What the hell is happening in Ferguson?

[MULLY]

Skip past the Obama shit. I couldn't care less about Obama, one way or the other, if I tried. What I'm pointing out is that the number of blacks being slaughtered isn't as radical as you seem to believe. 

MULLY

[Jamie_B]

How about we look at something a little more serious than a blame Obama video then, because once it goes there the statistics he uses should be called into question because he allows his bias into this over something that has nothing to do with it.

 

Propublica is a research company that generally does really good and really fair work. Take a look at this.

 

http://www.propublica.org/article/deadly-force-in-black-and-white

[MULLY]

I couldn't add anything more than what the comments on that article do on their own.

MULLY

[oldschooler]

The officer DID NOTHING WRONG! Michael Brown's actions are the reason he's dead. Not a bad cop.
 
You guys were on a witch hunt from the beginning. I'll bet you'd be happy now if the cop was rotting in jail, even though he's innocent, because, you know, some cops are guilty.
 
Weston, big_dish and others were spot on, you guys were wrong. You should be ashamed, and you should stop fanning flames every time something happens without knowing the truth.

 
 
 
Nothing wrong? Well that is totally subjective. 
 
I have a hard time believing a kid that never had a criminal record, never had a violent history
went straight to cop killer. Maybe Wilson's behavior escalated the situation? Like I said,
there were a lot of people pissed from the get go for some reason. 
 
Plus I have a hard time believe Wilson "feared for his life" when the kid was 180 feet from 
where it all started. Maybe Brown was in shock from being shot or something and wasn't following
Wilson's commands like he wanted him to? I don't know. Neither do you.
I do know that cops are way too trigger happy now days. And that it didn't have to be this way.
 
Also I didn't need to know all the facts to know that non-lethal methods can and should
be used a lot more than they are. Cops shot first and ask questions later.
 
There is no reason for me to be ashamed. And I'm not.
 
You think they were spot on because you share their views. 
 
Funny you talk about fanning flames when the truth is not completely known.
But that didn't stop you all from taking sides.
 
 
I wouldn't be "happy". Someone died. The system tells us it was justified.
You act like the system is infallible. It's not. The DOJ has a higher threshold
for bringing charges than Local or State jurisdictions do. The fact that they
couldn't prove Wilson committed a crime in this instance does not make
him "innocent". It means they had to have evidence to disprove his account.
 
But the DOJ could prove the Ferguson Police force was racially biased.
And seeing how Wilson was fired from another City because the entire 
department was guilty of the same thing, well. I wouldn't be saying
stuff like he did nothing wrong and use the word innocent when mentioning
his name. Because for one, you still don't know all the facts. And two
his employment by 2 racist police forces doesn't paint the guy as the
hero you want him to be.
 
 
This thread was started August 13th. 5 days and 4 pages to this thread later
I made these posts. Please tell me how I was on a witch hunt again?
 
 
 

Let's stop paying for tasers and pepper spray with tax dollars.
And just accept cops or vigilantes shooting unarmed people as OK and normal.
 
Really sick of seeing people justify this kind of bullshit.

 
 

Holy fuck this is like deja vu. 
 
Look let me make it clear for you. I don't need to know the whole story.
I know that this kid was unarmed. I know that tax payers provide Officers
with non lethal weapons. When someone is unarmed, non lethal weapons
should be used at all times. There is no justification for shooting an unarmed
person 6 fucking times with a gun. None. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Comprende? 
So don't bother trying to justify it. Which you sure seem to be doing with
every post. I swear you and Dish seem to be saying basically the same
shit as you did with the Martin case. 
 
By the way, you don't know the fucking facts either.
Yet here you are, going on and on about it. Shaking my head.

 

I mean really, everyone knows the kid was unarmed. Everyone knows he was shot 
six times. That's all my post addressed was those facts. Yet here I have someone 
tell me that I don't know all of the facts after they have made numerous posts 
over and over and over again. Good Lord. It would be hilarious if it wasn't such
a serious topic. Really though, go look in the mirror. Sort yourself out.

