The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly - Redskins

[mongo]

[quote name='SocalBengalEd' timestamp='1348500047' post='1162574']
I watched the game twice already, if you think Rey is improving ill sell you some land in Florida. He was horrid yesterday. Even the announcers said he was " Having a tough time out there". Even the usual Rey supporters jumped off that wagon yesterday.
[/quote]

First, everyone actually does have land in Florida to sell right now, so the joke doesn't work. Second, No one has a 'horrid' day racking up 13 tackles. Only 4 guys racked up more than 13 tackles week 3, and only 8 guys have racked up more than 13 tackles in single game all season. Third, If you haven't seen any improvement over his week one disappearing act, there's a barrier here. He was invisible week one. He was there week three.

So my questions are:

Do you disagree he was totally non-productive week one?

Do you disagree he was more productive week three?

Do you not believe going from non-productive to more productive is 'improvement'?

[mongo]

[quote name='alleycat' timestamp='1348500937' post='1162578']
With you 100%. If I have the time I'll go through shortcuts and break down every snap focusing on him for the board. He WAS the Redskins' game plan, and they played him to perfection.
[/quote]

Is that the perfection that scored 3 points in the first half, or the perfection that lost?

I'm not trying to say the guy is playing like a Pro Bowler, but to suggest he hasn't even improved from the week one bombing we took is nuts.

[alleycat]

You have no knowledge of middle linebacker play. I'm sorry. Either that or you weren't watching him. And game plans evolve. As they saw how inept he was, they went after him more. And I don't want to hear another fucking quote of his tackling numbers. A real MLB is making tackles at the line, or a few yards off. There's a reason we probably have the worst YPP in the league right now, and that reason has long bushy hair and tattoos and wears number 58.

One of Rey's biggest errors is taking himself out of the play. He routinely runs AWAY from the ballcarrier to take on the lead blocker. I've been watching him get worse and worse at this for years. Then he turns and follows and jumps in on a play. They guy is a disaster on the field. A disaster.

[akiliMVP]

I watched the entire game and have no idea how he had 13 tackles. Take away the missed tackles and he may have set the single game record.

He's more of a headache tha helpful at this point. Not sure if it's injury related, gaining too much weight, not smart enough or confident enough. Probably a combination. I hope we just move on after this season.

[Jason]

[quote name='mongo' timestamp='1348501483' post='1162580']
First, everyone actually does have land in Florida to sell right now, so the joke doesn't work. Second, No one has a 'horrid' day racking up 13 tackles. Only 4 guys racked up more than 13 tackles week 3, and only 8 guys have racked up more than 13 tackles in single game all season. Third, If you haven't seen any improvement over his week one disappearing act, there's a barrier here. He was invisible week one. He was there week three.

So my questions are:

Do you disagree he was totally non-productive week one?

Do you disagree he was more productive week three?

Do you not believe going from non-productive to more productive is 'improvement'?
[/quote]

A middle linebacker in a 4-3 defense is going to make tackles. Especially when the other team is out there for 74 plays and 34 of them are runs. That's just the nature of the position.

But he's not making "plays". He looks slow (then again, RG3 will make a lot of LBs looks slow) and he missed multiple tackles.

No, he's not the only reason the defense is struggling right now, but he's certainly not making it any better.

[mongo]

[quote name='Jason' timestamp='1348502085' post='1162585']
A middle linebacker in a 4-3 defense is going to make tackles. That's just the nature of the position.

But he's not making "plays". He looks slow (then again, RG3 will make a lot of LBs looks slow) and he missed multiple tackles.

No, he's not the only reason the defense is struggling right now, but he's certainly not making it any better.
[/quote]

I agree with all of that, and no one is saying he's playing well. To flatly say there's been no improvement isn't true.

[Jason]

[quote name='mongo' timestamp='1348502304' post='1162586']
I agree with all of that, and no one is saying he's playing well. To flatly say there's been no improvement isn't true.
[/quote]

Ok, he's gone from an F- to an F.

Happy?

[SocalBengalEd]

[quote name='akiliMVP' timestamp='1348502078' post='1162584']
I watched the entire game and have no idea how he had 13 tackles. Take away the missed tackles and he may have set the single game record.

He's more of a headache tha helpful at this point. Not sure if it's injury related, gaining too much weight, not smart enough or confident enough. Probably a combination. I hope we just move on after this season.
[/quote]





I think what they meant to say was 13 missed/overrun/lost in space tackles.

