Andre Smith breaks same foot, could be out for year

[Jamie_B]

[quote name='oldschooler' timestamp='1289509256' post='939996']
[b]Andre Smith breaks same foot, could be out for year[/b]
By GEOFF HOBSON

Updated: 3:25 p.m.

In his second season, right tackle [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/andre-smith/5796e85d-6992-4b91-9630-fde615747967/"][color="#f04e23"]Andre Smith[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/color][/url] has broken his left foot for the second time. On Wednesday during a pass protection set, he suffered a stress fracture of the fifth metatarsal, the bone on the outside of the foot and next to the fourth metatarsal that he broke last season and had surgically repaired in January.

Head coach Marvin Lewis indicated after Thursday's practice that a decision on surgery would be made in the next week and pronounced Smith out for Sunday's game with Dennis Roland getting the start. Surgery would no doubt end Smith's season and it still may be over. When he broke his foot 12 days before the opener on Sept. 1, Smith didn't return to practice until eight weeks later.



[url="http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Andre-Smith-breaks-same-foot-could-be-out-for-year/bec903d0-79bc-4acc-b4cc-86090bd8a0a5"]http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Andre-Smith-breaks-same-foot-could-be-out-for-year/bec903d0-79bc-4acc-b4cc-86090bd8a0a5[/url]
[/quote]


Jesus

[cincity]

If they have to do surgery, do it NOW!!! Don't wait until Jan, so he can be ready for the work ups.

[bengaled]

[quote name='fluhartz' timestamp='1289521332' post='940074']
I can't argue the past... and I am not even trying to..... That still gives him no fucking excuse to come in that out of shape...
There are tons of holdouts throughout the NFL every year... who is the player that has been the most out of shape in the last few...
It's at least between him and Jamarcus Russell... boy...that's some great company....

I have been in the same parallel universe as you for the last twenty years... Being a Bengals fan watching other teams/franchises succeed... and ....

I am not making excuses for the way Mike has run this team either... it has been pathetic for the most part.... but I am not giving this fat ass a pass just because this team drafted him.... Leon, JJ, Keith and Gresh just to name a few..have all done OK.....
[/quote]



your words...

I can see no reason to make excuses for a player to be constantly out of shape and injured for his first two years in the NFL.


if the second part of that statement has as much merit as the first part of it, i should be able to deduce you mean this....

I can see no reason to make excuses for a player to be injured for his first two years in the NFL.

just how fucking stupid does that sound to you? it has my head spinning around like linda blair's.

[bengaled]

[quote name='cincity' timestamp='1289528839' post='940116']
If they have to do surgery, do it NOW!!! Don't wait until Jan, so he can be ready for the work ups.
[/quote]

agree wholeheartedly. and do some research this time and get a different set of drs. and physical therapy personnel than the bullshit group offered up by mike this time around. get the best that your money can buy, because your career might be dependent on it this time around, andre!

[fluhartz]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1289530782' post='940121']
your words...

I can see no reason to make excuses for a player to be constantly out of shape and injured for his first two years in the NFL.


if the second part of that statement has as much merit as the first part of it, i should be able to deduce you mean this....

I can see no reason to make excuses for a player to be injured for his first two years in the NFL.

just how fucking stupid does that sound to you? it has my head spinning around like linda blair's.
[/quote]


because I believe one of the reasons for him getting hurt is him being out of shape....

I'm not fucking stupid either.. I just don't think he has committed himself as much as he could.. He was a stud at Alabama because of raw talent, not because he worked hard...

Me thinking that he hasn't put forth the effort in the pro's is just an opinion.... the college part isn't...

[bengaled]

[quote name='fluhartz' timestamp='1289532126' post='940124']
because I believe one of the reasons for him getting hurt is him being out of shape....

I'm not fucking stupid either.. I just don't think he has committed himself as much as he could.. He was a stud at Alabama because of raw talent, not because he worked hard...