 
 

Old, I'm not going to go over your post point by point. I was going to, but I don't think it's necessary or helpful. I'll just say that your views remind me of my views when I was younger. I was wrong.

 
Maybe you were right when you were younger and now you're wrong?
 
 

So did this.
 
http://news.yahoo.com/st-louis-post-dispatch-2-officers-shot-ferguson-055552082.html

 
 
Way too many guns in this Country. And way too many idiots can easily obtain them.
That is the problem. Cops assume everyone, especially Blacks are all carrying guns
and shot them if they blink too many times and ask questions later. And then it is 
their word against either no one or "unreliable" witnesses. It is harder to prosecute
a cop than  anyone. And if you have cops shooting unarmed people and all
it takes is for them to say "I feared for my life" then you are living in a World that
is scarier than you already think it is. Cops could just kill whoever they want,

say those 5 words and it turns into another legally killed unarmed man. 

Which makes it into they did nothing wrong. They're innocent. 

 

 

"Yeah the kid was smoking cigarettes and was under age. But when I tried 

to talk to him he blew smoke in my face! I don't want to die from second hand

smoke and I feared for my life! So I ended his." 

 

We don't  even need to have Judges, Lawyers, Jails or any of that.

Not as long as some people are ready to excuse every cop that kills

unarmed people and all it takes is 5 words to be innocent.

[oldschooler]

 

Has there been a police take presented with this much depth?  It certainly seems like the officer was away from danger but kept firing. 

 

 

Weston being "spot on".

 

 

 

Trayvon Martin made the decision to confront and violently attack a man. His obvious propensity for violence led to his death. Any normal person who thought they were being chased, would have run to safety- not come back for confrontation. It's amazing despite everything that has been proven in that trial, that you refuse to pay attention. You decided something despite knowing no facts, and even when the facts came out you refuse to acknowledge the reality of the situation.

And what you are saying is that it is ok for Trayvon to attack Zimmerman for walking behind him while on the phone, but it is not ok for Zimmerman to counter deadly force with deadly force once attacked? Amazing. So only one type of person is given a free pass by you and your type of radical mentality for inflicting bodily damage on another. Gotcha.

 

 

The funny thing is if Martin had a gun, he could have "stood his ground" against

an armed person that made him "fear for his life." But because he was unarmed he

should have ran away. And because he didn't runaway he is responsible for his

own death and Zimmerman is a hero. Gotcha. 

 

Everyone should carry a gun that way only the dead are to blame. Think about it. 

[Jamie_B]

Blaming Protesters for Ferguson Police Shootings Is a Deliberate Tactic

 

From the Article...

 

While every time a cop is shot is deplorable, here's a newsflash for those who would claim cops are under siege. Police killings have been on the decline over the last 20 years, with the 2000s being the lowest in the century.

 

[PatternMaster]

http://countercurrentnews.com/2015/03/aurora-colorado-vinzant-unarmed-holmes/

 

Police in Aurora, Colorado have now confirmed that they shot an unarmed man in the chest while handcuffing him. The victim’s name is Naeschylus Vinzant. He was on parole since March 2nd, but police say he absconded when he removed his ankle bracelet.

When we asked police about the shooting they began listing all of the bad things that Vinzant, 37, had done in his life, as though listing these things would justify their shooting him in the chest while being handcuffed, and while he was unarmed.

 

http://www.kptv.com/story/22961454/police-man-on-mushrooms-grabbed-officers-gun-fired-shot
 

 

Police: Man on mushrooms grabbed officer's gun, fired shot Posted: Jul 29, 2013 9:32 PM EDTUpdated: Aug 26, 2013 9:42 PM EDT

By FOX 12 Staff

CONNECT

 

 

Jared Leone

 

BEAVERTON, OR (KPTV) -

An 18-year-old accused of grabbing a Beaverton police officer's gun and firing a shot inside City Hall was high on mushrooms at the time, according to police.

Investigators said Jared Leone, 18, approached people working at a florist shop saying he was overdosing before he went into City Hall.

