Pick 18, what should Bengals do?

[JC]

3 hours ago, dex said:

A big part of the appeal of Murphy to me is how effective he is at defending against the run at his less than ideal size and length. Obviously Murphy isn't the immovable object that Sweat is, but it still amazes me that Murphy got about 70 more snaps in the A gap than Sweat did, even with fewer overall defensive snaps than Sweat. Murphy handled double teams well at the college level, as he is incredibly strong physically. Here is part of what Dane Brugler's The Beast said about Murphy (and how he might be used gap-wise):

 

Overall, Murphy doesn’t have ideal length, but his rare combination of lower-body twitch, natural leverage and power throughout his frame sets his apart. With his disruptive energy, both as a pass rusher and versus the run, he projects as an impact starter who can play shaded nose or three -technique, similar to Grady Jarrett.

Nailed it. Don’t have to be big to play the run. Just have to have gap control and enough low center of gravity + lower body strength to hold your ground. Jarrett is a really good comp. Not a big guy but great gap control.
 

Doesn’t seem like he’s going to make it to us though. If he does - I think it’s a slam dunk.

[dex]

We would all like to think there will be a few good nose tackles available next weekend, but that seems to be the weakest position in the entire draft. Maybe more show up with decent grades elsewhere, but The Beast has only a pitiful handful. This is actually a better than usual draft for 3-techs, but the nose tackle position looks pitiful. 

 

T'Vondre Sweat - 4th round (important to note that Sweat earned the 4th round grade BEFORE the recent DUI)

Fabian Lovett - 5th-6th round

Khristian Boyd - 6th round

Jordan Jefferson 6th-7th round (one of 3 LSU DTs expected to be drafted, a sort of tweener closer to being an actual NT than the other two obvious 3T types)

McKinnley Jackson -6th-7th round (a few other sites have Jackson rated more like a 4th rounder)

 

...And that, sadly, is the entire list. The Bengals have shown some interest in Auburn's Justin Rogers, who is listed as a Priority Free Agent in The Beast. My guess is that Rogers will be drafted by some NFL team anyway, if out of desperation if nothing else. In fact, I'm guessing that this small handful of serviceable note tackles will be over-drafted, with demand so high and supply so few.

 

Nose tackle is a position that Cincinnati absolutely needed to address in free agency, and somehow it never happened. So they have a position problem that may not have a draft answer at all, unless they want to roll the dice on Sweat before another desperate team decides to do the same.

 

[claptonrocks]

53 minutes ago, dex said:

We would all like to think there will be a few good nose tackles available next weekend, but that seems to be the weakest position in the entire draft. Maybe more show up with decent grades elsewhere, but The Beast has only a pitiful handful. This is actually a better than usual draft for 3-techs, but the nose tackle position looks pitiful. 

 

T'Vondre Sweat - 4th round (important to note that Sweat earned the 4th round grade BEFORE the recent DUI)

Fabian Lovett - 5th-6th round

Khristian Boyd - 6th round

Jordan Jefferson 6th-7th round (one of 3 LSU DTs expected to be drafted, a sort of tweener closer to being an actual NT than the other two obvious 3T types)

McKinnley Jackson -6th-7th round (a few other sites have Jackson rated more like a 4th rounder)

 

...And that, sadly, is the entire list. The Bengals have shown some interest in Auburn's Justin Rogers, who is listed as a Priority Free Agent in The Beast. My guess is that Rogers will be drafted by some NFL team anyway, if out of desperation if nothing else. In fact, I'm guessing that this small handful of serviceable note tackles will be over-drafted, with demand so high and supply so few.

 

Nose tackle is a position that Cincinnati absolutely needed to address in free agency, and somehow it never happened. So they have a position problem that may not have a draft answer at all, unless they want to roll the dice on Sweat before another desperate team decides to do the same.

 

McKinnley Jackson could be a factor.

 

 

[|BlackJesus|]

Latest interview with Mims 

 

[sparky151]

3 hours ago, dex said:

We would all like to think there will be a few good nose tackles available next weekend, but that seems to be the weakest position in the entire draft. Maybe more show up with decent grades elsewhere, but The Beast has only a pitiful handful. This is actually a better than usual draft for 3-techs, but the nose tackle position looks pitiful. 