Me thinking that he hasn't put forth the effort in the pro's is just an opinion.... the college part isn't...
[/quote]


so if you are of the belief that him being out of shape was an underlying cause to his original injury, wouldn't you agree that an owner who played an important role in that 30 day holdout should take on responsibility, as well, especially knowing he had signed a 350 lb man with weight issues that had no real means of getting into football shape?

[|Bunghole|]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1289532692' post='940127']
so if you are of the belief that him being out of shape was an underlying cause to his original injury, wouldn't you agree that an owner who played an important role in that 30 day holdout should take on responsibility, as well, especially knowing he had signed a 350 lb man with weight issues that had no real means of getting into football shape?
[/quote]

If all this is true then we shouldn't have drafted him at #6. Oher would have been a better pick there, even if it was a "reach" (like Levi Jones was). I remain totally unconvinced that Andre is going to do much of anything for this franchise as a player.

[cincity]

[quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1289535393' post='940132']
If all this is true then we shouldn't have drafted him at #6. Oher would have been a better pick there, even if it was a "reach" (like Levi Jones was). I remain totally unconvinced that Andre is going to do much of anything for this franchise as a player.
[/quote]


Oher has been getting owned tonight, and he's has a huge edge in experience on Smith... From what I see tonight Oher was nowhere near worth a #6 pick

[bengaled]

[quote name='Bunghole' timestamp='1289535393' post='940132']
If all this is true then we shouldn't have drafted him at #6. Oher would have been a better pick there, even if it was a "reach" (like Levi Jones was). I remain totally unconvinced that Andre is going to do much of anything for this franchise as a player.
[/quote]


but we don't know what would have transpired with a 30 day holdout being a part of mike oher's career. i think it would be safe to say that he'd be a lesser player than the one you watched tonight. who knows how badly that would have affected his career. and for all we know, the player and agent might have held out for a longer period than 30 days.

[BFIH]

There's a reason that Andre Smith slipped way down on the draft board and nobody to blame for that but Andre Smith. If you want to argue we were dumb to gamble on him, I won't argue, but who pushed for Smith? Was it really Mike Brown or was it the Bengals coaching staff?

I don't see anything in Mike Brown's history indicating any overwhelming desire to draft offensive linemen in the first round - Mikey loves skill players not big bodies -- so I tend to think it had to be someone on Marvin's staff who just had to have Andre Smith despite the lousy shape he was in when he worked out driving away almost every other team in the NFL.

[oldschooler]

[size="5"][b]Andre Smith breaks same foot, 'possibly' headed for surgery[/b]
[/size]By GEOFF HOBSON

Updated: 6:10 p.m.

In his second season, right tackle [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/andre-smith/5796e85d-6992-4b91-9630-fde615747967/"]Andre Smith[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] has broken his left foot for the second time and indications are he could be headed to season-ending surgery as soon as next week.

But on Thursday, Jim Gould, who represents Smith along with Alvin Keels, said no decision on surgery has been made.

"It's early in the process," Gould said. "It's a possibility. We all have to talk. Alvin, the family, the doctors, and see what is the best course of action."

On Wednesday during a pass protection set, Smith suffered a stress fracture of the fifth metatarsal, the bone on the outside of the foot and next to the fourth metatarsal that he broke last season and had surgically repaired in January.

No matter what, it looks like his season is done. The procedure would shelve him for six to eight months. Head coach Marvin Lewis pronounced Smith out for Sunday's game with Dennis Roland getting the start. Even when he broke his foot 12 days before the opener on Sept. 1 and didn't have the surgery, Smith didn't return to practice until eight weeks later.

It's another devastating moment for Smith, the sixth pick in the 2009 draft who is looking more and more like other injury-plagued first-round picks of recent Bengals vintage. Running back Chris Perry (2004) only had 177 carries in five seasons and linebacker David Pollack (2005) played in just 17 games before his career ended with a broken neck. Smith played in the last seven games of 2009 and in seven games this season, but the last three games marked his first full NFL outings in which he took the bulk or all of the snaps.

The first surgery involved a rehab of seven months to get him back on the field. A similar time frame would get him to the 2011 spring camps. Lewis said there wasn't a lot of comfort level with that surgery and the foot was still giving Smith problems even before this new injury that occurred when his foot got stepped on.