Police said Leone then asked for help in the city offices, but attacked the officers who approached him. The scene was captured by surveillance cameras.

Police said Leone grabbed an officer's gun and fired off a shot that hit a wall. The moment was captured on the video at the 1:06-1:07 mark.

An ensuing struggle lasted for five minutes with multiple officers trying to get control of the suspect.

Police said Leone, high on drugs, was so strong he actually broke a pair of handcuffs. Leone was also "drive stunned" seven times, meaning he was hit with a stun gun directly, not with probes on wires.

 

 

Read more: http://www.kptv.com/story/22961454/police-man-on-mushrooms-grabbed-officers-gun-fired-shot#ixzz3UIlgeyr6

[|Lucid|]

http://countercurrentnews.com/2015/03/aurora-colorado-vinzant-unarmed-holmes/

 

http://www.kptv.com/story/22961454/police-man-on-mushrooms-grabbed-officers-gun-fired-shot
 

Read more: http://www.kptv.com/story/22961454/police-man-on-mushrooms-grabbed-officers-gun-fired-shot#ixzz3UIlgeyr6

 

 

I challenge anyone to find a story of a black guy doing what the guy in this second article did that doesn't get shot.  There are multiple instances like this in this thread already of a white person doing it and either getting talked down or wrestled with, all instances ending relatively non-violently.

 

Yet we have a child in Clevelend with a bee-bee gun getting rolled up on and executed without so much as a thought to anything other.

[Jamie_B]

You wont find one of them even try to Lucid.

[PatternMaster]

Portland teenager gets found not guilty after cops lied about him assaulting the arresting officers.

 

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2015/03/judge_rules_portland_teen_xxxx.html

 

The only thing that saved this kid an arrest record was the fact that their was video and audio that proved that the cops were lying, otherwise it would have been his word vs. the cops and they can use whatever force they deem necessary because they are the law, no matter if they are undercover racist who want to harass, assault, and murder people who don't look like them. 

[Jamie_B]

Portland teenager gets found not guilty after cops lied about him assaulting the arresting officers.

 

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2015/03/judge_rules_portland_teen_xxxx.html

 

The only thing that saved this kid an arrest record was the fact that their was video and audio that proved that the cops were lying, otherwise it would have been his word vs. the cops and they can use whatever force they deem necessary because they are the law, no matter if they are undercover racist who want to harass, assault, and murder people who don't look like them. 

 

 

Now take into account the states trying to outlaw recording.

[BengalRep85-9]

 

 

Now take into account the states trying to outlaw recording.

 

+1

 

Recording does no harm to anyone involved at any time. It only exposes the truth.

 

The majority of cops are probably good and honest people trying to do a good job, but I think more of them than people care to admit aren't so honorable..

 

Prime example of why I personally believe cops do not want recording devices:

Old acquaintance of mine openly used to sell drugs. Was 19 and horribly stupid about it. Drove a BMW 7 series with big chrome rims on it, dressed the part and everything. AKA it SCREAMED I sell drugs.

Anyway, he gets pulled over. Cops find drugs and money, $18,000 to be exact.

 

Long story short, on the police report and during testimony the amount mysteriously dropped to $1,800...

 

Easy way to make $16 grand tax free

[PatternMaster]

 

 

Now take into account the states trying to outlaw recording.

 

Or how many people have shot and killed by cops when the cops claimed they were being attacked and no choice but to use deadly force to protect themselves. 

[T-Dub]

So they're claiming the shooter hit 2 cops, one in the head and one center-mass, out of 3 or 4 shots, with a handgun from almost 500 feet away. That's some Olympic gold medal-quality marksmanship there.. JS. And neither were Ferguson cops. IDK man.

[Khatmandude]

So they're claiming the shooter hit 2 cops, one in the head and one center-mass, out of 3 or 4 shots, with a handgun from almost 500 feet away. That's some Olympic gold medal-quality marksmanship there.. JS. And neither were Ferguson cops. IDK man.

 

There have been admissions that the shots didn't come from the protesters.  There have been agent provocateurs caught there in the past, wouldn't doubt it one bit if they're still there causing trouble.  Hell, there have been videos of the cops down there starting dumpster fires.  

