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Draftman

-----BENGALS CUTS!!!!!!-----

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And now, for all the JT haters... this is the difference between why JT is employed, and Rudi, Deltha, and Willie are not.

All four are older guys on the downside of their careers.

JT is a team-first guy who practices hard, and sets a positive example for his younger teammates.

Rudi, Deltha, and Willie... not so much. All were once very good at their jobs, but as they have gotten older and less valuable on the field, they have failed to become more valuable off of it. They are all still me-first guys whose production no longer outweighs their egos.

..just my .$02

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[quote name='KangarWhoDey' post='693413' date='Aug 30 2008, 05:57 PM']And now, for all the JT haters... this is the difference between why JT is employed, and Rudi, Deltha, and Willie are not.

All four are older guys on the downside of their careers.

JT is a team-first guy who practices hard, and sets a positive example for his younger teammates.

Rudi, Deltha, and Willie... not so much. All were once very good at their jobs, but as they have gotten older and less valuable on the field, they have failed to become more valuable off of it. They are all still me-first guys whose production no longer outweighs their egos.

..just my .$02[/quote]

I agree that Rudi and Deltha were me first guys... not sure I feel the same about Willie... but certainly possible..
MY concern is that I'm not sold on Andrews... great athlete, but he's just hasn't got the football IQ of someone who has played for years... and will he ge here next year????

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[quote name='lslmustang' post='693416' date='Aug 31 2008, 09:10 AM']I agree that Rudi and Deltha were me first guys... not sure I feel the same about Willie... but certainly possible..
MY concern is that I'm not sold on Andrews... great athlete, but he's just hasn't got the football IQ of someone who has played for years... [b]and will he ge here next year????[/b][/quote]
I hope so. But it should be clear either way, that Willie would not have been.

Andrews has a one year tryout to determine if he's worth a long term deal, or if he goes next year and we slide Collins into the rotation in his stead. Let's hope he proves to be a beast, and signs a long term deal.

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Ahmad Brooks should have taken the money from
Rivers for #55. He'll need it.

I wonder if Rivers will/can switch to #55 now?

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[quote][size=5][b]Vet vetting [/b][/size]
By GEOFF HOBSON
August 30, 2008

When was the last time the Bengals cut three of their former Pro Bowlers on the same day?

It happened Saturday as the Bengals cleared out right tackle Willie Anderson, running back Rudi Johnson, and cornerback Deltha O'Neal on Cutdown Day to get down to the 53-player limit.

They all made Hawaii in 2005 as the Bengals celebrated the AFC North title. Johnson's 1,458 yards and O'Neal's 10 interceptions in that season are still in the book as club records.

"Obviously the play fell off in '07, and we just haven't seen a lot of change thus far this year," said head coach Marvin Lewis in a late afternoon news conference. "It's a hard decision to make."

Even though he returned to practice last week, the Bengals apparently decided they hadn't seen enough of the new and improved Johnson this summer and cut the man projected to once be their bell-cow running back in 2008.

[b]Anderson confirmed he turned down an offer to cut his salary and make up the rest with incentives, and said he won't be back for a 13th season. Anderson, 33, said he's not sure if he'll continue to play and will contemplate retirement.

"But I want football people to know I can still play at a high level," Anderson said. "It wasn't about money. It was about principle. After I had a conversation with upper management today, I was shocked to find out some of the things I was supposedly saying or doing. I want everyone to know I can still play. I credit management. They did up the offer." [/b]

Lewis said there's a chance the vets could return at a lower salary, but that has been termed unlikely. If they did at all, the soonest would probably be after Opening Day because vested veterans are guaranteed their salaries if they're on a first weekend roster.

[b]A league source said O'Neal also turned down an offer to renegotiate his $3 million salary. He had lost his third corner job to David Jones after missing all of the voluntary camps.