 

T'Vondre Sweat - 4th round (important to note that Sweat earned the 4th round grade BEFORE the recent DUI)

Fabian Lovett - 5th-6th round

Khristian Boyd - 6th round

Jordan Jefferson 6th-7th round (one of 3 LSU DTs expected to be drafted, a sort of tweener closer to being an actual NT than the other two obvious 3T types)

McKinnley Jackson -6th-7th round (a few other sites have Jackson rated more like a 4th rounder)

 

...And that, sadly, is the entire list. The Bengals have shown some interest in Auburn's Justin Rogers, who is listed as a Priority Free Agent in The Beast. My guess is that Rogers will be drafted by some NFL team anyway, if out of desperation if nothing else. In fact, I'm guessing that this small handful of serviceable note tackles will be over-drafted, with demand so high and supply so few.

 

Nose tackle is a position that Cincinnati absolutely needed to address in free agency, and somehow it never happened. So they have a position problem that may not have a draft answer at all, unless they want to roll the dice on Sweat before another desperate team decides to do the same.

 

 

It's probably worth noting that Brugler's evaluations don't match very closely with consensus draftnik boards or real life selections. He has Sweat rated as the 10th best DT and the only one in his top 15 over 320 lbs. I don't see Boyd dropping to the 6th round as he has him or Anderson going undrafted. But there also isn't a whole lot of demand for 2 down run stoppers. Every team wants to have one but not many have multiple. 

[|BlackJesus|]

[|BlackJesus|]

[gupps]

Has Lapham made his prediction yet? He seems to have a pretty good idea of whats going on.

[texbengal]

2 hours ago, gupps said:

Has Lapham made his prediction yet? He seems to have a pretty good idea of whats going on.

I heard the latest pod from Dan Hoard on Bengals.com the other day, and he mentioned that they were going to post another one by tomorrow (Monday) where Lap would make his prediction. Meh.

[New Jersey Bengal]

5 hours ago, texbengal said:

I heard the latest pod from Dan Hoard on Bengals.com the other day, and he mentioned that they were going to post another one by tomorrow (Monday) where Lap would make his prediction. Meh.

He's usually right!

[BBR]

This year he's going to predict JC Latham and that Cade Stover goes pick 104. 

[texbengal]

Lap’s pick is up on the pod on Bengals.com 

[texbengal]

Thought this was interesting. 
 

 

[|High School Harry|]

34 minutes ago, texbengal said:

Lap’s pick is up on the pod on Bengals.com 

and.... 

[texbengal]

1 hour ago, High School Harry said:

and.... 

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/jc-latham/32004c41-5405-9109-f911-a29e9cf30811

[|High School Harry|]

10 minutes ago, texbengal said:

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/jc-latham/32004c41-5405-9109-f911-a29e9cf30811

J.C. Latham.

I'm good with that.

Hope he drops to 18.

My thinking is if we see these guys as special (Murphy, Mims, etc) so do other people and they will be gone.

Latham projects quite high in the OT rankings and hope he drops.

But In Dave I Trust.

[dex]

Cincinnati should be assembling their big board early this week, if they haven't done so yet. Impossible to know which ones will still be available, but almost certainly two to four of these six linemen should fall to the Bengals at pick 18. Cincinnati will surely pick from this group. In alphabetical order:

 

TROY FAUTANU - Played left tackle and some left guard for Washington in his college career, but many sites list him as a guard because he doesn't have ideal OT height. Fautanu does have long arms that increases his length, and most evaluators believe he has the versatility to play guard or tackle. Extremely good pass protector, which fits a passing team like Cincinnati.

 

TALIESE FUAGA - Played right tackle at Oregon State. An absolute mauler in the run game with a nasty streak that coaches love to see. Some people think he could play left tackle too, but right now is pass protection lags behind his run blocking. Would he be the best fit for Cincinnati's pass-first offense?