"Now they have a chance to go back, if that's the course of action, to fix the original and now fix this one," said Lewis of the pros for immediate surgery. "You're talking about the effectiveness of a guy and that injury and what he has to do in planting and putting pressure on it. We'll see. We'll give it a couple of days to see if it calms down."

But Lewis, who has grimly become a foot expert, said the outside bone takes more pressure. One of the reasons Smith didn't have to have surgery right away last year is because that bone is on the inside of the foot and naturally braced.

Complicating the physical concerns are the financial issues. The Bengals have to decide this offseason if they want to exercise a $5 million option in his deal that would make it a six-year contract or decline it and keep it at four years.

The fear is that what happened this past year will happen again. Smith got heavy enough while rehabbing (some reports had him as high as 375 pounds) that it delayed his return to the field. It is believed he is down to 345 pounds after some furious dedication in the cardio and aerobic room but he'll be warned a repeat performance would jeopardize his career.

Lewis doesn't think it will happen because Smith has matured. Lewis and Smith have had their moments. Lewis deactivated Smith for the third game in Carolina when he wasn't happy with him. But asked what another injury like this does to Smith's career, he said, "Nothing. It means it's another bump in the road."

What Smith needed the most - practice and game experience - has now been taken away again. After five penalties in the last three games and a mid-game benching for a snap Monday night, there have been both positives and challenges for what the Bengals feel is a player with potential to be an elite power tackle.

"He got some real taste of starting football and that was good experience for him and one I think he'll be dedicated to because he knows he earned it," Lewis said. "Nobody gave him the starting job this year. He earned it by doing the things I asked him to do and he didn't get to play, or even to suit up, until he did those things. So that doesn't change as he goes into the future.

"He knows the time frame of things. Whether it's back this year or starting over next year, what he has to do. Last year he dealt with the foot in the offseason. I think he'll handle it better. He seems more mature to handle whatever option is decided next week. To handle it and get it done correctly."

» [b]The plan was for quarterback [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/carson-palmer/b2e2fb04-af84-4af9-9491-5c1dd3354623/"]Carson Palmer[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url][/b] to throw Thursday after resting for a day his throwing shoulder sore from a shot Monday might. But Palmer wanted to push it back a day when it was still sore Thursday morning.

But he said he'll throw in Friday's practice, and be ready for the Colts on Sunday in Indianapolis.

"Not worried at all," Palmer said before Thursday's practice. "We played a late Monday game; it's just an extra day of recovery making sure it's ready for Sunday."

"Still sore. Hopefully we'll have him out here tomorrow," Lewis said. "He's being Carson. He's very confident. Still a little bit sore and hasn't stretched it out too bad yet and get ready to go tomorrow."

Wide receiver [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/chad-ochocinco/09ddc7d1-e507-4a75-ab2b-f6f17723cbf8/"]Chad Ochocinco[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (ankle) was back after missing Wednesday, as was running back [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/cedric-peerman/fcb8072d-5378-4c61-962a-7f8b7aa45ecf/"]Cedric Peerman[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (illness). They were both full go. Safety [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/chris-crocker/2772f783-b547-470c-b074-6229e7234ebd/"]Chris Crocker[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (calf), and defensive linemen [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/tank-johnson/56c60130-f938-45cf-aba0-62dece1c4fde/"]Tank Johnson[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (knee), [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/carlos-dunlap/4a065377-8081-4dc1-a80f-daf22d74ba67/"]Carlos Dunlap[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (illness) and Jon Fanene (hamstring) were out again. Linebackers [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/rey-maualuga/72e4f750-08d1-4fa5-abee-a5cfebe1389b/"]Rey Maualuga[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (knee) and [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/keith-rivers/dceb19f7-d3f4-4c9f-a0b2-07286f398461/"]Keith Rivers[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (foot), who were limited Thursday, were on the field. Linebacker [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/roddrick-muckelroy/b1bf7caf-486c-469a-97b4-cc13064cb140/"]Roddrick Muckelroy[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] (ankle) was adde to the report Thursday and was limited.