 

Then you have to ask yourself.....WHY would there be someone to provoke the protesters?  What is the intent behind doing such a thing.

[T-Dub]

Forgot to add that the shots were made *through* a crowd of other people without hitting any of them. Definitely suspect.

[|Lucid|]

Forgot to add that the shots were made *through* a crowd of other people without hitting any of them. Definitely suspect.

 

From what I have heard CSI believes the shots were likely fired from an elevated position, probably from a nearby building. This was determined by the entrance and exit wounds and the trajectory suggested by them...

[T-Dub]

They found shell casings in a parking lot on a hill 450+ feet away & seized a handgun that they claim was the weapon used from the guy they arrested. Apparently he confessed, no word on whether this was before, during, or after the beatings though. They also said he fired from a vehicle, which makes it even more unlikely IMO. Shooter claims he was firing at someone in the crowd & just happened to make two kill shots on two different cops, out of 4 rounds fired.

I'm having a hard time believing an untrained person could make those shots with a handgun, from a car, at that range. Accidentally or on purpose.

If CSI thinks he fired from a building they should probably drop that "firing from a vehicle" charge. Unless there's a parking garage involved, I guess.

The protest organizers are also denying police claims that he was a frequent part of their demonstrations.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/16/us/ferguson-police-shot-arrest/index.html

[|Lucid|]

They found shell casings in a parking lot on a hill 450+ feet away & seized a handgun that they claim was the weapon used from the guy they arrested. Apparently he confessed, no word on whether this was before, during, or after the beatings though. They also said he fired from a vehicle, which makes it even more unlikely IMO. Shooter claims he was firing at someone in the crowd & just happened to make two kill shots on two different cops, out of 4 rounds fired.

I'm having a hard time believing an untrained person could make those shots with a handgun, from a car, at that range. Accidentally or on purpose.

If CSI thinks he fired from a building they should probably drop that "firing from a vehicle" charge. Unless there's a parking garage involved, I guess.

The protest organizers are also denying police claims that he was a frequent part of their demonstrations.

htthere to other types when istp://www.cnn.com/2015/03/16/us/ferguson-police-shot-arrest/index.html

Relax man, I wasn't arguing with you. Just relating what I had heard on the news (yesterday morning I think, maybe it was Saturday). All I said was that "they" thought the shots were fired from an elevated position. Also, I thought no one was killed?

[T-Dub]

Ah I'm plenty relaxed just think the whole thing smells (and has from the beginning of course.) Believe the arrest was made last night. Neither cop was killed but the shots were both potentially fatal the way they were described. Point being I doubt they were stray rounds as claimed.

[T-Dub]

White supremacist prison gang member & career criminal dirtbag goes on shooting spree, kills one and wounds 4 others, barricades himself in vacant apartment.

 

SWAT team moves in and takes him down...

 

With a fucking TASER. Suspect in custody.

 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/19/us/arizona-mesa-shootings/index.html

 

 

Tell me more about how cops need to use lethal force.  It's a jungle out there, after all.

[CincyInDC]

Some dirtbags are more equal than others.

[T-Dub]

Guy has "SKIN HEAD" tattooed over his eyebrows. If ever there was a good case for excessive force..  4 D-cell Maglight right between 'em seems perfectly justified to me. Or just shoot him 37 times and say he went for your gun. NP, right?

[Khatmandude]

It's a jungle out there.... :lmao:

 

Nice interjection of humor into a thread that's otherwise depressing to visit....from the defense of murder as much as the murders themselves.  

[PatternMaster]

Please watch the video and then read the article that contains the police statements on why shot this man 5 times....

 

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/18/us/dallas-police-fatal-shooting-mentally-ill-man-video/

 

 

 

(CNN)Jason Harrison appears in the doorway, twiddling a screwdriver between his fingers.

One of two Dallas police officers called to the scene tells Harrison to drop the tool, a command the officers repeat at least four times as Harrison's mom screams, "Jay! Jay! Jay!"

