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2 hours ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

I agree that the focus should be on offense for this draft- have to protect the QB and protect him. Fix the D with the typical free agency pickups and in future years

 

 

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On 1/14/2020 at 1:43 PM, spicoli said:

No way Ross is on this team for the 2020 season. Cut, traded, whatever...he’s played his last game for Cincinnati. 

The problem with cutting JR is that his entire Cap Hit is dead money, the problem with trading JR is that he is garbage and nobody wants him. 

 

The overall problem with JR is that it was a STUPID draft pick based on 4.2 seconds of film. It's a shame as that 2017 draft class was loaded and 1/3 of the first rounders have already made a Pro Bowl 

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16 minutes ago, bfine said:

The problem with cutting JR is that his entire Cap Hit is dead money, the problem with trading JR is that he is garbage and nobody wants him. 

 

The overall problem with JR is that it was a STUPID draft pick based on 4.2 seconds of film. It's a shame as that 2017 draft class was loaded and 1/3 of the first rounders have already made a Pro Bowl 

Your right...he was raw but fast...

He has to concentrate on catches..

He needs coached up but hes the only wideout with Tyreeke Hill speed to keep safties from cheatin  or he ll take the top off..

Id go with him in another year...

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6 minutes ago, claptonrocks said:

Your right...he was raw but fast...

He has to concentrate on catches..

He needs coached up but hes the only wideout with Tyreeke Hill speed to keep safties from cheatin  or he ll take the top off..

Id go with him in another year...

I agree simply because we don't save anything by cutting him 

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38 minutes ago, bfine said:

I agree simply because we don't save anything by cutting him 

 

Not true, we save his spot for someone that can actually play.  That money is already spent, it's gone regardless.  Making the team just because they overdrafted/paid someone or some other bullshit reason is the exact opposite of the message they need to be sending.  No one should be guaranteed a roster space.

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2 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

Not true, we save his spot for someone that can actually play.  That money is already spent, it's gone regardless.  Making the team just because they overdrafted/paid someone or some other bullshit reason is the exact opposite of the message they need to be sending.  No one should be guaranteed a roster space.

And being mad that he hasn't lived up to his draft status does nothing, Sure, If we have 6 WRs better than JR let's keep them. I just think he can be one of the 6 best WRs on the roster, so we gain nothing by parting ways. 

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5 minutes ago, bfine said:

And being mad that he hasn't lived up to his draft status does nothing, Sure, If we have 6 WRs better than JR let's keep them. I just think he can be one of the 6 best WRs on the roster, so we gain nothing by parting ways. 

Agree....i still think hes a touchdown maker waiting to happen..we ll see

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1 hour ago, sparky151 said:

I don't mind trading Ross but he has his uses. He's another weapon for Burrow. 

Dropping a ball right in his hands does nothing for Burrow's stats.

Still shows as an inc

Even worse if Ross bats one up for an int

On Joe, not Fuck Wit.

 

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Obviously RT is a monster need. Bobby Hart is literally diarrhea. I know the front office is high on Fred Johnson and Isaiah Prince. They shouldn't be. Neither are any better than Hart.

 

I think free agency (MB won't do this) is the most logical way to address the position. OL is not a position where a rookie comes in day 1 and is starter quality. Happens very rarely. While Jonah Williams isn't technically a rookie, it is his first year as a starter and we really have no idea what to expect.

 

Joe Burrow will be a Bengal. Protecting him is an absolute must. He cannot develop as a passer if he's constantly under pressure or getting hurt. 

 

There are some good quality right tackles available. You will have to show some of these guys the money. It's worth it. You don't have the rookie mistakes or shit play normally. You get a proven NFL starting commodity and allow Burrow to develop comfortably.

 

Here's how I'd rate the free agent RTs:

1. Jack Conklin, Titans: He's 25 years old and a top 5 RT. He will not be cheap. Sign him to a 5 year deal and finally solidify a position we've struggled with for a decade.

