* AFC NORTH CAP STATUSES *

[Inigo Montoya]

Hendrickson basically said today that he is going to need a new deal, whether that’s here or elsewhere.  He wants the Bengals to win a championship either with him or using picks acquired for him via trade.  He also wants the situation resolved before the draft FWIW.

[BBR]

They're going to have to trade Trey.  Unfortunately, that's probably what it comes down to.

[T-Dub]

1 hour ago, BBR said:

They're going to have to trade Trey.  Unfortunately, that's probably what it comes down to.

 

 

[BBR]

Him and his agent just aren't going to wait around with a year left on the contract hoping they eventually extend him with a contract they like.  If he waits on Chase and Higgins to get signed / traded, then the draft, then his deal - he's just as likely to get told they'll revisit it in the off-season or he'll be tagged.  He's not going to play this year on a below market deal just to get bent over next year with the tag.  This team is going to struggle getting all 3 players done before the draft and he loses a lot of his leverage once the 2nd round of the draft starts and he's probably 3rd on their list.

 

It was actually very smart of him to mention he'd like to help them get a SB whether he's here or not and they get picks back for him to go somewhere else. 

[LostInDaJungle]

3 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Hendrickson basically said today that he is going to need a new deal, whether that’s here or elsewhere.  He wants the Bengals to win a championship either with him or using picks acquired for him via trade.  He also wants the situation resolved before the draft FWIW.

What's wild...

 

At any point they could have called Hendrickson's agent and just said "Hey, we need to do big deals for Chase and Higgins, but we definitely want to extend Trey." And Hendrickson wouldn't need to be saying this.

Much like the Whitworth situation... Players end up feeling disrespected because  you're not showing the urgency they feel befits being one of the league's best at a premium position. Instead the Brown fam proudly don't discuss contracts in season...

You have the league's #1 in sacks. He wants to be here. WTF are you waiting for?? Sign him until he's 35 and let the future be in the future. Spread out that cap hit. No major injury history and no signs of slowing down. People dream about Garrett, and we can't even make sure the "better than him" we already have knows we want him here long term??

A guy goes out there and puts in the work for you and exceeds expectations, and you can't even let him know he's a valuable piece of the organization?? Are we sure that the Mike/Katie principled stance on contracts signed and honored is really as noble as it sounds? Or is it lawyers demanding their discount bin finds stay discounted?

 

I don't know about you, but when I overperform at work, I expect a raise. And if the people I work for don't appreciate me enough to see to that, I go where I feel appreciated. And I'm not the NFL sack leader. It's not even about the money... It's about showing that player some respect. Guys go and play their heart out for you, and you reward them with silence.

The fact that Trey even has to think that there's a world where the Bengals have to trade him because they're too friggin' stupid to sign the NFL sack leader... That's practically malpractice on the part of the FO. Quick question: Do you want to sign the NFL sack leader? If we didn't have Hendrickson, would you want to sign him as an FA?

At least Jayden Daniels to Tee Higgins is going to be fun to watch next year. This is not a good omen for the upcoming offseason. 

[sparky151]

16 hours ago, BBR said:

They're going to have to trade Trey.  Unfortunately, that's probably what it comes down to.

 

Nonsense. Bengals can't afford to trade Trey. That would leave them with zero-sack Murphy as their top DE plus whatever rookie or free agent they add.

 

Trey is going into the final season of his contract with a cap hit of 18.67 mil and salary of 15.8 mil for 2025. It's easy-peasy to strike a deal that pays him a good bit more and is also good for the team. Let's say they add 2 years to his current deal with 50 mil in new money. A signing bonus of 15 mil would increase his cap number by a modest 5 mil for 2025 while just about doubling his take home pay. That would leave cap hits of 22.5 mil for 2026 and 2027 or less than his revised 2025 cap number. He'd be getting paid 17.5 mil in salary each of the 2 following seasons.

 

And if he wants more than 2 years, just tack on some additional years that the team can get out of if his play falls off. No backloading or cap gymnastics, just a pretty vanilla deal that should work for both player and team.

 

This proposal would certainly be good for the team and I'm pretty sure Trey would accept it. It's like a slightly plussed up Danielle Hunter contract. The Bengals aren't very good at negotiating for a team that's as cheap as they are. So they should just use recent deals for comparable players as a template and fill in new numbers. 