Also cut were linebackers Ahmad Brooks and Jim Maxwell as the Bengals kept just six backers and went heavy with nine D-linemen and 10 DBs. They went with just four corners and one is free-agent rookie Simeon Castille. They went with six safeties with a nod to special teams, cutting only John Busing and keeping sixth-rounder Corey Lynch, CFL refugee Kyries Hebert, and two-time special teams tackling leader Herana-Daze Jones. [/b]

Jordan Palmer, Carson's younger brother, became the third QB when Jeff Rowe got cut and made some history. According to the Elias Sports Bureau the only other brother quarterback tandem to play on the same team in the Super Bowl era is Ty and Koy Detmer for the 1997 Eagles And Koy was on injured reserve while both Palmers are active.

Fullback Jeremi Johnson made the club after having weight problems and on the offesive line backup center Dan Santucci was one of nine guys even though he's out for a couple of more weeks with a high ankle sprain.

The expected six wide receivers made it with rookies Andre Caldwell and Jerome Simpson, as well as veterans Glenn Holt and Antonio Chatman backing up Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmandzadeh.

"It's a tough day in Cincinnati. Those are three guys that helped us turn the corner," said Houshmandzadeh of Anderson, Johnson and O'Neal, a trio that is now in free agency "I think they'll go some place and play well and they'll have that extra motivation."

[b]The working number was about $8 million in '08 money saved under the salary cap, which could benefit guys like Houshmandzadeh and kicker Shayne Graham, two other one-time Pro Bowlers whose contracts are up after this season.

Anderson already received a $2 million bonus back in January that he was to make on top of his $3 million salary for this year. He said the offer was to make it up in incentives if he played.

"But it was too exhausting," said Anderson of his efforts to convince people in the club he was healthy to play. [/b]

"We want to keep this positive," said Schaffer, who negotiated a five-year, $26 million deal for Johnson that had two years left. "Obviously we got wind they were moving in a different direction when (ESPN) reported they were trying to trade him. We think Rudi's got plenty of football left and we're going to look for the best situation for him."

Johnson's release, which first surfaced on ProFootballTalk.com Saturday afternoon, appears to leave the Bengals with three running backs in Chris Perry, Kenny Watson and DeDe Dorsey. Lewis, showing some impatience with Johnson's lingering hamstring problem, made Perry the starter a few weeks ago.

Lewis' theme after last year's injury-riddled season is to have more sure answers when it came to health.

"We haven't seen the day-to-day-to-day that you need," Lewis said of Anderson. "I know it's contrary to popular belief. But it's important that we start our season healthy, and I've made that very clear to you guys from the start, so we have an opportunity to put as close to as many guys out there that we know are going to be healthy as we can. And that can practice day-to-day."

It may not be a John McCain-sized gamble, but it's a gamble just the same for the Bengals when it comes to the running game. They have basically exchanged one of their most durable running backs of all time for one of their most fragile in Perry.

But the Bengals must also think it's a gamble to keep Johnson after basically no training camp, a stretch during which Lewis has harped on the importance of practicing.

"We haven't seen Rudi play (in preseason). I've seen Rudi practice very few times, and cut it loose very few times," Lewis said. "He got off to a great start. I thought he had an outstanding offseason. I thought he had a great spring and was doing everything, but unfortunately he seemed to suffer from the hamstring, and being unable to go out and play and cut it loose. So, as I told you guys, I still see better than I hear. And that was important to us."

Johnson, who turns 29 in a month, hurt his hamstring in the first week of camp and never played in a preseason game during a curious August the Bengals reportedly tried to trade him.

Perry, who has been healthy for an entire season only once in his five NFL seasons, practiced nearly every day and while he only averaged 3.1 yards per carry in the preseason, he was able to carry 39 times for the most active four-game stretch of his career.

[b]On Saturday, Lewis anointed Perry.

"This is what he's asked for and wanted," Lewis said. "He's worked extremely hard to return from his injury to have this (opportunity), and he's made good on it. Now it's time, so he has everything to play for. It ought to be exciting to him. [/b]

"Right now he'll be our starting back," he said. "We have felt very comfortable keeping him in there on third down, so I think he'll log more playing time than anyone we've had back there for a while."