 

2. Brian Bulaga, Packers: 31 years old and a good 10 year starter for the Packers. Will be a slightly cheaper option than Conklin.

 

3. Demar Dotson, Bucs: He's 34 years old and a proven solid starter. He won't break the bank but is probably only a 1 or 2 year fix.

 

4. Darryl Williams, Panthers: He was an all pro at RT in 2017 but has gone downhill since. He's been moved around to several different positions and struggled. At 27 years old he has upside and will be cheap.

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15 hours ago, akiliMVP said:

Obviously RT is a monster need. Bobby Hart is literally diarrhea. I know the front office is high on Fred Johnson and Isaiah Prince. They shouldn't be. Neither are any better than Hart.

 

I think free agency (MB won't do this) is the most logical way to address the position. OL is not a position where a rookie comes in day 1 and is starter quality. Happens very rarely. While Jonah Williams isn't technically a rookie, it is his first year as a starter and we really have no idea what to expect.

 

Joe Burrow will be a Bengal. Protecting him is an absolute must. He cannot develop as a passer if he's constantly under pressure or getting hurt. 

 

There are some good quality right tackles available. You will have to show some of these guys the money. It's worth it. You don't have the rookie mistakes or shit play normally. You get a proven NFL starting commodity and allow Burrow to develop comfortably.

 

Here's how I'd rate the free agent RTs:

1. Jack Conklin, Titans: He's 25 years old and a top 5 RT. He will not be cheap. Sign him to a 5 year deal and finally solidify a position we've struggled with for a decade.

 

2. Brian Bulaga, Packers: 31 years old and a good 10 year starter for the Packers. Will be a slightly cheaper option than Conklin.

 

3. Demar Dotson, Bucs: He's 34 years old and a proven solid starter. He won't break the bank but is probably only a 1 or 2 year fix.

 

4. Darryl Williams, Panthers: He was an all pro at RT in 2017 but has gone downhill since. He's been moved around to several different positions and struggled. At 27 years old he has upside and will be cheap.

I wouldn't put Fred Johnson in the Bobby Hart category yet. The Stealers obviously saw something in him and kept him on their 53 for the first 5 weeks of the season. They then tried to stash him on their PS but we claimed him. In 199 snaps last year he gave up 0 sacks including a week 17 start against the Browns. We also have the option of playing Glenn at RT. I'd rather we address the interior of the oline in folks such as Brandon Schreff, Andrus Peat, or Stefen Wisniewski

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19 hours ago, bfine said:

And being mad that he hasn't lived up to his draft status does nothing

 

Hey, just like Ross himself..  :ninja:

 

How many years do you propose they keep waiting on his "potential"?  Can't stay on the field, can't catch, can't run routes, can't beat press coverage, can't take a hit..  Why is he on the team other than his outrageous salary?  

 

Call me crazy but I prefer the Bengals keep football players that play football.  Radical concept around here, apparently.

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16 hours ago, akiliMVP said:

Neither are any better than Hart.

Based off of what exactly?

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29 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

 

Hey, just like Ross himself..  :ninja:

 

How many years do you propose they keep waiting on his "potential"?  Can't stay on the field, can't catch, can't run routes, can't beat press coverage, can't take a hit..  Why is he on the team other than his outrageous salary?  

 

Call me crazy but I prefer the Bengals keep football players that play football.  Radical concept around here, apparently.

As I said: His rookie deal at this point. Obviously we don't pick up his 5th year option, but er're invested for this year. What else are we going to do? Roll with Damion Willis and Stanley Morgan? Right now JR is a back-end of the roster guy, But it's not like we're cutting Jerry Rice to make room for him. 

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36 minutes ago, bfine said:

What else are we going to do? 

 

Give that spot to a player that might be able to actually play.  There are lots of those.  Keeping Ross gives us nothing but one less capable player on game day.  It's textbook sunk cost fallacy & a perfect example of the types of decisions that got us where we are now.