» [b]Punter [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/kevin-huber/1d34c7f7-455d-407c-9f66-9df83696a5da/"]Kevin Huber[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] and kicker [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/mike-nugent/44701177-8bcb-4bb1-a348-e81af4d4583a/"]Mike Nugent[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url][/b] are going through practice this week at different speeds in the wake of their sluggish performances Monday night. Huber, who had a punt blocked, believes he needs to quicken his get-off and that he's fallen a few split seconds behind. On the other side, Nugent wants to slow down his stride and approach to the balll. He thinks he's getting there "too quick," which is why he's pulled three of his last four field-goal tries from 53, 51 and 45 yards.

» [b]Left tackle [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/andrew-whitworth/3a81696e-e6b3-4abd-8dd0-85e8748fa086/"]Andrew Whitworth[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] says that Colts defensive ends[/b] Dwight Freeney and Robert Mathis "were born to pass rush." He draws Freeney in a rematch of his rookie year game against him when the Colts started the Bengals on their three-game losing streak that ended the 2006 season a win shy of the playoffs. Whitworth says Freeney is better at home not only because of the crowd noise but because his cleats get such a good grip on the FieldTurf that accentuates his speed.

» [b]Cornerback [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/leon-hall/0f379744-8ae4-4952-8f53-75c2f38f43ec/"]Leon Hall[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] preps for his second game[/b] against Colts quarterback Peyton Manning and says even though all his receivers are different from that day in 2008 except for Reggie Wayne, he's still the same. Hall says Manning's brains can overshadow his arm at times.

"He'll throw into double coverage and get it in there," Hall said. "He's got a lot of faith in his arm."

Monday was rare in that Hall got beat on two deep balls, both by Steelers speedster Mike Wallace. True to his rep as a stand-up guy, Hall patiently broke them down.

On the 39-yard touchdown in the fourth quarter, he didn't know it was a gadget pass from wide receiver Antwan Randle El until after the play. "I guessed on the wrong route," he said, praising the Steelers for making a lot of their plays look the same. And on the 35-yard bomb to Wallace that set up another touchdown he said he was fried right away when "I made a false step up on the line."

» [b]Even though [url="http://www.bengals.com/team/roster/cedric-benson/4b42e3bf-7831-490c-97e2-523f8d4d2291/"]Cedric Benson[img]http://www.bengals.com/assets/nflimg/icon-article-link.gif[/img][/url] carried the ball just 15 times[/b] Monday, he was still dragging Wednesday. Not a physical pounding but just a tired tired.

"Guys are tired. It was a late game. I don't think I got home until 1 (a.m.) and then come right back around with a full practice," Benson said before Wednesday's workout. "Got to find something to get you going today."

Head coach Marvin Lewis helped out by cutting the usual two-hour practice by about a half-hour. But by then, Benson had already been into weekly routine. He lifts on Tuesdays, the off day.

"Always," said Benson when asked if he hit the weight room. "I ended up getting up early. I was down here by 11 o'clock yesterday. Didn't really sleep. I feel good. Little sore. A little odds and ends here, but for the most part, it could definitely be worse. I feel great."




[url="http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Andre-Smith-breaks-same-foot-possibly-headed-for-surgery/bec903d0-79bc-4acc-b4cc-86090bd8a0a5"]http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Andre-Smith-breaks-same-foot-possibly-headed-for-surgery/bec903d0-79bc-4acc-b4cc-86090bd8a0a5[/url]

[oldschooler]

[size="5"][b]Bengals' Smith gets another bad break[/b]
[/size]
[size="4"][b]Fractures left foot for second straight season[/b]
[/size]By Joe Reedy • [email="jreedy@enquirer.com"]jreedy@enquirer.com[/email] • November 11, 2010

The run of bad luck for Andre Smith continues.

The Bengals offensive tackle is likely to miss the rest of the season after breaking the fifth metatarsal in his left foot during practice on Wednesday.