 

JC LATHAM - Started at right tackle at Alabama for several years. Fits Cincinnati's current Orlando/Trent Brown tackle mold. Latham is a massive tackle with very long arms. Often called the strongest player in the draft regardless of position. Lateral quickness may be lacking, but his calling card is his length and strength.

 

AMARIUS MIMS - The lowest floor but the highest ceiling of all the offensive linemen here. Size, length and athleticism are all off the charts. Very inexperienced, might need a redshirt year. Could eventually be able to play either tackle position at a high level, but probably would be a non-factor for much or all of his rookie year.

 

BYRON MURPHY - A defensive tackle at Texas who doesn't have ideal length but is very athletic and strong. Played both 3-tech and nose tackle in college. Known as a pass blocker but holds up very well against the run. Was part of a deep rotation at Texas where his snaps were carefully managed.

 

JOHNNY NEWTON - Illinois DT who was considered a top 10 pick coming to his last season. Had excellent pass rushing stats at Illinois. Played hurt his senior season but still managed to take a lot of snaps. Also shows up pretty well against the run as a 3-tech.  

 

How would you rank these six linemen on your big board?

 

 

[sparky151]

1 hour ago, High School Harry said:

J.C. Latham.

I'm good with that.

Hope he drops to 18.

My thinking is if we see these guys as special (Murphy, Mims, etc) so do other people and they will be gone.

Latham projects quite high in the OT rankings and hope he drops.

But In Dave I Trust.

 

I trust Lapham has good inside info. But Latham would be a poor pick for the Bengals. He's probably already maxed out and while he's big and strong, he isn't quick. Garrett and Watt would have a field day with him. Mims has a much higher ceiling but the main question would be whether he can reach it under Pollack. 

[spicoli]

 

[sparky151]

27 minutes ago, dex said:

Cincinnati should be assembling their big board early this week, if they haven't done so yet. Impossible to know which ones will still be available, but almost certainly two to four of these six linemen should fall to the Bengals at pick 18. Cincinnati will surely pick from this group. In alphabetical order:

 

TROY FAUTANU - Played left tackle and some left guard for Washington in his college career, but many sites list him as a guard because he doesn't have ideal OT height. Fautanu does have long arms that increases his length, and most evaluators believe he has the versatility to play guard or tackle. Extremely good pass protector, which fits a passing team like Cincinnati.

 

TALIESE FUAGA - Played right tackle at Oregon State. An absolute mauler in the run game with a nasty streak that coaches love to see. Some people think he could play left tackle too, but right now is pass protection lags behind his run blocking. Would he be the best fit for Cincinnati's pass-first offense?

 

JC LATHAM - Started at right tackle at Alabama for several years. Fits Cincinnati's current Orlando/Trent Brown tackle mold. Latham is a massive tackle with very long arms. Often called the strongest player in the draft regardless of position. Lateral quickness may be lacking, but his calling card is his length and strength.

 

AMARIUS MIMS - The lowest floor but the highest ceiling of all the offensive linemen here. Size, length and athleticism are all off the charts. Very inexperienced, might need a redshirt year. Could eventually be able to play either tackle position at a high level, but probably would be a non-factor for much or all of his rookie year.

 

BYRON MURPHY - A defensive tackle at Texas who doesn't have ideal length but is very athletic and strong. Played both 3-tech and nose tackle in college. Known as a pass blocker but holds up very well against the run. Was part of a deep rotation at Texas where his snaps were carefully managed.

 

JOHNNY NEWTON - Illinois DT who was considered a top 10 pick coming to his last season. Had excellent pass rushing stats at Illinois. Played hurt his senior season but still managed to take a lot of snaps. Also shows up pretty well against the run as a 3-tech.  

 

How would you rank these six linemen on your big board?

 

 

 

Mims - Fuaga - Fautanu - Newton- Latham - Murphy.

 

We don't have to use pick 18 on a RT or 3T.  I'd be fine taking a CB or WR or TE if they were a top player at their position, ie a top 2 CB, top 4 WR, or top TE. 

 

We can get a big body NT in round 3 or later. We can get a decent RT prospect at 49. So we can take the player at 18 who improves our roster the most. That's not the same thing as BPA. 