[Inigo Montoya]

Per Spotrac, Hendrickson is 26th in cap hit and tied for 22nd in total cash (salary + bonus) heading into 2025 among all defensive linemen.  His base salary is 11th, while Hubbard is 26th and Rankins is 33rd.  Definitely seems like he is due for a raise and there’s plenty of room that can easily be made available.  

[LostInDaJungle]

On 2/2/2025 at 9:33 AM, Catfish Bob said:

Trey is too old also. He might have a maximum of 3 seasons left before needing to retire. I give him 2 more before he retires. 

You know... It was 2 weeks ago where people were saying we should go after a 34 year old Khalil Mack.

This is the same attitude that Whitworth found so insulting before he went on to play 4 more years with the Rams.

You're welcome to think that... But are you talking to the current NFL sack leader? "Since you're old..." is probably not the best way to start that negotiation. Probably not even the mind set you want to have when you're trying to woo the NFL's best pass rusher. Defensive player of the year. 4 time pro-bowler.

How many games has Trey missed in the last 3 years?? He hasn't missed a game since December 2022, and that was a broken hand.

Sign him until 35 with an easy out in the last two years. Get him his money up front. Be willing to take on $10M in dead money 3 years down the road if you have to. Or paying for a guy who may not be the best in the league anymore but still produces. It wouldn't be the dumbest contract the Bengals ever inked by a long shot.

We have a chance to keep a top 10 reciever and the best defensive player in the league, and we might not because we need to keep Sam Hubbard and Alex Cappa?? Are you ____ serious?? Stop playing into the poor mouthing. Stop listening to Duke Tobin telling you we can't afford good players when we could be sitting on $100M in cap space without blinking an eye. Stop listening to Paul Dehner when he puts up a spreadsheet of player values that assumes the Bengals front office has absolutely zero creativity or savvy when managing the cap.

Earlier in the thread... I laid out the plan. And that didn't restructure Joe for another $20M in cap space. The Bengals can and should extend Trey.

[I_C_Deadpeople]

Some find it bad to have a 30+ year old star but no issue with a 120+ year old owner

[PatternMaster]

On 2/4/2025 at 12:07 PM, Jamie_B said:

 

 

I hear you on Hubbard, but not at his current price tag. 

 

We all know the Bengals honor their deals, no reason to think that won't change. If they let Peko play out his deal, why would they cut Hubbard?

 

On 2/4/2025 at 12:12 PM, stan said:

So they should keep someone on the roster.Making 10 million a year.Because,he is from Cincinnati? That's stupid.

 

No, because when he's healthy he's their 2nd best DE, a team leader, and reps the team in the community. That matters when the Bengals are trying to get public support for a tax payer funded lease agreement on the stadium.

 

10 million for a starting DE isn't crazy, Hendrickson will probably make double that next season. 

 

[Jamie_B]

3 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

 

We all know the Bengals honor their deals, no reason to think that won't change. If they let Peko play out his deal, why would they cut Hubbard?

 

Joe Mixon.

 

Of course Joe went on to be a probowler this year but I digress

[PatternMaster]

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

Joe Mixon.

 

Of course Joe went on to be a probowler this year but I digress

Let's not act like Joe wasn't traded because of his crazy brother-in-law going full O Dog on some white kids with Nerf guns wasn't the reason he was traded...I don't think Hubbard will have that sort of off-the-field activities/issues. 

I loved Mixon and thought we should have kept him but a change of scenery was best for him. 

[|Montana Bengal|]

7 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

Let's not act like Joe wasn't traded because of his crazy brother-in-law going full O Dog on some white kids with Nerf guns wasn't the reason he was traded...I don't think Hubbard will have that sort of off-the-field activities/issues. 

I loved Mixon and thought we should have kept him but a change of scenery was best for him. 

 

And intially it wasn't a trade - It was reported we were releasing him.

[PatternMaster]

Spotrac has a great tool that allows you to manage the cap of any of your favorite sports team

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/manage/_/team/cin#

 

If you use this site it's pretty realistic and it shows how easy it would be to keep everyone that deserves to be kept while adding talented vets to compete for starting spots. If the Bengals don't re-sign Tee, extend Chase and Henderickson, and add proven vets it's because they don't want to not because they don't have the money to do so.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

6 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

 

We all know the Bengals honor their deals, no reason to think that won't change. If they let Peko play out his deal, why would they cut Hubbard?