[mongo]

[quote name='alleycat' timestamp='1348501873' post='1162583']
You have no knowledge of middle linebacker play. I'm sorry. Either that or you weren't watching him.[/quote]

I watched him do more this week than last week, and a lot more than the week before. He's making tons of mistakes, I would never pretend he isn't. But watch that Ravens game. He wasn't even late to the party. He just never showed up.

[quote]And game plans evolve. As they saw how inept he was, they went after him more.[/quote]

Of course they evolve. They went to the triple option in the third quarter, and had success. Then, we adjusted, and they had less success. Then, we went into prevent, and Rey sat in the middle.

[quote]And I don't want to hear another fucking quote of his tackling numbers. A real MLB is making tackles at the line, or a few yards off. There's a reason we probably have the worst YPP in the league right now, and that reason has long bushy hair and tattoos and wears number 58.[/quote]

Tackles matter, particularly since he wasn't even making those in week one. I'm not sure how much I need to stress the improvement, but I will again. I'm not saying he's playing great. I'm saying he's showing improvement over week one. If I have to show stats to illustrate this point, I will. Disregarding the fact he almost tripled the number of tackles he was in on in this week than in week one doesn't make sense.

[quote]One of Rey's biggest errors is taking himself out of the play. He routinely runs AWAY from the ballcarrier to take on the lead blocker. I've been watching him get worse and worse at this for years. Then he turns and follows and jumps in on a play. They guy is a disaster on the field. A disaster.
[/quote]

Not sure I disagree with any of that, although I wouldn't call him a disaster. I think he's showing improvement, and I think the team will give him until at least the bye to keep showing improvement.

[mongo]

[quote name='Jason' timestamp='1348502423' post='1162587']
Ok, he's gone from an F- to an F.

Happy?









[/quote]

That's fine. I don't care if anyone says he should be benched for Wally the Woodchuck. Just be honest when you do so. Saying he hasn't gotten any better, or, like I've read in the Gameday thread, that he's worse than ever is just not being honest.

[Hooky]

I didn't know Maualuga's nickname is Mongo.

[mongo]

[quote name='Hooky' timestamp='1348505637' post='1162598']
I didn't know Maualuga's nickname is Mongo.
[/quote]

The 'm' isn't capitalized, and I tend to speak much more highly of myself than I do of Rey.

I just think there's no need to pile on when the honest truth is more than enough for those that think he should ride the pine. 'He has shown improvement, but is really bad works just fine.'

Rey is not playing as I think he should, or as I think a MLB should play. I think there are reasons for the poor play, signs he is better than two weeks ago, and concerns he won't cut loose the way he should. In the 70's, I'd have given him a couple shots of whiskey, and told him the QB and RB were talking shit about his mom... Sadly, we've evolved beyond the time when that was acceptable.

[Bengals1181]

[color=#333333][font=Arial, sans-serif][background=rgb(245, 245, 245)]
[url="https://twitter.com/joereedy"][b]Joe Reedy[/b] ‏[size=3][s]@[/s][b]joereedy[/b][/size][/url][/background][/font][/color][color=#333333][font=Arial, sans-serif][background=rgb(245, 245, 245)]
Deion Sanders on NFL Network last night: "Andrew Hawkins is emerging to be one of the best [slot receivers] in the game.”[/background][/font][/color]

[alleycat]

He's such a great story. From getting cut multiple times to that kind of praise. Plus, with his brother's connection to the city, he's going to have some real loyalty.

[Phatcat]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1348508000' post='1162609']

[color=#333333][font=Arial, sans-serif][background=rgb(245, 245, 245)][url="https://twitter.com/joereedy"][b]Joe Reedy[/b] ‏[size=3][s]@[/s][b]joereedy[/b][/size][/url][/background][/font][/color]
[color=#333333][font=Arial, sans-serif][background=rgb(245, 245, 245)]Deion Sanders on NFL Network last night: "Andrew Hawkins is emerging to be one of the best [slot receivers] in the game.”[/background][/font][/color]
[/quote]

Aside what he does after he gets the ball in his hands, which is amazing.... He has phenomenal hands. He makes some very very tough catches.

