Bengals targeting premier pass-rusher Pierre-Paul

[oldschooler]

[b][size="5"]Bengals targeting premier pass-rusher Pierre-Paul [/size][/b]

By Carlos "Big C" Holmes, Staff Writer
9:59 PM Wednesday, April 7, 2010


The Cincinnati Bengals are in prime position to take the best available player with the 21st overall pick in this month's NFL draft. Although there are some areas on offense that need addressed, the team is expected to take an aggressive approach to improve their defense. The team believes in the philosophy that the best offense is often a good defense.

With that in mind, one prospect the Bengals are targeting in the first round is South Florida defensive end Jason Pierre-Paul.

Bengals head coach Marvin Lewis and defensive line coach Jay Hayes were present at South Florida's Pro Day on Tuesday, March 30. Apparently, the two were so impressed with Pierre-Paul's performance that two days later he traveled to Cincinnati for a visit with the team.

"The visit went well," Pierre-Paul said early this week. "I can definitely see myself playing for the Bengals. I love the style of defense they play and could do a lot of things in it. I could rush the passer or stand up and play outside linebacker in their scheme. My game would be ridiculous in that defense."

Pierre-Paul is a consensus top-15 pick and falling to the Bengals at No. 21 would be an unexpected gift. The Buffalo Bills own the ninth overall pick and brought the player in for a visit on Monday.

The Bengals are looking to improve their pass-rush from a year ago. Defensive ends Jonathan Fanene, Robert Geathers, Antwan Odom, Frostee Rucker and Michael Johnson provide the team with solid depth at the end position. But none of them is considered a premier pass-rusher. Could Pierre-Paul be that man?

The 6-foot-5, 270-pound Pierre-Paul is a raw talent, having played one year of Division-I football. However, he's a relentless pass-rusher with incredible upside. Many scouts view him as the total package from a physical standpoint and pass-rushing perspective. He is being compared to Jevon Kearse.

Despite all the good qualities that the player possesses, teams have their reservations.

"Teams are doubting me because I only played one year of D-I football," Pierre-Paul said. "I don't care if I never played in the division. I know how to play football. Whatever team drafts me is going to get a great player. They say that I'm still learning the game, but I'm just going to continue to play like I know how and learn more of it as I go. I'll say this: whatever team gets me will get the best of Pierre-Paul."




[url="http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/cincinnati-bengals/bengals-targeting-premier-pass-rusher-pierre-paul--641433.html"]http://www.daytondai...ul--641433.html[/url]

[Bengals1181]

yay, Carlos actually used quoted sources. Way to go buddy.



I just can't see a first round DE or DT. It's not a huge need, and I don't see Pierre-Paul having any chance as a SLB.

[CTBengalsFan]

How different is Pierre-Paul from Michael Johnson?

[The Scales]

Zims been saying they need some more pass rush. It was pretty woeful once Odom tore his heel tendon.


So you got questions about how effecive Antwan will be after his critical injury.

and the fact that you didn't get much of anything in terms of Pass Rush from your other players. Michael Johnson included.


I'm sure - like positive - that Marvin and Zimmer are paddleing around in the same "We need pash rush boat" whether the old crusties up stairs end up going that way - who knows?

Is Pierre Paul the answer? Who knows. But I know its a need.

[akiliMVP]

They would more than likely have to trade up for JPP. I don't see that happening.

[Dumall]

[quote name='Bengals1181' date='08 April 2010 - 07:45 AM' timestamp='1270727133' post='876013']
yay, Carlos actually used quoted sources. Way to go buddy.



I just can't see a first round DE or DT. It's not a huge need, and I don't see Pierre-Paul having any chance as a SLB.
[/quote]
Or as Marvin Lewis has been quoted before as saying...If you draft for need prepare to get your feelings hurt or
something like that. They usually take best available or atleast what they perceive as best available for the most part.