But before he hurt his hamstring last year and was limited to 2.9 yards per his 170 carries, Johnson had made his mark as a relentless inside runner supplying first-down reliability. From 2004-2006 he led the NFL in carries and twice set the Bengals season rushing record after taking over for Corey Dillon late in the 2003 season. He also has three of the four busiest seasons by a back in Bengals history, topped by his 361 carries in 2004.

He arrived back in Cincinnati this spring refreshed and invigorated after putting on about 12-15 pounds during the offseason in an effort to get back to his more powerful days of '04 and '05, when he set the club rushing record in back-to-back seasons with an average of 4.2 yards per carry.

Still, Johnson claimed earlier this week that the Bengals have been trying to get rid of him ever since they drafted him out of Auburn in the fourth round in 2001. And there were some grumblings about his inability to hit the home run.

Since 2006 he has averaged 3.5 yards per carry and hasn't had a run longer than 22 yards in 29 straight games and a run longer than 33 yards in 48 straight games.

Throw in Johnson's hamstring problems and their inability to see what he can do, and it appears the Bengals weren't going to spend $3.5 million this season on Johnson's salary to find out.

One slim option is they could re-sign Johnson at a lower rate.

Could one landing spot be Miami? While head coach of the Cowboys, Bill Parcells expressed interest in Johnson amid a flurry of Dillon trade rumors in 2003.

The Bengals figure to save about $3 million on the salary cap with the Johnson move.

The Bengals consider Anderson to be their greatest right tackle in history. Anderson, a four-time Pro Bowler tied with Jim Breech in appearing in the sixth most Bengals games of all time with 181, remained a backup to Stacy Andrews after training camp.

Anderson looks to have rebounded from the most injury-plagued season of his career. A foot injury from late in 2006 iced him for the entire 2007 preseason, but it was a deep knee bruise in the third game of the regular season that stopped his streak of 116 straight starts and limited him to seven games.

Anderson embraced the move to start Andrews, but he also said his goal was to get back into the lineup. The Bengals wanted to see him practice and he did work the bulk of training camp until the last two weeks or so. He didn't practice the week before the third preseason game against the Saints, but took a lot of snaps and even went into the fourth quarter.

He didn't play Thursday night in the preseason finale, when veterans such as Johnson, Houshmandzadeh, and Carson Palmer also sat. But Anderson said he mised the game because orthotics he had ordered were too tight and caused his toe to swell up.

He said he went home to Atlanta on Friday to get the new shoes and was "shocked" to get the phone call looking for him to redo the deal.

"I missed the game because of the orthotics and that's all," Anderson said. "Not because of anything lingering."[/quote]




[url="http://www.bengals.com/news/news.asp?story_id=6997"]http://www.bengals.com/news/news.asp?story_id=6997[/url]

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DAMN MAN THIS SHIT IS FUCKED UP MAN 2 BEST GUYS ARE GOING RUDI AND ANDERSON MAN FUCK THIS MAN IF CHAD JOHNSON GOES NEXT YEAR TOO MAN IAM OUT IAM NOT ANYMORE BENGALS FAN MAN I CANT BELIVE THIS SHIT MAN YOU GUYS DONT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE CUTS MAN!RUDI MAN!

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[quote]"Right now he'll be our starting back," he said. "We have felt very comfortable keeping him in there on third down, [b]so I think he'll log more playing time than anyone we've had back there for a while[/b]."[/quote]


Ooooh burn. Kick a Rudi whilst he's cut eh :)

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[quote name='ChadJohnsonFan' post='693435' date='Aug 31 2008, 08:43 AM']DAMN MAN THIS SHIT IS FUCKED UP MAN 2 BEST GUYS ARE GOING RUDI AND ANDERSON MAN FUCK THIS MAN IF CHAD JOHNSON GOES NEXT YEAR TOO MAN IAM OUT IAM NOT ANYMORE BENGALS FAN MAN I CANT BELIVE THIS SHIT MAN YOU GUYS DONT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE CUTS MAN!RUDI MAN![/quote]


