Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='bengals8580' timestamp='1306770457' post='995329'] So you think he'd coach a team that could lose scholarships and a bowl ban for years? I look like a biased fool haha you're saying Urban Meyer would coach a team who is going to be sanctioned by the NCAA, how is that not biased and foolish? [/quote] this isn't even worth a response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengals8580 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306770523' post='995330'] this isn't even worth a response. [/quote] That doesnt even make sense. Why would a top notch coach take a job at a school who will be facing ncaa sanctions. Only someone who is foolish and biased would think they would. Urban meyer has nothing to prove, if he coaches again it would be to win national championships. He wont be able to do that at OSU when theyre banned from bowl games for a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='bengals8580' timestamp='1306770457' post='995329'] So you think he'd coach a team that could lose scholarships and a bowl ban for years? I look like a biased fool haha you're saying Urban Meyer would coach a team who is going to be sanctioned by the NCAA, how is that not biased and foolish? Plus, Urban couldnt handle the stress of coaching at UF, physically and emotionally. You think he'd want to coach at OSU? Herbstreit moved out of columbus because theyre fans were nuts. And not in a good way. [/quote] I think the whole reason they are naming Luke the interim coach is to see what happens. If the sanctions are not severe they may get Urban. If they are, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengals8580 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Jason' timestamp='1306771498' post='995333'] I think the whole reason they are naming Luke the interim coach is to see what happens. If the sanctions are not severe they may get Urban. If they are, who knows. [/quote] I agree, if the sanctions are not severe, Urban would be a good possibility. But Im thinking the sanctions will be severe. SI has an article coming out next week with new allegations. Including hookers for recruits, ted ginn sr being paid to funnel recruits into OSU, and players taking 2 week courses and getting full credit. That is why I think the sanctions will be severe, and why I think theres no way Urban would take that job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='bengals8580' timestamp='1306771390' post='995332'] That doesnt even make sense. Why would a top notch coach take a job at a school who will be facing ncaa sanctions. Only someone who is foolish and biased would think they would. Urban meyer has nothing to prove, if he coaches again it would be to win national championships. He wont be able to do that at OSU when theyre banned from bowl games for a few years. [/quote] so a coach would turn down his dream job, that is also one of the top jobs in the country, just because he may lose some scholarships for a year or two? Right. The job will be far more sought out than you think. Only coaches already at the top 10-15 schools will be the ones passing. Unemployed coaches who want back in, and coaches at other schools will line up around the block to interview, even if they aren't at full strength scholarship wise for the first year or two. It's Meyer's job if he wants it, and he's always wanted it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengals8580 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306771836' post='995335'] so a coach would turn down his dream job, that is also one of the top jobs in the country, just because he may lose some scholarships for a year or two? Right. The job will be far more sought out than you think. Only coaches already at the top 10-15 schools will be the ones passing. Unemployed coaches who want back in, and coaches at other schools will line up around the block to interview, even if they aren't at full strength scholarship wise for the first year or two. It's Meyer's job if he wants it, and he's always wanted it. [/quote] In your own words, "By the way, nice going acting like a biased fool." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTA513 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Someone get a hold of Palmer and ask him what he thinks about this news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='bengals8580' timestamp='1306772162' post='995336'] In your own words, "By the way, nice going acting like a biased fool." [/quote] whatever helps you sleep at night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Jason' timestamp='1306771498' post='995333'] I think the whole reason they are naming Luke the interim coach is to see what happens. If the sanctions are not severe they may get Urban. If they are, who knows. [/quote] I suspect that, as has been suggested often elsewhere, Tressel falling on the sword will dampen a lot of the punishment the university would have received had he stayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306772649' post='995339'] I suspect that, as has been suggested often elsewhere, Tressel falling on the sword will dampen a lot of the punishment the university would have received had he stayed. [/quote] Assumptions and more assumptions. 1. OSU is no ones dream job right now. They are going to get smacked,,, its a perfect storm. Problems that are pervasive with the team and a hard headed NCAA commissioner trying to make a point meet one another. 