 

Within 5 seconds of that first command, the 39-year-old schizophrenic man is shot five times -- including twice in the back as he crashes headlong into the home's garage door, just a few feet from his mother.

 

Video from one officer's body camera fades to black as Harrison's mother wails, "Oh, they killed my son! Oh, they killed my son!" The officers continue to tell Harrison to drop the weapon.

 

Harrison's family has filed a wrongful death lawsuit against Dallas Police Department officers John Rogers and Andrew Hutchins, saying they forewent nonlethal means of defusing the situation, instead choosing to engage "in unlawful vicious attacks" when they and the department were aware of Harrison's condition. The suit also claims the officers violated Harrison's civil rights.

 

The officers, however, say in affidavits that they were forced to shoot an armed man who they deemed dangerous after he failed to comply with repeated orders to drop a screwdriver.

 

The incident occurred June 14, and the family filed its lawsuit in November, but the Tuesday release of the video has put the shooting back in the headlines.

 

'My son, bipolar, schizo'

 

It begins with Jason Harrison's mother, Shirley Marshall Harrison, answering the door for police and nonchalantly walking out the door.

 

"Oh, he's just off the chain," she says in the video. "You can hear him, talking about chopping up people."

 

An officer asks who she's talking about, and she replies, "My son, bipolar, schizo," as Jason Harrison appears in the doorway behind her.

Shirley Marshall Harrison had earlier requested assistance getting her son to the hospital, a fairly routine occurrence, according to the lawsuit.

"The police had been to the Harrison home a hundred times or more without incident, as it was well-known in the home and community that Jason was nonviolent," the suit says.

 

Though Rogers and Hutchins had Tasers and batons, they quickly drew their firearms when Jason Harrison "had made no threat against either officer," according to the lawsuit.

 

Whether that last allegation is true is unclear, judging from the video, because the body camera pans away from Jason Harrison for 4 seconds before the officers open fire. Two shots hit Jason Harrison in the chest, another goes through his forearm and into his chest and the two more bullets land in his back, the medical examiner's autopsy report said.

 

The police incident report says Rogers and Hutchins responded to a "major disturbance" involving a mentally ill person. Jason Harrison not only posed a threat, he "lunged at one officer," it said.

 

'He refused to comply'

 

Rogers and Hutchins, who both had about six years of experience at the time of the shooting, according to the incident report, gave similar accounts in their June affidavits.

 

The pair received a call that a bipolar, schizophrenic man was off his medications, Rogers wrote. His mother said he was being argumentative and needed to go to Parkland Memorial Hospital, he wrote.

 

Rogers arrived wearing a department-issue body camera that was not working, according to the affidavit.

 

"I told the suspect to put down the screwdriver so we could talk, but he refused to comply," he said in his affidavit.

 

After Rogers and Hutchins repeated the command, "the suspect stepped from the doorway and suddenly jabbed the screwdriver at my partner and then seemed to lock onto me and began to move toward me jabbing the screwdriver at me in fast motions," Rogers wrote. He tried to step away, but a car parked in the driveway blocked his path, he wrote.

 

"It was at that time that I realized that I was going to die if I didn't stop the threat in front of me and I pulled my service weapon and fired two times in self-defense," Rogers wrote. Hutchins, who writes that he was wearing a "personally owned" body camera, said in his affidavit that he took Shirley Marshall Harrison's assertion that her son was "off the chain" to mean that he was "acting hostile."

 

Hutchins also felt Shirley Marshall Harrison walked past him and Rogers "as if to put us between herself and her son," he wrote.

 

Hutchins' story matches Rogers' account -- which is backed up by the video -- that Jason Harrison was told repeatedly to drop the screwdriver. But Hutchins makes no mention of Jason Harrison "jabbing" the screwdriver at both officers. He writes instead that Jason Harrison "advanced toward Officer Rogers while raising the screwdriver."

 

"I was in fear for Officer Rogers' life and I was forced to draw my service weapon and fire it at the suspect until he was no longer a threat," Hutchins wrote.