of choosing only those cases that can create a sweeping and far-reaching paradigm shift in the law.[/quote]

Exactly. So local communities are free to legislate against exactly the kind of expression contained on the tee shirt in question and the wearer is subject to whatever the penalty may be (within reason). If cops choose to look the other way you get lucky, if they dont you pay the fine.

[Gordon Wood]

[quote name='Rumble In the Jungle' post='582760' date='Nov 1 2007, 09:44 AM']thanks for everyones opinion, but im a grown man, and i wear what ever the fuck i want, thanks. if you bring your kids to the game and they get exposed to me wearing my shirt or some drunk dude dropping "F" bombs then thats your fucking business to deal with not mine. [b]i know im not bringing my kids to the game till their old enough. they don't need to see this shit.[/b][/quote]

Your "I paid for my ticket so I can do whatever I want" attitude is symptomatic of what's wrong with society. The law nor I should have to tell you how to behave in public. I dont want that job and I dont really want any government entity to exercise that kind of power. I want you to have enough respect for others to prevent you from behaving like an ass in public.

Sixty years ago these things werent issues. Not because there were restrictive laws against it, but because most people accepted the fact that there are some behaviors and expressions that you dont force everyone to witness.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Gordon Wood' post='582772' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:03 AM']Your "I paid for my ticket so I can do whatever I want" attitude is symptomatic of what's wrong with society. The law nor I should have to tell you how to behave in public. I dont want that job and I dont really want any government entity to exercise that kind of power. I want you to have enough respect for others to prevent you from behaving like an ass in public.

Sixty years ago these things werent issues. Not because there were restrictive laws against it, but because most people accepted the fact that there are some behaviors and expressions that you dont force everyone to witness.[/quote]


[img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/41.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/41.gif[/img]

[Rumble In the Jungle]

[quote name='Gordon Wood' post='582772' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:03 AM']Your "I paid for my ticket so I can do whatever I want" attitude is symptomatic of what's wrong with society. The law nor I should have to tell you how to behave in public. I dont want that job and I dont really want any government entity to exercise that kind of power. I want you to have enough respect for others to prevent you from behaving like an ass in public.

Sixty years ago these things werent issues. Not because there were restrictive laws against it, but because most people accepted the fact that there are some behaviors and expressions that you dont force everyone to witness.[/quote]


[quote name='Bengals1181' post='582774' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:08 AM'][img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//41.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons//41.gif[/img][/quote]



[b]here, i gotta a shirt for the both of you [/b]






























[img]http://offkeyclothing.com/images/amazingly%20enough.jpg[/img]

[NASTYNATI]

[quote name='Gordon Wood' post='582772' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:03 AM']Your [b]"I paid for my ticket so I can do whatever I want" attitude is symptomatic of what's wrong with society.[/b] The law nor I should have to tell you how to behave in public. I dont want that job and I dont really want any government entity to exercise that kind of power. I want you to have enough respect for others to prevent you from behaving like an ass in public.

Sixty years ago these things werent issues. Not because there were restrictive laws against it, but because most people accepted the fact that there are some behaviors and expressions that you dont force everyone to witness.[/quote]


If you dont use the "F-word" in your home thats fine, but him wearing a t-shirt with the word Fuck on it to a professional sporting event has nothing to do with his lack of respect for others nor is it that big a deal. If your child doesnt know that the "F-word" is a word not appropriate for use until adulthood apparently your parenting isnt up to par and should be looked at.

The bold print above really holds no weight, because many including myself might say that those that are more concerned with what their neighbor is doing rather than what they are doing themselves is a far greater issue in this world.

If you dont like what you see, dont look. If you dont like what you hear, dont listen, and if you think a man wearing a t-shirt with the word Fuck on it to a professional football game isnt appropriate, watch from home. He had just as much right to wear that shirt in public as a church does to take scripture and place it on billboards and signage in plain view.

[Rumble In the Jungle]

[quote name='NASTYNATI' post='582783' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:30 AM']If you dont use the "F-word" in your home thats fine, but him wearing a t-shirt with the word Fuck on it to a professional sporting event has nothing to do with his lack of respect for others nor is it that big a deal. If your child doesnt know that the "F-word" is a word not appropriate for use until adulthood apparently your parenting isnt up to par and should be looked at.

The bold print above really holds no weight, because many including myself might say that those that are more concerned with what their neighbor is doing rather than what they are doing themselves is a far greater issue in this world.

If you dont like what you see, dont look. If you dont like what you hear, dont listen, and if you think a man wearing a t-shirt with the word Fuck on it to a professional football game isnt appropriate, watch from home. He had just as much right to wear that shirt in public as a church does to take scripture and place it on billboards and signage in plain view.[/quote]

[img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/41.gif[/img] [img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/41.gif[/img]

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='NASTYNATI' post='582783' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:30 AM']If you dont like what you see, dont look. If you dont like what you hear, dont listen, and if you think a man wearing a t-shirt with the word Fuck on it to a professional football game isnt appropriate, watch from home. He had just as much right to wear that shirt in public as a church does to take scripture and place it on billboards and signage in plain view.[/quote]


[img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/37.gif[/img] Just another example of the "I don't have to respect anyone else if I don't want to" mantra that is taking over the country. I'm all for free speech, but I grow tired of the "I don't give a fuck, I'm going to do what I want" attitude. Does everyone think they're Eric Cartman these days?