 

 

No, because when he's healthy he's their 2nd best DE, a team leader, and reps the team in the community. That matters when the Bengals are trying to get public support for a tax payer funded lease agreement on the stadium.

 

10 million for a starting DE isn't crazy, Hendrickson will probably make double that next season. 

 

Counterpoint:  Hubbard has been washed for two years and is not a starting caliber player at this point.

 

Blame it on injuries or whatever else but it’s painfully obvious to everyone who has watched him play.  
 

He needs to take a steep pay cut or he’s getting released.

[Griever]

 

 

[Dautcom08]

10 minutes ago, Griever said:

 

 

 

Thanks to Joe Goodberry and his really kewl logo for stating the obvious, I guess.

[T-Dub]

1 hour ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Counterpoint:  Hubbard has been washed for two years and is not a starting caliber player at this point.

 

Blame it on injuries or whatever else but it’s painfully obvious to everyone who has watched him play.  
 

He needs to take a steep pay cut or he’s getting released.

 

But he shows up for every community photo op!

 

That's very important if you're running a charity trust fund that also manages a football team. Win-win!

[PatternMaster]

On 2/7/2025 at 2:27 PM, T-Dub said:

 

But he shows up for every community photo op!

 

That's very important if you're running a charity trust fund that also manages a football team. Win-win!

 

You're joking but that does matter. The team wants it's players to be good ambassadors in the community that they rely on for support. 

 

On 2/7/2025 at 12:41 PM, Inigo Montoya said:

Counterpoint:  Hubbard has been washed for two years and is not a starting caliber player at this point.

 

Blame it on injuries or whatever else but it’s painfully obvious to everyone who has watched him play.  
 

He needs to take a steep pay cut or he’s getting released.

 

Injuries or whatever...lol..it's not whatever. It's injuries. Let's make this a realistic example, if you were injured on the job would u expect to be fired even though you have been an exemplary employee...of course not. 

 

Hubbard is a team captain that performs at a high level when he's on the field, cutting him before his contract expires because of injuries is not going to happen.

 

When healthy Hubbard is the 2nd best DE on the roster currently, until that changes I don't see Hubbard getting cut.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

29 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

 

You're joking but that does matter. The team wants it's players to be good ambassadors in the community that they rely on for support. 

 

 

Injuries or whatever...lol..it's not whatever. It's injuries. Let's make this a realistic example, if you were injured on the job would u expect to be fired even though you have been an exemplary employee...of course not. 

 

Hubbard is a team captain that performs at a high level when he's on the field, cutting him before his contract expires because of injuries is not going to happen.

 

When healthy Hubbard is the 2nd best DE on the roster currently, until that changes I don't see Hubbard getting cut.

 

He hasn’t been the 2nd best DE since 2022 and he hasn’t been able to stay healthy.  Goodwill has kept him around for two seasons of poor performance.  I think it ends in 2025 without a pay cut.  

[claptonrocks]

1 hour ago, Inigo Montoya said:

He hasn’t been the 2nd best DE since 2022 and he hasn’t been able to stay healthy.  Goodwill has kept him around for two seasons of poor performance.  I think it ends in 2025 without a pay cut.  

Injuries slowed him.

He can do be relevant by sealing the edge and stringing out plays to his side.

That's what he's outstanding at..

 

 

 

[LostInDaJungle]

4 hours ago, claptonrocks said:

Injuries slowed him.

He can do be relevant by sealing the edge and stringing out plays to his side.

That's what he's outstanding at..

 

 

 

He's been a part of Bengals defense that has failed to do that pretty consistently.

And that's the basic job. Yes, he can do the basic job. Mostly. At best, he comes back healthy and is a slightly above average DE again. Who, to be fair, has shown up in big moments.

That's a position we need to get much younger at quickly either way. Murphy can be just as effective setting the edge. Time to clear out the old growth and let Murphy battle a draft pick (or FA) for the honor of being named starter. Hubbard would be better served with less reps at this point in his career anyway. Guy has more braces on his body than Forrest Gump.

Hubbard, at best is an expensive luxury. I have no issue with keeping him, but if he's your excuse for why the Bengals are out of money... Why are you not extending Hendrickson?? To keep Sam Hubbard because he's a good dude? Why are you not resigning Tee? Because good ol' Sammy signed your wife's tits once?? Sam Hubbard at his current best still leaves the defense needing to upgrade LE. Hubbard has been pretty average throughout.