[texbengal]

1 minute ago, sparky151 said:

 

I trust Lapham has good inside info. But Latham would be a poor pick for the Bengals. He's probably already maxed out and while he's big and strong, he isn't quick. Garrett and Watt would have a field day with him. Mims has a much higher ceiling but the main question would be whether he can reach it under Pollack. 

Personally, I think you underestimate Latham. He may not be as athletic as Mims but he is quick. 
 

And when I hear/read guys like Lap, OBJ, Baldinger, some former All-Pro OL he mentioned on the video that liked Latham the best, and Louis Riddick (former personnel

exec)… as well as whoever the exec quoted in the NFL.com evaluation is who thinks Latham is the best T, I’ll take those as informed endorsements. 
 

But maybe it won’t even matter. Guess we will see on Thursday. 

[JC]

Murphy 

Fuaga

Mims

Fautanu

Newton

Latham

 

Murphy is oozing with AP potential and would probably play the most out of any of the guys next year. I don’t think Latham or Murphy will be there. Would be over the moon with Fuaga. Mims would make me nervous but potentially a grand slam. Newton looks to have the floor of a solid to really good interior rusher. I just can’t trust Latham without testing. The draft guys on X really seem to like him though. They should get a really good player on Thursday but if they can trade down and get another T100 pick it won’t hurt my feelings either.

[sparky151]

7 minutes ago, texbengal said:

Personally, I think you underestimate Latham. He may not be as athletic as Mims but he is quick. 
 

And when I hear/read guys like Lap, OBJ, Baldinger, some former All-Pro OL he mentioned on the video that liked Latham the best, and Louis Riddick (former personnel

exec)… as well as whoever the exec quoted in the NFL.com evaluation is who thinks Latham is the best T, I’ll take those as informed endorsements. 
 

But maybe it won’t even matter. Guess we will see on Thursday. 

 

The problem is they are watching Latham's tape. And he does have good tape for the most part, though Texas and Michigan got the better of him. But Alabama is a flop factory when it comes to NFL linemen. They get elite recruits like Latham, put them through an NFL caliber strength program, and give them top coaching. So they usually have a good O-line with some highly ranked prospects. Then those guys get overdrafted and are disappointments at the NFL level. Think of guys like Chance Warmack (top 10 pick as a guard), Evan Neal (top 10 pick), Alex Leatherwood (mid first rounder who didn't make it to year 3). Even Jedrick Wills and Jonah Williams were taken in the first half of round 1 and not lived up to expectations. 

 

If Latham were coming from Michigan State or UCLA or North Carolina with the same tape, he'd be a better prospect because he'd have more room for improvement. Alabama is the new Nebraska, don't get suckered. 

[dex]

8 minutes ago, texbengal said:

Personally, I think you underestimate Latham. He may not be as athletic as Mims but he is quick. 
 

And when I hear/read guys like Lap, OBJ, Baldinger, some former All-Pro OL he mentioned on the video that liked Latham the best, and Louis Riddick (former personnel

exec)… as well as whoever the exec quoted in the NFL.com evaluation is who thinks Latham is the best T, I’ll take those as informed endorsements. 
 

But maybe it won’t even matter. Guess we will see on Thursday. 

Latham fits the Bengals current style of OT. WE all know that Burrow doesn't like inside pressure. The idea is to push the EDGE rusher out wide and make him come all the way around. That gives Burrow time to step up into the pocket. Latham is so massive and strong, plus has idea arm length. You can get around Latham eventually but it takes several seconds. Meanwhile...Burrow has already stepped up and put the ball in the air.

[JC]

Albert Breer in his newest column:

 

What you need to know: Cincinnati’s gone into the past few drafts with an offensive line need and this year’s no different, with the departure of Jonah Williams opening a spot opposite Orlando Brown Jr. at tackle. In a class where seven or eight might go in the first round, it’s hard to get a handle on which ones will be there at 18, but this might be Tyler Guyton or Amarius Mims territory. I also wouldn’t rule out Bowers, if he somehow slips (I can’t imagine he’ll be there at 18) or a receiver (such as LSU’s Brian Thomas) to get ahead of the potential departure (sooner or later) of Tee Higgins.