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How long is it going to take to get a good Oline in front of Joe?


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7 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

Cappa has been fine as well

 

It's really just the tackles that are the problem.

 

We haven't drafted a good linemen in years even under Marvin, which makes me think it's not the coaching it's who ever is the O-line scout 

Under Marvin we also failed at drafting LB's which has now changed. Need to change how they evealuate OL. 3 OL picks in 2021 and now of them producing, big ouchie.

 

FYI - Ketchup Whisperer was on Siruis today said "Williams weakness is his strength". Get what he means but it came out odd. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

Under Marvin we also failed at drafting LB's which has now changed. Need to change how they evealuate OL. 3 OL picks in 2021 and now of them producing, big ouchie.

 

FYI - Ketchup Whisperer was on Siruis today said "Williams weakness is his strength". Get what he means but it came out odd. 

 

 

I dunno about that, strength doesn’t matter when you completely whiff on a block like he did twice yesterday.  

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11 hours ago, Shebengal said:

That's because we keep drafting linemen with injury issues, going back to Ogbuehi in 2015. 

 

Collins Carman with back issues.

Busts..

Jake Fisher and Cedric O both busts..

Jordan Prince and Price 3 OSU linemen. busts..

List is long ..

 

Now Smith Hill ans Adenijji looking like busts as well..

 

Build with Karras and Cappa while on the  cheap.

Expand to tackles somehow.

Invest bigtime!!!

 

Dilemma for sure..

 

 

 

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, BengalBuck said:

Likewise, find anything bad said about the guys they signed in free agency. Everyone gushed about how the Bengals addressed their biggest weakness.

I still do.  Most teams that try to add multiple players to an O-Line during an Off-season through Free Agency usually fail on 2/3rd's of them.  I'm not making this up.  It's really difficult.

 

I still give the Bengals' an A+ in going after, and getting the exact players this team needed.  Collins seems to have a motivational issue (it goes back to before he entered the NFL and carried its way through his time at Dallas).  He's never lived up to expectations.  He may have gotten so out of shape that he lost a whole step.  His brain is not sharp.  His focus isn't there.  But, we hit on 2 out of 3, and those two will be the foundation as this O-Line is rebuilt.  I do fear that the Bengals will rest on their laurels (as they seem to be doing with the WR's group and the O-Line before this off-season), but Mike Brown is not in charge any more, so it seems, and I'll give Katie and Company the benefit of the dout until I see what happens this off-season.  It would be nice if Collins rounded into form and that the entire O-Line makes a great improvement after the bye.  Collins needs to earn the paychecks this season.  If he doesn't, I move Williams to RT (or LG, and someone else at RT) next season and find a replacement for Williams at LT.  At least we finally got the C and RG positions fixed.  That's huge if you want to not have your QB's knees taken out.  Plus, with C and RG positions fixed, our run game will continue to improve.

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6 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

I think it was more Joe saying to hell with it and taking the sacks to make plays.  It wasn't sustainable and kind of miraculous he wasn't injured.

 

Maybe he's thinking he'd prefer to still recognize his future wife & kids when he's 40?  

 

The OL looks a tick better overall to me but now everyone knows it's still a weakness, and how to exploit it.

One more week then a Bye to work on it.

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2 minutes ago, Kingspoint said:

One more week then a Bye to work on it.

 

 

I'd put more stock in that if they weren't all vets aside from Volson.  They may improve somewhat as a unit but I wouldn't expect any dramatic breakthroughs.  Think they are what they are.

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7 minutes ago, T-Dub said:

 

 

I'd put more stock in that if they weren't all vets aside from Volson.  They may improve somewhat as a unit but I wouldn't expect any dramatic breakthroughs.  Think they are what they are.

A lot can get done in the Bye, especially from the Vets, as they know more than anyone what needs to be worked on.  There aren't any individual fundamentals (except for Jonah Williams, it seems) to fix.  It's all about cohesion as a Unit.  

 

I am tremendously disappointed in Collins.  I really wanted us to grab him in the draft (mentioned on the site I used to be on with others from around here), but not Mike Brown.  I fear we finally got him too late.  Didn't think it would be a problem with his ex-O-Line Coach here, but Collins' issues seem to suggest that the Cowboys, in need of O-Linemen, weren't just letting him go for financial reasons.

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10 hours ago, Kingspoint said:

There aren't any individual fundamentals (except for Jonah Williams, it seems) to fix. 

 

I think there are for Volson, possibly Collins too though I'm starting to suspect he's goldbricking it.   I get suspicious when I see a vet on the injury report all week, limited on Friday, then show up for the game Sunday and seem physically fine.  Maybe he thought he could come to some backwater franchise and get paid to look the part, IDK.

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They are between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea with their tackles. 

 

Who the hell knows what the issues are with Jonah--he was at least passible last season, and he faced just as many good rushers? Collins' abilities were obvious from the film on him--all of the fat/allegedly unmotivated/injured gaslighting aside. There was absolutely no reason as to why they each have fallen off the edge of the world. 

 

Here is the conundrum--or one poor man's observation anyway: they are here, they are relatively healthy, neither can be factually accused of dogging it. I suppose a "statement" can be made by benching Jonah and going with Adeniji--but that is fraught with dangers of its own. Not only do you lose whatever is left of Williams' potential for rebounding back to the so-so realm of a season ago, you replace him with a human holding machine who has already reached what little ceiling he had. And Collins? There is no one who isn't already injured or lost on weekly de-active lists (like Prince and Smith). And, you also kill off whatever potential rebound you might get from him. 