[Rumble In the Jungle]

[quote name='Bengals1181' post='582787' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:36 AM'][img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/37.gif[/img] Just another example of the "I don't have to respect anyone else if I don't want to" mantra that is taking over the country. I'm all for free speech, but I grow tired of the "I don't give a fuck, I'm going to do what I want" attitude. Does everyone think they're Eric Cartman these days?[/quote]


[img]http://www.pittspeed.com/forums/images/smilies/bj.gif[/img] whatever

[NASTYNATI]

[quote name='Bengals1181' post='582787' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:36 AM'][img]http://forum.go-bengals.com/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/37.gif[/img] Just another example of the "I don't have to respect anyone else if I don't want to" mantra that is taking over the country. I'm all for free speech, but I grow tired of the "I don't give a fuck, I'm going to do what I want" attitude. Does everyone think they're Eric Cartman these days?[/quote]


how often do you see someone wearing a t-shirt with vulgar language? How often do you drive down the street and see Jesus Saves on a billboard, or some random quote on a sign outfront of a church? If you want to be Captain America why dont you write a letter to the supreme court asking them to put a stop to this because its not fair to the millions of people that dont practice Christianity in the USA are forced to read what they might consider offensive information.

Fuck or Jesus Saves, you cant be the judge of whats offensive to everyone.

[-GoBengals-]

[quote name='Gordon Wood' post='582772' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:03 AM']Your "I paid for my ticket so I can do whatever I want" attitude is symptomatic of what's wrong with society. The law nor I should have to tell you how to behave in public. I dont want that job and I dont really want any government entity to exercise that kind of power. I want you to have enough respect for others to prevent you from behaving like an ass in public.

Sixty years ago these things werent issues. Not because there were restrictive laws against it, but because most people accepted the fact that there are some behaviors and expressions that you dont force everyone to witness.[/quote]

its all your opinion in the end, FUCK on a shirt has no effect on me, im a grownup, he was at a football game, not the public library, or local ice cream social, thats like going to a Megadeath concert and getting offended by pale skinny people on X groping each other in the crowd. its unfortunate that there are 40,000 people at a football game who drank 10x too much and dont care about anyone around them, and your not going to change that with any law, where are the cops for public drunken-ness? they would need several dozen buses, and i would sure as fuck enjoy myself more without a half retarded hillbilly complaining about something that doesnt even make sense for 45 minutes, calling the wrong players name for an entire quarter, and spilling shit all around me.

to allow that behavior, in an almost encouraging manner, and giving someone grief over a curse word, again, at a football game where the word FUCK is said so often it seems echoed, is a little strange. and im quite sure they just wanted to harass someone since they were harassing them already (tho for a good reason, smoking is retarded) but the shirt was silly.

[USN Bengal]

Whatever?

Yeah Go... but he had to walk through public to get to the damed game didn't he? So him wanting to be a foul bastard has to be endured by anyone... because it's his "right" to be an idiot?

Everyone wants to bitch about THEIR liberties, THEIR rights, THEIR percieved wrongs... but when it comes to handling the responsibility of acting like an adult because IT"S THE RIGHT THING TO DO... all you get is "Whatever"... or "Don't Look" or "Don't take you kids in public"...

How totally and unequivocally juvenile and asinine... sloughing off acting like an adult so you can relive your teen years while "legally" drunk makes you part of the problem.

Just like the neighbor polluting your kids lungs right Go?

It's perfectly fine for that to happen because it's the smokers apartment right? So since she is within her right to smoke in her place, fuck your kids right?


BULLSHIT!

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='NASTYNATI' post='582791' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:44 AM']how often do you see someone wearing a t-shirt with vulgar language? How often do you drive down the street and see Jesus Saves on a billboard, or some random quote on a sign outfront of a church? If you want to be Captain America why dont you write a letter to the supreme court asking them to put a stop to this because its not fair to the millions of people that dont practice Christianity in the USA are forced to read what they might consider offensive information.

Fuck or Jesus Saves, you cant be the judge of whats offensive to everyone.[/quote]


I doubt there are people who think "Jesus Saves" is offensive. Now if you wanted to make the case of christianity being forced on someone as offensive, you'd have a point.


For that matter, why don't we write to the supreme court and say "such and such Wendy's billboard is offensive" just because we can.


There's a difference between freedom of speech to protect people's rights, and freedom of speech for others to hide behind it. Too many use it as an excuse for their behavior these days.