Smith, whom the Bengals selected with the sixth pick in the 2009 NFL Draft, also missed the first 10 games of his rookie season after breaking the same foot. He was injured just two days after signing his contract following a lengthy holdout.

Coach Marvin Lewis on Thursday said Smith suffered his latest injury during a pass protection drill in Wednesday's practice. The fifth metatarsal is located on the outside of the foot and has more stress put on it.

"We'll go through a series of some options that he'll work to and we'll go from there," Lewis said. "When he got stepped on and he turned at the same time, it torques the foot. It's a bad stretch of bad luck for him. It's what happens in football."

The injury is another setback for Smith, who has made progress this season. After being in danger of being placed on the physically unable to perform list and having Lewis question his maturity during training camp, Smith earned a starting spot at right tackle Oct. 24 against Atlanta.

According to Enquirer reviews of the game broadcasts, Smith played 257 snaps in seven games and was on the field for all but two snaps in the three games he started. He was pulled for two snaps during the Bengals' 27-21 loss to Pittsburgh on Monday night but was back in the game on the next series.

"It's a shame. He was starting to come on," Bengals offensive line coach Paul Alexander said. "We were working on a number of technical things that would have really helped him."

Last year, Smith opted not to have surgery on his left foot until the offseason because the bone he broke, the fourth metatarsal, is on the inside of the foot and doesn't take as much stress. Smith had surgery in February but missed all offseason workouts and did not start practicing until midway through the preseason.

"Now that he's got a taste of real starting football, I think that was a good experience for him and one that he'll be dedicated to now that he's earned it," Lewis said. "He earned it by doing things I asked him to do and he didn't get to play or suit up until he did those things."

Agent Jimmy Gould, who along with Alvin Keels represents Smith, said that there has been no decision about another surgery but said it is a possibility.

This time, Smith might opt to have surgery sooner rather than later, especially since the Bengals were not happy with how the surgery last offseason went. Lewis said a second surgery might allow doctors to do some cleanup work.

Alexander said Smith has grown up enough to handle his latest challenge.

"I believe he is more in tune with the maturity level of a professional, and I look for him to overcome this setback and still have a good career," Alexander said.



(Click the link for the entire article)

[url="http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20101111/SPT02/11120367/1066/SPT02/Bengals-Smith-gets-another-bad-break"]http://news.cincinna...other-bad-break[/url]

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1289532692' post='940127']
so if you are of the belief that him being out of shape was an underlying cause to his original injury, wouldn't you agree that an owner who played an important role in that 30 day holdout should take on responsibility, as well, [b]especially knowing he had signed a 350 lb man with weight issues that had no real means of getting into football shape?[/b]
[/quote]



are you fucking kidding me? Andre didn't show up in shape because he "didn't have the means"??? He didn't have access to a sidewalk? A floor to do situps? His agents didn't float him money to train, like they do other top picks?

I know you say football shape, but the fact is he needed to be in shape in general before you can worry about being in football shape. Using the holdout (regardless of who's fault) as an excuse as to why he wasn't shape is, well, I can't find a word to describe how stupid it is.

I'm sorry ed, but that's fucking ridiculous and you know it.

[TheBeaverHunter]

This team is a train wreck this season.

[phillybengal]

[quote name='mongo' timestamp='1289491508' post='939928']
So you think he passed his physical while hiding a broken foot?
[/quote]

Yep. Because things don't slip through the cracks on physicals.....*cough*Bryant*cough*

It didn't have to be full blown broken, but he knew something happened during those disgusting shirtless workouts and told his agent to get it done.

[fluhartz]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1289566967' post='940192']
are you fucking kidding me? Andre didn't show up in shape because he "didn't have the means"??? He didn't have access to a sidewalk? A floor to do situps? His agents didn't float him money to train, like they do other top picks?

I know you say football shape, but the fact is he needed to be in shape in general before you can worry about being in football shape. Using the holdout (regardless of who's fault) as an excuse as to why he wasn't shape is, well, I can't find a word to describe how stupid it is.