I'm 50/50 on the Rudi cut. I think he still has a pro bowl season left in him and I'd really hate to think he gets picked up somewhere and runs it up our ass. On the other hand he's had the hammy issues that don't seem to be getting any better. For what it's worth, Rudi ranks right up there with James Brooks and Ickey Woods as my all time favorite Bengal running backs and I really hate to see him go. One down side to this that I see is that Perry is an injury waiting to happen. I pray to God that he doesn't blow his ankle out in the first game of the season. I would imagine if he does, and Rudi hasn't been picked up anywhere, they'd go begging to him and I'd hope he'd tell them to suck his dick. But he knows it's a business and wouldn't do that.

Willie, he hasn't done shit in a few seasons. I hate to see him go but in all fairness he really hasn't been on the field enough to warrant keeping him around. I'll fell really sorry for him on a personal level if we do go to the SuperBowl this season and win <cough>. Not gonna happen, of course, but if it did I'd feel sorry for Willie that he didn't get the ring he so obviously deserves, if for nothing else then wasting a fantastic career in a city that is destined to have a losing football team year after year. Poor guy should have been somewhere where he had a chance. His loyalty to stay with this fucked up outfit can not be questioned.

Anyway, they'll never see this but to Rudi and Willie, guys, thanks for all the time you put in. You'll never be forgotten in the hearts of the people of Cincinnati.
MULLY

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[quote name='Squirrlnutz' post='693442' date='Aug 31 2008, 08:56 AM']I hope he can get a full 16 games in...it will make it very difficult to get out of bed on Sundays if he gets hurt early.[/quote]


Man, ain't that the fuckin' truth. My biggest problem with cutting Rudi is that Perry hasn't done shit to prove he can last an entire season as the bell cow. I don't think he can do it and I pray he proves me wrong.
MULLY

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[quote name='Fulcher_33' post='693448' date='Aug 30 2008, 07:02 PM']Man, ain't that the fuckin' truth. My biggest problem with cutting Rudi is that Perry hasn't done shit to prove he can last an entire season as the bell cow. I don't think he can do it and I pray he proves me wrong.
MULLY[/quote]

Make it three here.

Even if he makes it through a full year without hurts...who's to say he's an auto 1000 yard back? Watson sure as hell isn't..and neither is Dorsey.

By Committee never has been the answer. I'm feeling a strange sinking feeling with the RB's...haven't felt that since the days of Broussard and Fenner.

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Who knows what goes on behind the scenes. If Rudi was doggin it or didn't get along with coaching then I'm glad they got rid of him for the culture change regardless of whose left.

It helps me atleast, to think of the Giants. When they got rid of Tiki...they got rid of all their offensive production for the past 3-5 seasons. Everyone and their mother thought their was no way this team could possibly do anything without this guy. Guys like Ahmad Bradshaw and Mike Boss were 3rd string nobodys who impressed no one in preseason or early in the season and managed to rise to the challenge when they were called upon.

Gotta hope guys like DeDe, David Jones, Chatman, Koostra, Blackstock, Shirley can all contribute when they get on the field and make this team better then they have been. Its not all about feilding superstars at every position.

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[quote name='Squirrlnutz' post='693455' date='Aug 31 2008, 09:18 AM']Its not all about fielding superstars at every position.[/quote]


That's true enough. We've had a team full of superstars for a few years now that can't do shit.
MULLY
this year ain't gonna be any different

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[quote name='Fulcher_33' post='693460' date='Aug 30 2008, 07:29 PM']That's true enough. We've had a team full of superstars for a few years now that can't do shit.
MULLY
this year ain't gonna be any different[/quote]
Take a wait and see approach, Mully. We may yet be worse!
:lol:
I actually think we will be better, provided we don't suffer too many injuries again and have too many inexperienced guys on the field at once outside of ST's like last season.

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I like the changes. I appreciate all they did as bengals but they have to free up some money and stop putting up with the shitty attitudes. IMO Rudi, Willie, and Deltha played with no hunger. I think this should send a strong message to the team.