Really, it's not even a problem for Sam Hubbard if he's worth his current contract on the open market. Tell Trey you want to cut him and he's popping champagne. If you think it's "mean", you're admitting he's not worth what we pay him. And really... He's only going to make $4 million plus a year with some other team. Bummer. He'll have to fill up with regular unleaded.  

I have zero interest in being the nicest team to never win a Super Bowl.

[claptonrocks]

57 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

He's been a part of Bengals defense that has failed to do that pretty consistently.

And that's the basic job. Yes, he can do the basic job. Mostly. At best, he comes back healthy and is a slightly above average DE again. Who, to be fair, has shown up in big moments.

That's a position we need to get much younger at quickly either way. Murphy can be just as effective setting the edge. Time to clear out the old growth and let Murphy battle a draft pick (or FA) for the honor of being named starter. Hubbard would be better served with less reps at this point in his career anyway. Guy has more braces on his body than Forrest Gump.

Hubbard, at best is an expensive luxury. I have no issue with keeping him, but if he's your excuse for why the Bengals are out of money... Why are you not extending Hendrickson?? To keep Sam Hubbard because he's a good dude? Why are you not resigning Tee? Because good ol' Sammy signed your wife's tits once?? Sam Hubbard at his current best still leaves the defense needing to upgrade LE. Hubbard has been pretty average throughout.

Really, it's not even a problem for Sam Hubbard if he's worth his current contract on the open market. Tell Trey you want to cut him and he's popping champagne. If you think it's "mean", you're admitting he's not worth what we pay him. And really... He's only going to make $4 million plus a year with some other team. Bummer. He'll have to fill up with regular unleaded.  

I have zero interest in being the nicest team to never win a Super Bowl.

Truth...

Annarumo vision of Treys backup was bad.

Murphy best qualities will come at LDE...

 

 

[PatternMaster]

13 hours ago, LostInDaJungle said:

He's been a part of Bengals defense that has failed to do that pretty consistently.

And that's the basic job. Yes, he can do the basic job. Mostly. At best, he comes back healthy and is a slightly above average DE again. Who, to be fair, has shown up in big moments.

That's a position we need to get much younger at quickly either way. Murphy can be just as effective setting the edge. Time to clear out the old growth and let Murphy battle a draft pick (or FA) for the honor of being named starter. Hubbard would be better served with less reps at this point in his career anyway. Guy has more braces on his body than Forrest Gump.

Hubbard, at best is an expensive luxury. I have no issue with keeping him, but if he's your excuse for why the Bengals are out of money... Why are you not extending Hendrickson?? To keep Sam Hubbard because he's a good dude? Why are you not resigning Tee? Because good ol' Sammy signed your wife's tits once?? Sam Hubbard at his current best still leaves the defense needing to upgrade LE. Hubbard has been pretty average throughout.

Really, it's not even a problem for Sam Hubbard if he's worth his current contract on the open market. Tell Trey you want to cut him and he's popping champagne. If you think it's "mean", you're admitting he's not worth what we pay him. And really... He's only going to make $4 million plus a year with some other team. Bummer. He'll have to fill up with regular unleaded.  

I have zero interest in being the nicest team to never win a Super Bowl.

 

Who said Hubbard was the reason the reason are poor? Rankins is making the same amount as Hubbard, who would you rather have?

 

Cappa, Rankins, Volson, and Moss should get cut before Hubbard. That almost 30 million in cap savings by cutting those 4 players. 

 

This idea that Hubbard is some albatross around the Bengals neck is silly. He's not dead weight or the reason why Hendrickson, Chase, or Higgins haven't gotten new deals.

[LostInDaJungle]

21 minutes ago, PatternMaster said:

 

Who said Hubbard was the reason the reason are poor...Rankins is making the same amount as Hubbard, who would you rather have. 

 

Capps, Rankins, Volson, and Moss should get cut before Hubbard. 

 

This idea that Hubbard is some albatross around the Bengals neck is silly. He's not dead weight or the reason why Hendrickson, Chase, or Higgins haven't gotten new deals.

Awesome. When Tee and Chase get their deals and Trey gets extended, I will be happy to root for Hubbard.