2. Urban Meyer is unemployed because he wants to be unemployed. Its due to his health. OSU fans, OSUs scandals and Ohio weather are not going to get a guy like Meyer in here, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sois Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [b][size="7"]Leach to tOSU![/size][/b] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1306769434' post='995321'] http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/05/08/osu-mess-leaves-fans-frustrated.html?sid=101 No, are you saying that you are not biased for OSU? "Only the other guys cheat. That became obvious to me long ago. When your favorite school commits a violation of any kind, it's "an isolated incident" or "an unfair rule" or "not that big a deal." Either "everybody's doing it" or "at some places it's a lot worse." Your alma mater "may have made a mistake or two" or "may have bent the rules a little" or "is a victim of circumstance." Other schools cheat. Yours doesn't." [/quote] I'll take you ignoring the question as a yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Elflocko| Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='sois' timestamp='1306774234' post='995342'] [b][size="7"]Leach to tOSU![/size][/b] [/quote] I should have put an -/+ on how long it would take for this to show up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jza10304 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 OSU fans are sounding a lot like New Yorkers in not being able to understand why someone wouldn't want to go there. The Meyer talk sounds like a lot of mental masturbation going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khatmandude Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306772649' post='995339'] I suspect that, as has been suggested often elsewhere, Tressel falling on the sword will dampen a lot of the punishment the university would have received had he stayed. [/quote] That's what usually happens.....the NCAA tells the school that the coach needs to go one way or the other and if that happens, they won't throw the book at OSU. If Tressel didn't resign, he would have been fired IMO. To think otherwise is to ignore history...........11 out of the past 12 coaches who lied to the NCAA were either fired or resigned (forced obviously). I think Urban Meyer would be the logical choice but his family is saying the won't coach anywhere in 2011.......obviously it leaves the door open for 2012 and Luke Fickel getting the interim job is hinting to a long term plan being in place that involved someone other than Luke Fickel being the head coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='IKOTA' timestamp='1306777560' post='995346'] That's what usually happens.....the NCAA tells the school that the coach needs to go one way or the other and if that happens, they won't throw the book at OSU. If Tressel didn't resign, he would have been fired IMO. To think otherwise is to ignore history...........11 out of the past 12 coaches who lied to the NCAA were either fired or resigned (forced obviously). I think Urban Meyer would be the logical choice but his family is saying the won't coach anywhere in 2011.......obviously it leaves the door open for 2012 and Luke Fickel getting the interim job is hinting to a long term plan being in place that involved someone other than Luke Fickel being the head coach. [/quote] yea I suspect that they'll get hit with a 2-3yr punishment of scholarships and maybe postseason ban. Luke Fickel has the job for 2011. Then in 2012, Urban Meyer, another unemployed coach, or a coach not already at an elite program will jump at taking the job knowing that they'll probably have a 1-2 year free pass. In someone like Urban Meyer's case he knows he has enough of a resume that he'll have plenty of job security in the position. In 2012 he wouldn't have any expectations and can not overly stress about the job. Further, I don't think he'd pass on the job in 2012 as it may be another 5-10 years before he got a shot at the OSU job, which he clearly wants. IMO Meyer will take the job in 2012 and ride out the last 1-2 years of the storm. And honestly, its a win win for both sides in a bad situation. Urban gets the job he's always wanted with no pressure to start, and Ohio State gets a top coach who has a stronghold in recruiting elite prospects from the south. Sanctions or not it will still be a highly sought after job. The sanctions will go away and any incoming coach has a 1-2 year free pass to start. Coaches will still want it unless they're already at an elite program. Now if the sanctions push more than 3-4 years, that's a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306775365' post='995343'] I'll take you ignoring the question as a yes. [/quote] In the part that you quoted I answer you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1306767953' post='995315'] Everytime this discussion happens you bring this up and every time you are wrong. They can receive the items only if they agree to not sell them. Had they not agreed to this they would not have the chance to receive the items. They gave up the chance to sell the item in order to get the chance to receive the item. They have an amateur status. In order to maintain that status (and play in a sport governeed by the NCAA) they must not sell the items. They in effect have possession but not ownership of the items in the eyes of OSU and the NCAA. They would not be eligible to receive such items unless they agreed to not sell it within their time at the school. However, they also have every right to sell it, legally. However, once they sell it they are no longer eligible to compete in amateur athletics because they are in effect getting paid. Its not the law....they can sell it. They can't sell it and still compete as an amateur. They have a choice of whether or not to sell it. Also, OSU has every authority over its students. Its not a right to go to that school. It might not be a law that you can't do something in a dorm room, however it might be against the rules for OSU and cause for dismissal. That would include having contingencies around an award...as in you can sell this if and when.....You receive this award (scholarship) if you meet this goal. [/quote] Sigh. What is the NCAA and where