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[quote name='ChadJohnsonFan' post='693435' date='Aug 30 2008, 06:43 PM']DAMN MAN THIS SHIT IS FUCKED UP MAN 2 BEST GUYS ARE GOING RUDI AND ANDERSON MAN FUCK THIS MAN IF CHAD JOHNSON GOES NEXT YEAR TOO MAN IAM OUT IAM NOT ANYMORE BENGALS FAN MAN I CANT BELIVE THIS SHIT MAN YOU GUYS DONT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE CUTS MAN!RUDI MAN![/quote]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


your football knowledge is as terrible as rudi and willie are players at this point in their career.


[quote name='Fulcher_33' post='693446' date='Aug 30 2008, 07:00 PM']I'm 50/50 on the Rudi cut. [b]I think he still has a pro bowl season left in him[/b] and I'd really hate to think he gets picked up somewhere and runs it up our ass. On the other hand he's had the hammy issues that don't seem to be getting any better. For what it's worth, Rudi ranks right up there with James Brooks and Ickey Woods as my all time favorite Bengal running backs and I really hate to see him go. One down side to this that I see is that Perry is an injury waiting to happen. I pray to God that he doesn't blow his ankle out in the first game of the season. I would imagine if he does, and Rudi hasn't been picked up anywhere, they'd go begging to him and I'd hope he'd tell them to suck his dick. But he knows it's a business and wouldn't do that.

Willie, he hasn't done shit in a few seasons. I hate to see him go but in all fairness he really hasn't been on the field enough to warrant keeping him around. I'll fell really sorry for him on a personal level if we do go to the SuperBowl this season and win <cough>. Not gonna happen, of course, but if it did I'd feel sorry for Willie that he didn't get the ring he so obviously deserves, if for nothing else then wasting a fantastic career in a city that is destined to have a losing football team year after year. Poor guy should have been somewhere where he had a chance. His loyalty to stay with this fucked up outfit can not be questioned.

Anyway, they'll never see this but to Rudi and Willie, guys, thanks for all the time you put in. You'll never be forgotten in the hearts of the people of Cincinnati.
MULLY[/quote]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: every RB on our training camp roster > rudi.

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[quote][size=5][b]Bengals: cutdown analysis [/b][/size]

August 30, 2008 7:20 PM

Posted by ESPN.com's James Walker

[b]Biggest surprise:[/b] Despite head coach Marvin Lewis insisting trade reports were just "rumors," the Bengals cut running back Rudi Johnson today after being unable to find a suitable trade for a wide receiver. Johnson has been battling hamstring injuries for the past year, and the Bengals were unhappy with his progress in training camp. Still, we are a little surprised the team is relying on Chris Perry fulltime as the go-to guy when he hasn't stayed healthy for one season during his entire NFL career. Willie Anderson's release also was a surprise. He had battled leg injuries for the past three or four years and lost his job to Stacy Andrews at right tackle this summer. But the team was expected to keep him around for leadership purposes.

[b]No-brainers:[/b] Rookie receivers Mario Urrutia and Maurice Purify were part of an unimpressive class that was expected to challenge for roster spots. But those two along with highly-drafted rookies Jerome Simpson and Andre Caldwell weren't consistent enough in training camp and the preseason. It was part of the reason the team brought back receiver Chris Henry in a controversial move this summer.

[b]What's next:[/b] Cincinnati will be scanning the wires for receivers. Giving up Johnson for nothing gives the Bengals very little trade bait remaining on their roster. But with ailments to Chad Johnson (shoulder) and T.J. Houshmandzadeh (hamstring) and Caldwell (toe), Cincinnati needs more depth.[/quote]




[url="http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afcnorth/0-0-268/Bengals--cutdown-analysis.html"]http://myespn.go.com/blogs/afcnorth/0-0-26...n-analysis.html[/url]

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[quote][size=5][b]After the cuts [/b][/size]
Saturday, August 30, 2008, 06:52 PM EST [General]

Base salaries for the big cuts:

Willie Anderson $3.15 mil

Rudi Johnson $3.45 mil

Deltha O'Neal $2.85 mil

* Will be interesting to see what happens tomorrow with other free agents. Expect a center and a cornerback at least.