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49 minutes ago, spicoli said:

Based off of what exactly?

Undrafted guys who have played only a handful of snaps? Prince was terrible at OSU. I guess Johnson could become good but I'd rather get a guy who's proven he can do it.

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9 minutes ago, akiliMVP said:

Undrafted guys who have played only a handful of snaps? Prince was terrible at OSU. I guess Johnson could become good but I'd rather get a guy who's proven he can do it.

 

Some average vet or last-lap older guy like Winston would go a long way.   We just need to get the OL back to average, we can worry about finding 10-year starters or potential Pro Bowl guys after they at least stop the bleeding.  

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1 hour ago, bfine said:

As I said: His rookie deal at this point. Obviously we don't pick up his 5th year option, but er're invested for this year. What else are we going to do? Roll with Damion Willis and Stanley Morgan? Right now JR is a back-end of the roster guy, But it's not like we're cutting Jerry Rice to make room for him. 

Not to mention I’d like to see what he can do with a Burrow throwing him the ball. Despite his failures so far his upside is still greater than what we would get for him. 

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11 minutes ago, sparky151 said:

Ross had 7 touchdown catches in 2018. That's more than a lot of famous receivers had.

 

 

& then what happened?  It's crazy, I don't know how much bigger of a bust this guy could possibly be yet it's always "one more year!" for him.

 

If the NFL ever holds a Potential Bowl we would be world champs.

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1 hour ago, Jason said:

Not to mention I’d like to see what he can do with a Burrow throwing him the ball. Despite his failures so far his upside is still greater than what we would get for him. 

Ross’ problems had nothing to do with Andy Dalton. 

1 hour ago, sparky151 said:

Ross had 7 touchdown catches in 2018. That's more than a lot of famous receivers had.

 

Typical outlier stat, like when Chad Pennington had the highest passer rating in 2002.  

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9 minutes ago, SF2 said:

Ross’ problems had nothing to do with Andy Dalton. 

Typical outlier stat, like when Chad Pennington had the highest passer rating in 2002.  

...or Andy's 2015 season. 

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1 hour ago, sparky151 said:

Ross had 7 touchdown catches in 2018. That's more than a lot of famous receivers had.

 

Driskel was QB for 5 of the 7, so you guys could have a point. 

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The Athletic today has an article on George Iloka who had some comments on the team and winning:

 

A strong topic leading up to the Super Bowl on radio row was the talk of the Bengals not being committed to winning Super Bowls. You guys won 54 games and went to the playoffs four times during your six seasons in Cincinnati. Do you think that criticism is warranted that the Bengals aren’t committed to winning Super Bowls?

Every team is committed to winning Super Bowls. Let me say that first and foremost. But I believe some teams are more committed than others. You have to ask yourself as a sportswriter or a fan or whoever, how committed is your organization and what does commitment look like? And don’t confuse results for commitment. All right? Two people can go into the gym. Let’s say I wake up every morning at 5 o’clock and work out for two hours and I stay in decent shape. And then there’s a person who goes to the gym twice a week but eats like shit and they’re shredded. That person doesn’t have more commitment just because his results happen to be better. Look, the NFL is first and foremost a business. And to have that kind of money to own a football team, they’re all smart in business to some degree. And the objective of a business is to make money. But the objective of a football team, in terms of the players and coaches – and the organizational standpoint – is to win the Super Bowl. Sometimes that doesn’t go hand in hand. So who makes decisions based more on winning a Super Bowl? And who makes decisions based more toward what makes the most money or saves the most money? Because sometimes those conflict. Certain teams will see a guy they can sign or a trade they can make and they’ll know in the long run it’s going to come back to bite them, but in the short term, this gives us the best chance of winning a Super Bowl. Some teams weigh that more than others. Some teams will pass on that move because it’s not the most cost-efficient or financially responsible decision. So everybody has to figure out with the team they root for, which way do they lean toward. That’s how you gauge the level of commitment, comparing it to other teams and how they make those kinds of decisions.