does its rule making authority come from? I say the NCAA is an association of colleges and universities and it has the rule making authority they grant it. Do you disagree? If not, it's well established in the law that you can't delegate to a 3rd party a power you don't yourself have. I can't give somebody else power of attorney to sell your house because I don't own it. So the question is whether, NCAA rules aside, OSU can require students generally, and athletes in particular, to sell or not sell their personal property. If OSU were a private institution and the athlete agreed, they probably could. OSU however is a public entity. So the question is whether they can make admission or participation in sports conditional on selling or not selling personal property. The US Supreme court said states couldn't make receiving benefits conditional on exercising or not exercising personal rights in the manner pleasing to whoever was handing out the benefits. Thus public housing agencies can't ban tenants from owning firearms, schools and libraries can't make meeting rooms available only to groups they like, etc. So did the players "agree" to not sell their memorabilia? Maybe. Is that agreement enforceable by the NCAA or OSU? Nope. It's what's called an adhesion clause and would be tossed by any court who examined the matter. Why? Because keeping money out of the hands of college students isn't a lawful purpose by educational institutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1306779016' post='995349'] Sigh. What is the NCAA and where does its rule making authority come from? I say the NCAA is an association of colleges and universities and it has the rule making authority they grant it. Do you disagree? If not, it's well established in the law that you can't delegate to a 3rd party a power you don't yourself have. I can't give somebody else power of attorney to sell your house because I don't own it. So the question is whether, NCAA rules aside, OSU can require students generally, and athletes in particular, to sell or not sell their personal property. If OSU were a private institution and the athlete agreed, they probably could. OSU however is a public entity. So the question is whether they can make admission or participation in sports conditional on selling or not selling personal property. The US Supreme court said states couldn't make receiving benefits conditional on exercising or not exercising personal rights in the manner pleasing to whoever was handing out the benefits. Thus public housing agencies can't ban tenants from owning firearms, schools and libraries can't make meeting rooms available only to groups they like, etc. So did the players "agree" to not sell their memorabilia? Maybe. Is that agreement enforceable by the NCAA or OSU? Nope. It's what's called an adhesion clause and would be tossed by any court who examined the matter. Why? Because keeping money out of the hands of college students isn't a lawful purpose by educational institutions. [/quote] Starting a post with "Sigh" tells me all I need to know about the rest of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1306781464' post='995352'] Starting a post with "Sigh" tells me all I need to know about the rest of it. [/quote] Your hate for Ohio State and rejoice for their current situation clouds your judgement. Is this bad for OSU? Yes. Is this the demise of OSU? Hardly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Tigers Johnson' timestamp='1306781776' post='995353'] Your hate for Ohio State and rejoice for their current situation clouds your judgement. Is this bad for OSU? Yes. Is the the demise of OSU? Hardly. [/quote] +1 The sanctions will go away and it will still be a desirable job, and desirable to recruits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky151 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1306781464' post='995352'] Starting a post with "Sigh" tells me all I need to know about the rest of it. [/quote] So you admit you're unable to answer the questions I asked or address the substance of the argument about the limits of NCAA rulemaking? The NCAA claims they can make any rules they want, or at least those which a majority of their members adopt. Do you agree with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1306786009' post='995357'] So you admit you're unable to answer the questions I asked or address the substance of the argument about the limits of NCAA rulemaking? The NCAA claims they can make any rules they want, or at least those which a majority of their members adopt. Do you agree with that? [/quote] I admit that I find your responses so lacking of merit when they begin with something like "Sigh" that I dont read them.Hearing free condos, drugs and gambling will be in the SI article to be released today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='MichaelWeston' timestamp='1306786593' post='995358'] I admit that I find your responses so lacking of merit when they begin with something like "Sigh" that I dont read them. Hearing free condos, drugs and gambling will be in the SI article to be released today. [/quote] admitting that you don't even read his posts only shows that you have no interest in having a rational, unbiased and adult conversation about the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWeston Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 [quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1306786835' post='995359'] admitting that you don't even read his posts only shows that you have no interest in having a rational, unbiased and adult conversation about the situation. [/quote] I read your posts, so does that mean if I have a conversation with you that it is a childish irrational biased one? What does that say about you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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