Both Dan Santucci and Kyle Cook are both there at backup center, but I'd expect to see Santucci on the PUP list and another center signed on Sunday.

With the cutting of O'Neal, as of right now, undrafted college free agent Simeon Castille is your fourth cornerback and Antonio Chatman is your punt returner.

Scott Kooistra is your first offensive lineman off the bench if anything happens. He can play guard or tackle.

Jordan Palmer is your third quarterback.

Daniel Coats is your third tight end and backup full back.

Kyries Hebert and Herana-Daze Jones are good on special teams -- you like having safties or linebackers on those squads.

Corey Lynch was impressive in the preseason and made the squad. Mike ZImmer likes smart players above all else it seems, and Lynch is that.

Let's again look at Marvin Lewis' 2nd and 3rd round picks in his time here:

2003 -- Eric Steinbach and Kelley Washington. Gone and gone.

2004 -- Keiwan Ratliff, Madieu Williams, Caleb Miller, Landon Johnson. Gone, gone, gone, gone.

2005 -- Odell Thurman and Chris Henry. Um.... You know the drill

2006 -- Andrew Whitworth and Frostee Rucker. Both still here. Great pick and we'll see on the other.

2007 -- Kenny Irons and no pick in the third round because of the pick of Ahmad Broks in the 2006 supplemental draft. Gone and gone.

2008 -- Jerome Simpson, Pat Sims, Andre Cladwell. Simpson has shown raw talent, and the other two are hurt right now.[/quote]



[url="http://www.thelotd.com/ctrent/blog/2008/08/30/after_the_cuts"]http://www.thelotd.com/ctrent/blog/2008/08/30/after_the_cuts[/url]

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[quote name='Ochosucko' post='693433' date='Aug 30 2008, 07:42 PM']So how many yards is Perry going to get this year if he stays healthy? I could see 1100 rushing and 500 recieving.[/quote]

I'm with you... I think I guessed 1200 yards rushing and 400 receiving the other day when conversating with my buddy.

[quote name='ChadJohnsonFan' post='693435' date='Aug 30 2008, 07:43 PM']DAMN MAN THIS SHIT IS FUCKED UP MAN 2 BEST GUYS ARE GOING RUDI AND ANDERSON MAN FUCK THIS MAN IF CHAD JOHNSON GOES NEXT YEAR TOO MAN IAM OUT IAM NOT ANYMORE BENGALS FAN MAN I CANT BELIVE THIS SHIT MAN YOU GUYS DONT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE CUTS MAN!RUDI MAN![/quote]

what?

[quote name='Fulcher_33' post='693448' date='Aug 30 2008, 08:02 PM']Man, ain't that the fuckin' truth. My biggest problem with cutting Rudi is that Perry hasn't done shit to prove he can last an entire season as the bell cow. I don't think he can do it and I pray he proves me wrong.
MULLY[/quote]

That's the thing though, we still have Watson who I think has looked just as good on his few carries this preseason as he did when he played last year. No matter if he gets yards or not, he puts his head down and drops forward. I think we're going to be okay. We're cutting the bull shit out of this team.

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[quote name='rudi32' post='693365' date='Aug 30 2008, 09:40 PM']I am happy, I am looking at this in a positive way. As allen said, We just got younger and healthy and cheaper. We have $ to bring someone in or extend people. All in all I think they were good cuts[/quote]


Bring in Ashlie Lelie

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[quote name='Rumble In the Jungle' post='693541' date='Aug 30 2008, 09:50 PM']wow...i am freaking shocked :o
i really liked james johnson, i thought he did good.
i really wanted to see the brooks experiment work <_<
john busing is used to the system by now :lol:[/quote]

James Johnson will go to the PS.

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