[Lewdog]

How anyone can defend Maualuga at this point is beyond me. They have to be a blind, deaf, and dumb homer, or they just read the stat sheet on Monday mornings.

[alleycat]

[quote name='Phatcat' timestamp='1348508729' post='1162613']
Aside what he does after he gets the ball in his hands, which is amazing.... He has phenomenal hands. He makes some very very tough catches.
[/quote]

I just love to watch the way he runs. He's so compact. Even as he was breaking away for his TD yesterday he looks like he's running with crazy knee bend and high stepping all at the same time. I think it's what allows him to have his agility, but also "disappear" from defenders.

[|kennethmw|]

[quote name='mongo' timestamp='1348506782' post='1162603']
The 'm' isn't capitalized, and I tend to speak much more highly of myself than I do of Rey.

I just think there's no need to pile on when the honest truth is more than enough for those that think he should ride the pine. 'He has shown improvement, but is really bad works just fine.'

Rey is not playing as I think he should, or as I think a MLB should play. I think there are reasons for the poor play, signs he is better than two weeks ago, and concerns he won't cut loose the way he should. In the 70's, I'd have given him a couple shots of whiskey, and told him the QB and RB were talking shit about his mom... Sadly, we've evolved beyond the time when that was acceptable.
[/quote]

Sorry, mongo, but saying he's improved doesn't fit the diatribe presented by these group of sofa ass-grooving, amateur talent evaluators. Their "evaluation skills" have evolved to a tremendous level in their own minds, and continues to increase daily.

[Lewdog]

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1348509332' post='1162622']
Sorry, mongo, but saying he's improved doesn't fit the diatribe presented by these group of sofa ass-grooving, amateur talent evaluators. Their "evaluation skills" have evolved to a tremendous level in their own minds, and continues to increase daily.
[/quote]

You're right, when 90+% of the board watching the game sees missed tackles, bad angles, and Rey getting swallowed up in blocks, we all must be wrong. Next week can you come to my house and tell me what Rey is doing each play so I can better understand how he is doing his job? Thanks in advance.




By the way, did you see how I made that post belittling and disagreeing with you without calling you names? A 'professional' like you should have perfected this by now.

[alleycat]

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1348509332' post='1162622']
Sorry, mongo, but saying he's improved doesn't fit the diatribe presented by these group of sofa ass-grooving, amateur talent evaluators. Their "evaluation skills" have evolved to a tremendous level in their own minds, and continues to increase daily.
[/quote]

I played MLB in college, so I feel like I'm a bit more than an amateur talent evaluator for that position in particular. It also happens to be why it's the position I focus on the most - and was why I was calling out Rey two years ago.

Odell was also undisciplined (and occasionally got burned for over-aggressiveness), but he went 100 mph and frequently bypassed the blocker to get the ball carrier. Rey seriously chooses to take on the blocker INSTEAD of the ball carrier, including in cases like yesterday, when he had a clear open shot at the ballcarrier. In other words, he actually had to run FURTHER on a couple of plays to get to the blocker instead of running right to the ball.

I'm all for a MLB stuffing blocks, as that's one of his primary responsibilities. But you stuff a block when it is going to plug a hole - and then you shed off and make (at least and arm) tackle to slow the guy down as he's passing by. But in so many cases Rey has a better angle on the ball than the blocker - and he goes for the blocker anyway. It's brick-headedly stupid.

[SouthPaw]

[quote name='mongo' timestamp='1348503531' post='1162591']
I watched him do more this week than last week, and a lot more than the week before. He's making tons of mistakes, I would never pretend he isn't. But watch that Ravens game. He wasn't even late to the party. He just never showed up.



Of course they evolve. They went to the triple option in the third quarter, and had success. Then, we adjusted, and they had less success. Then, we went into prevent, and Rey sat in the middle.



Tackles matter, particularly since he wasn't even making those in week one. I'm not sure how much I need to stress the improvement, but I will again. I'm not saying he's playing great. I'm saying he's showing improvement over week one. If I have to show stats to illustrate this point, I will. [size=5][b]Disregarding the fact he almost tripled the number of tackles he was in on in this week than in week one doesn't make sense.[/b][/size]






Not sure I disagree with any of that, although I wouldn't call him a disaster. I think he's showing improvement, and I think the team will give him until at least the bye to keep showing improvement.
[/quote]


It most certainly does. There were far less opportunities in week one. Joe Flacco lit them up like a christmas tree with ray rice only carrying the ball about.....11 times? Its sad when people have to sit here and defend a fourth year players "improvement" for hours. Im not saying its all his fault either, but defending the man's "improvement" after four years reminds me of this board's take on carson palmer two year's ago. Palmer wasnt good, maualuga isnt good. Its time to move on. I personally am salivating at the prospect of potentially having Manti Te'o next year. More than likely wont happy as they will probably look for outside linebackers, but man that would be great.