[Jason]

[quote name='Dumall' date='08 April 2010 - 08:22 AM' timestamp='1270732954' post='876029']
Or as Marvin Lewis has been quoted before as saying...If you draft for need prepare to get your feelings hurt or
something like that. They usually take best available or atleast what they perceive as best available for the most part.
[/quote]

Where most of the "experts" have JPP rated, if he's there he would probably be the BPA. But I'm not sure I want him. Has all the tools, but is he a 1 year wonder, or the real deal? I think he is one of the biggest Boom/Bust prospects in the draft.

[sois]

I wonder why every time I watched South Florida the announcers would only talk about Selvie and not JPP. I don't know if the media steered me toward Selvie but I never really saw JPP do anything in the 3-4 SF games I watched in recent seasons.

[Jason]

[quote name='sois' date='08 April 2010 - 09:40 AM' timestamp='1270737656' post='876041']
I wonder why every time I watched South Florida the announcers would only talk about Selvie and not JPP. I don't know if the media steered me toward Selvie but I never really saw JPP do anything in the 3-4 SF games I watched in recent seasons.
[/quote]

2009 was JPP's only year at South Florida and I think he only started 7 games for them. I only saw a couple of their games, but he looked good in the games I saw. I just don't know if there is enough tape on him to justify a first round contract.

[sois]

[quote name='Jason' date='08 April 2010 - 07:55 AM' timestamp='1270738549' post='876044']
2009 was JPP's only year at South Florida and I think he only started 7 games for them. I only saw a couple of their games, but he looked good in the games I saw. I just don't know if there is enough tape on him to justify a first round contract.
[/quote]

Oh, well that will explain it
I think I only saw them once this year too.

[happyrid]

[quote name='Bengals1181' date='08 April 2010 - 07:45 AM' timestamp='1270727133' post='876013']
yay, Carlos actually used quoted sources. Way to go buddy.



I just can't see a first round DE or DT. It's not a huge need, and I don't see Pierre-Paul having any chance as a SLB.
[/quote]

I can see a 1st round DT because I don't think the team is as high on Sims as the 3rd DT as fans are.

I don't see any DEs being drafted at all, much less 1st round, because I think they like the 5 guys we have (Odom, Geathers, Johnson, Fanene and Rucker).

I definitely see a SLB being drafted, maybe early. I don't know if they think JPP can play that position or not. It wouldn't surprise me if they did though. He is a great athlete and is very similar to Manny Lawson, a guy they supposedly loved a few drafts ago and wanted to put at SLB.

[Scoutforlife591]

I don't know, I think something good is going to happen to the Bengals this draft.

Either JPP, Dez Bryant, Mays. Something is going to drop.

[DanvilleBengal]

One thing I have noticed about all of our drafts, especially in the later rounds, is that Marvin likes to go after players that has production, but he feels that they have not peaked. Sometimes when you get a college stud, like a Earl Thomas for example, he's so polished and good at what he does, you have to wonder if he has already hit his potential. On one end, that's cool, you will get immeidate production, but ultimately, it may backfire [see Madieu Williams, he was really good in his rookie year, but not much else after that]


I do think that JPP, if he is there, would be the ideal pick. Freakish athleticism, but a little raw. I would take him at 21, because I know that I would not be able to get him in round 2. Zimmer apparently knows what to do with the guy. Plus, with him playing only one year of D-1, I think that with a little refinement, he would be an absolute stud that would reach his potential in his prime with us, and finally give us that menacing pass rusher that teams have to prepare for.

[Rumble In the Jungle]

if he's available still, would you guys want us to draft him ?

[Jason]

[quote name='Rumble In the Jungle' date='08 April 2010 - 10:42 AM' timestamp='1270741374' post='876058']
if he's available still, would you guys want us to draft him ?
[/quote]

I wouldn't. He hasn't done enough IMO to warrant a first round pick. He is athletic enough though that I would take him in 2 in a heartbeat. Physically he reminds me of a young Jevon Kearse, but I don't see DE as a first round need anyway. The only DE I would take in 1 is Morgan, and he'll probably be gone by 21.