[-GoBengals-]

[quote name='USNBENGAL the Original' post='582793' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:47 AM']Whatever?

Yeah Go... but he had to walk through public to get to the damed game didn't he? So him wanting to be a foul bastard has to be endured by anyone... because it's his "right" to be an idiot?

Everyone wants to bitch about THEIR liberties, THEIR rights, THEIR percieved wrongs... but when it comes to handling the responsibility of acting like an adult because IT"S THE RIGHT THING TO DO... all you get is "Whatever"... or "Don't Look" or "Don't take you kids in public"...

How totally and unequivocally juvenile and asinine... sloughing off acting like an adult so you can relive your teen years while "legally" drunk makes you part of the problem.

Just like the neighbor polluting your kids lungs right Go?

It's perfectly fine for that to happen because it's the smokers apartment right? So since she is within her right to smoke in her place, fuck your kids right?


BULLSHIT![/quote]


not really. have you been downtown, let alone on a sunday? there is no "public", and if i recall he parks at longworth, so a block sandwiched by bnegals practice field and bengals parking, and right into the stadium, he wasnt parading down 6th street for 3 hours before the game, and frankly, if he was, he would have been very lonely.

[oldschooler]

[quote name='GoBengals' post='582792' date='Nov 1 2007, 10:47 AM']its all your opinion in the end, FUCK on a shirt has no effect on me, im a grownup, he was at a football game, not the public library, or local ice cream social, thats like going to a Megadeath concert and getting offended by pale skinny people on X groping each other in the crowd. its unfortunate that there are 40,000 people at a football game who drank 10x too much and dont care about anyone around them, and your not going to change that with any law, where are the cops for public drunken-ness? they would need several dozen buses, and i would sure as fuck enjoy myself more without a half retarded hillbilly complaining about something that doesnt even make sense for 45 minutes, calling the wrong players name for an entire quarter, and spilling shit all around me.

to allow that behavior, in an almost encouraging manner, and giving someone grief over a curse word, again, at a football game where the word FUCK is said so often it seems echoed, is a little strange. and im quite sure they just wanted to harass someone since they were harassing them already (tho for a good reason, smoking is retarded) but the shirt was silly.[/quote]



Well said, and I agree completely.
The Concert analogy was perfect.

And I don`t think it is possible to watch a Bengals game
without saying "FUCK !!!" at least once a quarter. Ecspecially this season . . .

[Rumble In the Jungle]

this thread first of all went way off topic, i simply asked if it was against the law to wear it or not, not if it's OK with you guys if i wore the fucking thing. like i said, im a grown up and i act the way i do. i know how to act in public, i wore the shirt to a football game where there is far more shit that's being said, and a lot worse shirts being worn. so once again save your typing cause im not trying to hear your opinion if it's not OK with you for me not to wear it.

[USN Bengal]

[quote name='NASTYNATI' post='582791' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:44 AM']how often do you see someone wearing a t-shirt with vulgar language? How often do you drive down the street and see Jesus Saves on a billboard, or some random quote on a sign outfront of a church? If you want to be Captain America why dont you write a letter to the supreme court asking them to put a stop to this because its not fair to the millions of people that dont practice Christianity in the USA are forced to read what they might consider offensive information.

Fuck or Jesus Saves, you cant be the judge of whats offensive to everyone.[/quote]

What a chicken shit cop out...

Yeah... let's equate a "Jesus Saves" T-shirt or billboard to a "Fuck Off" t-shirt or billboard.

Do you technically have a point? Yes.

Technically speaking... I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.

It's completely ignorant thinking like this that is the cause of the problems that we have today.

"I want to wear the words FUCK OFF on my shirt because I like the shock value attention I get, because I was abused as a child and am trying to make up for it now"

What a crock of shit.

[Rumble In the Jungle]

[quote name='oldschooler' post='582798' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:55 AM']Well said, and I agree completely.
The Concert analogy was perfect.

And I don`t think it is possible to watch a Bengals game
without saying "FUCK !!!" at least once a quarter. Ecspecially this season . . .[/quote]


not only that oldschooler, i wore the shirt that said "Fuck pissburgh from Cincinnati with Love" and a middle finger in the middle of the shirt at a mother fucking Pissbrugh game. and if they haven't been to a bengals pissburgh game before then obviously they have no fucking clue what their talking about.

[Rumble In the Jungle]

[quote name='USNBENGAL the Original' post='582802' date='Nov 1 2007, 11:58 AM']What a chicken shit cop out...

Yeah... let's equate a "Jesus Saves" T-shirt or billboard to a "Fuck Off" t-shirt or billboard.

Do you technically have a point? Yes.

Technically speaking... I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it.

It's completely ignorant thinking like this that is the cause of the problems that we have today.

"I want to wear the words FUCK OFF on my shirt because I like the shock value attention I get, because I was abused as a child and am trying to make up for it now"

What a crock of shit.[/quote]


have you been to a bengals pissburgh game before ?