So basically you disagree with Carson Palmer saying he didn’t feel the Bengals were trying to win a Super Bowl?

If he said they’re not committed to winning, then I don’t agree with that. Every team is committed, the levels are just different.

There is more to commitment than just paying players. Did you feel like the Bengals showed commitment in terms of the facilities and all the little extra things done around the organization to try to make it one of the best?

Right, I was just going to say it’s not just about money. I’m not going to speak specifically to the Bengals being that I played there, I’m always cautious because I feel like people listening are just going to throw away my message because of that. When Carson Palmer says something, even if it’s 80 percent true, they’ll say, ‘No, that’s bullshit,’ because of maybe how he left and that history. So I just want to say this, commitment is not just player contracts. It’s other things. Some teams I’ve been on, they don’t cut no corners when it comes to anything. Now all of those things are not going to translate into wins or a Super Bowl because remember what I said, you don’t judge commitment by results. You judge commitment by effort. And effort can come in different forms. Money. Time. Energy. All of that. Commitment can also be resources that you provide to players or things you do to the facility to make it a better work environment, decisions you make with the coaching staff, within the organization. It’s not just players and salaries.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say the low point was the wild card loss to the Stealers in 2015 …

Absolutely. Easy. Because that year, I mean I know coulda, woulda, shoulda, but based off of how everything was going, I felt like we were coming in hot even though Andy (Dalton) was injured. AJ (McCarron) was playing pretty well. Every year your goal is to go the Super Bowl, and you know by Week 10, Week 12 what kind of team you are. Everything is still possible, but you realistically know what you are. That team that year, I honestly thought at the very least we were going to the AFC Championship game. If we did not make the AFC Championship, it was going to be an underachieving season. Honestly. And I wouldn’t have been surprised at all if we made the Super Bowl. But at the very least the AFC Championship. So to lose in the first round on the way we lost, it was very disappointing. But how we lost wasn’t a surprise. That’s what kind of plagued us that year. And I’m not talking about the fumble. People need to get over that. Jeremy (Hill) didn’t lose us that game. It was just like everything that we did wrong that we could’ve done better, from the first quarter to the third quarter to the fourth quarter, all of those little things we let slip through the cracks throughout the whole season, they finally caught up with us at the very worst moment. That was definitely the most disappointing loss with the Bengals for sure.

 

That game sits smack in the middle of a timeline where before it there are five straight playoff seasons and after it, four straight losing seasons, ending with the worst record in football in 2019. Do you think that loss and the inability to recover from it had something to do with where this franchise is today?

Nah. That’s not it. I’ll say this. Let me put my critical thinking cap on before I answer this question. Teams lose all the time, right? The Saints have had more disappointing losses than we had, in terms of the no-call on the pass interference and the Minneapolis Miracle. And they were able to bounce back. That’s not an excuse. I would say there was a string of decisions that led to where they’re at now. Decisions with the offseason and the draft that if you looked back now with hindsight, wouldn’t be made the same way. The first domino was Whit (letting offensive tackle Andrew Whitworth leave in free agency). That one was a head-scratcher to me. That was the first one to me. I’ll let everyone else do their own research and their own digging to look back and say they should have done this or that differently, what positions they went for in the draft, what coaches they had that left, and then ask yourself why it is what it is. Basically it all comes down to the draft. When we had the string of success with all those playoff runs, they did a great job. They’re hitting on their picks and things are panning out. But as you let guys go, you have to replenish. And we know they’re not a team to replenish in free agency. That’s their M.O. That’s fine, as long as you hit. If your lifeline is the draft and you miss a couple times, a key pick here, another pick there, it starts trickling down. Some of the same things that plagued them this year plagued them last year. I’m not there anymore so I’m not going to go too deep into their drafts, but no, that playoff loss is no excuse for where they are right now with four straight losing seasons.

 

 

 

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