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='DanvilleBengal' date='08 April 2010 - 11:41 AM' timestamp='1270741292' post='876057']
[b]One thing I have noticed about all of our drafts, especially in the later rounds, is that Marvin likes to go after players that has production, but he feels that they have not peaked. [/b] Sometimes when you get a college stud, like a Earl Thomas for example, he's so polished and good at what he does, you have to wonder if he has already hit his potential. On one end, that's cool, you will get immeidate production, but ultimately, it may backfire [see Madieu Williams, he was really good in his rookie year, but not much else after that]


I do think that JPP, if he is there, would be the ideal pick. Freakish athleticism, but a little raw. I would take him at 21, because I know that I would not be able to get him in round 2. Zimmer apparently knows what to do with the guy. Plus, with him playing only one year of D-1, I think that with a little refinement, he would be an absolute stud that would reach his potential in his prime with us, and finally give us that menacing pass rusher that teams have to prepare for.
[/quote]


I've heard Marvin say that, particularly when it comes to body size. They like guys who haven't hit their peak physically yet.

[fredtoast]

[quote name='Jason' date='08 April 2010 - 10:55 AM' timestamp='1270738549' post='876044'] I just don't know if there is enough tape on him to justify a first round contract.
[/quote]

Pierre-Paul played more years of Div I football than Jerry Rice and Walter Peyton combined.

He played in a BCS conference and there is plenty enough tape on him for any good scout to determine if he is a good player.

Personally I have no clue how good he is, but I'm not an NFL scout.

[fredtoast]

[quote name='happyrid' date='08 April 2010 - 11:12 AM' timestamp='1270739573' post='876046']

I don't see any DEs being drafted at all, much less 1st round, because I think they like the 5 guys we have (Odom, Geathers, Johnson, Fanene and Rucker).

[/quote]

I can seriously see the Bengals going with a DE at #21. Geathers has ended the last two seasons injured and Odom has in 3 of the last four.

Plus, other then Odom, none of those guys we have have shown good pass rush ability. I really like Johnson's potential, but I still think we need help at DE.

In fact I predict we take Everson Griffen in the first, but if JPP was there and our staff deemed him worthy I'd be happy to take him.

[Jason]

[quote name='fredtoast' date='08 April 2010 - 11:55 AM' timestamp='1270745751' post='876073']
Pierre-Paul played more years of Div I football than Jerry Rice and Walter Peyton combined.

He played in a BCS conference and there is plenty enough tape on him for any good scout to determine if he is a good player.

Personally I have no clue how good he is, but I'm not an NFL scout.
[/quote]

Really? After George Selvie's sophomore year, which was better than the year JPP had, he looked like a sure fire top 10 pick. Now he will be lucky to go in the 3rd round. Selvie had "plenty of tape" at that point in his career too, by your definition.

[fredtoast]

[quote name='Jason' date='08 April 2010 - 01:11 PM' timestamp='1270746699' post='876084']
Really? After George Selvie's sophomore year, which was better than the year JPP had, he looked like a sure fire top 10 pick. Now he will be lucky to go in the 3rd round. Selvie had "plenty of tape" at that point in his career too, by your definition.
[/quote]

I am not so sure that true NFL scouts were that high on Selvie. He was more of a media darling.