[mongo]

[quote name='kennethmw' timestamp='1348509332' post='1162622']
Sorry, mongo, but saying he's improved doesn't fit the diatribe presented by these group of sofa ass-grooving, amateur talent evaluators. Their "evaluation skills" have evolved to a tremendous level in their own minds, and continues to increase daily.
[/quote]

You're on your own for some of that. I think Rey is playing better than at the start of the season, but still playing poorly. I hope to see him settle in, and play like he'll die if he doesn't beat the crap out of the offense. I have doubts he'll do it... It's tough to understand why he's not going for it. He should know the defense inside and out, understand it's a contract year, and feel Burfict waiting for his job. It's like everything has lead him to an ass, but he's refusing to kick it.

[sparky151]

Good: All the receivers, Dalton, Dunlap, MJ, Atkins, a win

Bad: tackling, especially in run defense; Redskins secondary and OTs; halftime adjustments

Ugly: the refs

Funny: I was at a bar in Columbus because the local CBS station chose the Browns for the early game and Steelers for the late one. When the Browns game ended, they switched to the Saints/Chiefs OT game. When that ended, they switched to Jets/Dolphins. The bar has DirecTV which blacked out the Steelers since it was supposedly being shown by the local affiliate. The amount of swearing from the Steelers fans was impressive until their game came on at the beginning of the second quarter. What was extra funny was they couldn't decide who to curse more, DirecTV or Channel 10.

[Jason]

[quote name='sparky151' timestamp='1348510438' post='1162631']
Good: All the receivers, Dalton, Dunlap, MJ, Atkins, a win

Bad: tackling, especially in run defense; Redskins secondary and OTs; halftime adjustments

Ugly: the refs

[b]Funny: I was at a bar in Columbus because the local CBS station chose the Browns for the early game and Steelers for the late one. When the Browns game ended, they switched to the Saints/Chiefs OT game. When that ended, they switched to Jets/Dolphins. [color=#ff0000]The bar has DirecTV which blacked out the Steelers since it was supposedly being shown by the local affiliate.[/color] The amount of swearing from the Steelers fans was impressive until their game came on at the beginning of the second quarter. What was extra funny was they couldn't decide who to curse more, DirecTV or Channel 10.[/b]
[/quote]

That is the one annoying thing about NFL Sunday Ticket.

[alleycat]

[quote name='SouthPaw' timestamp='1348510010' post='1162629']
It most certainly does. There were far less opportunities in week one. Joe Flacco lit them up like a christmas tree with ray rice only carrying the ball about.....11 times? Its sad when people have to sit here and defend a fourth year players "improvement" for hours. Im not saying its all his fault either, but defending the man's "improvement" after four years reminds me of this board's take on carson palmer two year's ago. Palmer wasnt good, maualuga isnt good. Its time to move on. I personally am salivating at the prospect of potentially having Manti Te'o next year. More than likely wont happy as they will probably look for outside linebackers, but man that would be great.
[/quote]

Ah yes, the only thing more decried around here than calling out Rey was calling out Carson.

I'm curious. I've only seen Te'o play in the MSU game, and he did quite well (although he does strike me as a wee bit bulky for today's NFL - in fact, he reminds me of Rey in College). But for those of you who are fans, where would he play for us? MLB? I have a strong feeling that Vontaze is the heir apparent there. Is it worth spending a first on a guy who's playing a position for which we may already have a solution (granted, we have nothing outside and little depth either way)? Or could Te'o play elsewhere?

As much as Marvin trumpets "a LB is a LB" speech, we've never really had those kind of super versatile LBs on our team. Probably because the skills sets don't overlap (as in, a LB is NOT JUST ANY LB).

I would think a WLB superstar in the first would be best - although I can't say I think it's worth the value. Maybe a SLB who can be a serious multi-threat (a Von Miller type, though that is soooo rare).