I'm sorry ed, but that's fucking ridiculous and you know it.
[/quote]


Bengals1181..... this is what you are doing my friend...


[img]http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx223/fluhartz/brickwall.jpg[/img]

[Le Tigre]

Some of this talk really is fucking stupid.

Anyone who couldn't see his improvement towards what we were expecting with each passing week, either wasn't paying attention, or didn't want to pay attention.

[TheBeaverHunter]

I wish we would have gone after Langston Walker like I wanted to last year.

[fluhartz]

[quote name='Le Tigre' timestamp='1289571738' post='940221']
Some of this talk really is fucking stupid.

Anyone who couldn't see his improvement towards what we were expecting with each passing week, either wasn't paying attention, or didn't want to pay attention.
[/quote]


yes the improvement has absolutely been there the last couple of weeks... It just shouldn't take the #6pick over all 1.5 years to show that improvement....

again I am hoping he turns in to the beast he was drafted to be... he has just been a major disappointment so far...

[texbengal]

It's a shame - he was starting to come on. Still a work in progress - in effect, he's a rookie. Pass pro needs some work, but he can definitely get movement in the run game.

I'm not so concerned about the surgery or the healing part... I just want him to stay in shape, so he gets the benefit of a full off-season of spring camps, training camp, etc. where he's taking snaps in practice, not working out on a treadmill for weeks on end in an attempt to drop weight, so he can get on the field for practice.

[bengaled]

[quote name='Bengals1181' timestamp='1289566967' post='940192']
are you fucking kidding me? Andre didn't show up in shape because he "didn't have the means"??? He didn't have access to a sidewalk? A floor to do situps? His agents didn't float him money to train, like they do other top picks?

I know you say football shape, but the fact is he needed to be in shape in general before you can worry about being in football shape. Using the holdout (regardless of who's fault) as an excuse as to why he wasn't shape is, well, I can't find a word to describe how stupid it is.

I'm sorry ed, but that's fucking ridiculous and you know it.
[/quote]



there's nothing stupid about weight control. it's a very serious issue that affects the majority of our population. andre was a 350 lb young man who'd just graduated from the restraints of college. it's not at all surprising that his weight ballooned after being put on the shelf. he was an unsupervised fat kid....who got fatter. you can't interject yourself fairly into that situation and make judgement. you've never walked in those shoes.

[bengaled]

[quote name='fluhartz' timestamp='1289532126' post='940124']
because I believe one of the reasons for him getting hurt is him being out of shape....

I'm not fucking stupid either.. I just don't think he has committed himself as much as he could.. He was a stud at Alabama because of raw talent, not because he worked hard...

Me thinking that he hasn't put forth the effort in the pro's is just an opinion.... the college part isn't...
[/quote]


and for the record...i didn't call you stupid. i asked you how stupid this statement sounded to you when broken down. big difference!



"I can see no reason to make excuses for a player to be injured for his first two years in the NFL."

[Bengals1181]

[quote name='bengaled' timestamp='1289579978' post='940266']
there's nothing stupid about weight control. it's a very serious issue that affects the majority of our population. andre was a 350 lb young man who'd just graduated from the restraints of college. it's not at all surprising that his weight ballooned after being put on the shelf. he was an unsupervised fat kid....who got fatter. you can't interject yourself fairly into that situation and make judgement. you've never walked in those shoes.
[/quote]



again, why is that mike brown's fault?



I'm one of the biggest Andre Smith supporters here, but blaming his weight gain on the holdout is ludicrous.

[|SF2|]

[quote name='Elflocko' timestamp='1289510040' post='940002']
So can we officially call him a bust yet, or do we have to wait until he breaks it again next year?
[/quote]
No. Only GO can officially call him a bust you idiot.

[|SF2|]

[quote name='cincity' timestamp='1289535700' post='940136']
Oher has been getting owned tonight, and he's has a huge edge in experience on Smith... From what I see tonight Oher was nowhere near worth a #6 pick
[/quote]
He was closer to a number 6 than Andre, thats for sure. Of course its great being Capt. Hindsight.