[|Bunghole|]

I lifted this from another board I frequent (I know, I'm a filthy, cheating whore), and its comments like these that give me pause about JPP:

[i]Seems like every year, there is a guy who I can't even fathom why is talked about in the first round. Jason Pierre Paul is that guy this year. I have no idea (outside of apparently nice "measurables") why this guy is considered anything more than a 3rd round developmental project. He's weak, has no real pass rush moves, isn't very strong against the run, and has very little production. This beast had a whopping zero total sacks against studly teams like Wofford, Western Kentucky, and Charleston Southern, and only 6 all frickin year in a crappy division. He's raw, played only one year Div 1 football, and gets by on his athleticism not his skills. I've only seen a bit of his tape, and while he certainly can make some nice plays, I saw nothing that made me go "WOW". Maybe after a few years if he bulks up and learns the position, he'll develop into a great player, but taking him in the first round is, IMHO a completely wasted pick.[/i]

I have no idea how accurate this is, I watch very little college football because I find it unsatisfying for the most part.

[Jom112]

I like how everyone that criticizes JPP saw maybe one of his games at most, usually none. (Referring to the post above that said "I've only seen a bit of his tape")

JPP will be a stud, but I think the Titans will take him before we do. The guy has a great motor and while he needs to improve against the run he will be a dominant pass rusher. His pass rush actually reminds me of Osi Umenyiora, and wouldn't you love to see a young Osi rushing the passer instead of seeing Robert Geathers get man-handled by tight ends?

If he falls to us we should take him, but assuming the Titans do take him we should take Everson Griffen. It's nice to see the Bengals are looking to upgrade their pass rush...

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='Bunghole' date='08 April 2010 - 01:29 PM' timestamp='1270747791' post='876103']
I lifted this from another board I frequent (I know, I'm a filthy, cheating whore), and its comments like these that give me pause about JPP:

[i]Seems like every year, there is a guy who I can't even fathom why is talked about in the first round. Jason Pierre Paul is that guy this year. I have no idea (outside of apparently nice "measurables") why this guy is considered anything more than a 3rd round developmental project. He's weak, has no real pass rush moves, isn't very strong against the run, and has very little production. This beast had a whopping zero total sacks against studly teams like Wofford, Western Kentucky, and Charleston Southern, and only 6 all frickin year in a crappy division. He's raw, played only one year Div 1 football, and gets by on his athleticism not his skills. I've only seen a bit of his tape, and while he certainly can make some nice plays, I saw nothing that made me go "WOW". Maybe after a few years if he bulks up and learns the position, he'll develop into a great player, but taking him in the first round is, IMHO a completely wasted pick.[/i]

I have no idea how accurate this is, I watch very little college football because I find it unsatisfying for the most part.
[/quote]


my opinion means little, but during the season I caught wind of JPP and thought he would be a great 2nd round pick. The season ends and next thing I know people are saying he could be a top 5 pick.

[Cricket]

As I've posted before, in an NFL.com video (during the combine) Charles Fisher said that he talked to "South Florida people" (I would assume this to be people associated with the football program) about JPP and they were pretty much split 50/50 on whether he'd be a boom or a bust. You would think that people associated with a football program would tend to be more positive about players from the program...so when half of the guys predict "bust"....it certainly would give me pause.

[BlackBengal]

[quote name='Jom112' date='08 April 2010 - 01:44 PM' timestamp='1270748650' post='876114']
I like how everyone that criticizes JPP saw maybe one of his games at most, usually none. (Referring to the post above that said "I've only seen a bit of his tape")

JPP will be a stud, but I think the Titans will take him before we do. The guy has a great motor and while he needs to improve against the run he will be a dominant pass rusher. His pass rush actually reminds me of Osi Umenyiora, and wouldn't you love to see a young Osi rushing the passer instead of seeing Robert Geathers get man-handled by tight ends?

[b]If he falls to us we should take him, but assuming the Titans do take him we should take Everson Griffen[/b]. It's nice to see the Bengals are looking to upgrade their pass rush...
[/quote]

Everson Griffen would be a horrible pick. That guy has been so overrated his entire career. I have been hearing that he was the next big thing for about 3 years and he didnt do anything until this last season in which he had a solid, but not spectacular season. Frostee was a better player at SC than Griffen and Frostee is a marginal NFL player.