 

And who knows what input Burrow has in all of this--he may love them like children and goes to bat for them? 

 

It's a shit-show. One thing is for sure, it's an off-season problem to address...nothing can be done to "fix" it now.   

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21 minutes ago, Le Tigre said:

They are between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea with their tackles. 

 

Who the hell knows what the issues are with Jonah--he was at least passible last season, and he faced just as many good rushers? Collins' abilities were obvious from the film on him--all of the fat/allegedly unmotivated/injured gaslighting aside. There was absolutely no reason as to why they each have fallen off the edge of the world. 

 

Here is the conundrum--or one poor man's observation anyway: they are here, they are relatively healthy, neither can be factually accused of dogging it. I suppose a "statement" can be made by benching Jonah and going with Adeniji--but that is fraught with dangers of its own. Not only do you lose whatever is left of Williams' potential for rebounding back to the so-so realm of a season ago, you replace him with a human holding machine who has already reached what little ceiling he had. And Collins? There is no one who isn't already injured or lost on weekly de-active lists (like Prince and Smith). And, you also kill off whatever potential rebound you might get from him. 

 

And who knows what input Burrow has in all of this--he may love them like children and goes to bat for them? 

 

It's a shit-show. One thing is for sure, it's an off-season problem to address...nothing can be done to "fix" it now.   

Agree..

There is no uograde reserves..

This 5 will ride it out this season.

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, T-Dub said:

 

I think there are for Volson, possibly Collins too though I'm starting to suspect he's goldbricking it.   I get suspicious when I see a vet on the injury report all week, limited on Friday, then show up for the game Sunday and seem physically fine.  Maybe he thought he could come to some backwater franchise and get paid to look the part, IDK.

Of course, Volson, but that was assumed.

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FYI, on the Athletic, Dane Brugler just updated his Top 50 draft Prospects. OL are shown below:

 

5. Olu Fashanu, OT, Penn State*

With only nine career starts, Olu Fashanu might not have a great body of work just yet. But he has been outstanding in those nine starts, especially considering he is just 19 years old. Against speed rushers, Fashanu moves like he is 50 pounds lighter to cut off and close space. Against power, he can get a tad upright in his pass sets but is so strong that it usually doesn’t matter. Considering how good he is right now and how much better he can get, Fashanu has earned this high ranking.

 

7. Peter Skoronski, OT, Northwestern*

Remember all the hubbub about how Rashawn Slater’s 33-inch arms were too short for him to play tackle in the NFL? Prepare for it again with another Northwestern left tackle, because Peter Skoronski’s arm length is even shorter than Slater’s (likely somewhere between 32 and 32 1/2 inches). While Skoronski could make the transition inside and be an outstanding NFL guard, I believe he has the movements and processing to survive outside. I hope he gets that opportunity.

 

11. Paris Johnson Jr., OT, Ohio State*

After starting at right guard last season, Paris Johnson Jr., has moved to his more natural left tackle position in 2022 and thrived. He keeps his feet underneath him with terrific body control to adjust to pass rushers and protect the pocket. Through eight games this season, Johnson has allowed zero sacks and committed zero penalties.

 

20. Broderick Jones, OT, Georgia*

In his first full season as the starting left tackle, Broderick Jones has been impressively consistent in pass protection. He comes close to losing his balance more than you’d like to see, mostly due to inconsistent punch timing, but Jones moves well laterally and actively reworks his hands to counter rushers.

27. O’Cyrus Torrence, OG, Florida

At 6-5 and 347 pounds, O’Cyrus Torrence is a massive man with huge, vice grip hands to bounce defenders around the field. He is guilty of leaning in pass protection, but his athleticism at that size is impressive. With his play strength, Torrence strikes with authority at contact and quickly gains control.

 

36. Dawand Jones, OT, Ohio State

The second Ohio State offensive tackle to make the top 50, Dawand Jones is a massive human at 6-8 1/2 and 360 pounds with 36 1/8-inch arms and an 89 1/8-inch wingspan. On his junior-year tape, he struggled with his balance and posture against wide rushers. As a senior, though, Jones has made substantial strides with his control and strike timing mid-slide to counter speed and protect the pocket.

Jones, still just 21 years old, is one of the most unique players in this draft and continues to rise.

 

50. Cody Mauch, OT/G, North Dakota State

North Dakota State has had a good run of producing draft picks along the offensive line, but Cody Mauch has the talent to be the best of the group. A former walk-on tight end, Mauch has impressive athletic traits with the glass-eating personality that NFL coaches covet up front. Regardless if he stays at tackle or moves inside to guard, Mauch has NFL starting potential.

 

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30 minutes ago, I_C_Deadpeople said:

FYI, on the Athletic, Dane Brugler just updated his Top 50 draft Prospects. OL are shown below:

 

5. Olu Fashanu, OT, Penn State*

With only nine career starts, Olu Fashanu might not have a great body of work just yet. But he has been outstanding in those nine starts, especially considering he is just 19 years old. Against speed rushers, Fashanu moves like he is 50 pounds lighter to cut off and close space. Against power, he can get a tad upright in his pass sets but is so strong that it usually doesn’t matter. Considering how good he is right now and how much better he can get, Fashanu has earned this high ranking.

 

7. Peter Skoronski, OT, Northwestern*

Remember all the hubbub about how Rashawn Slater’s 33-inch arms were too short for him to play tackle in the NFL? Prepare for it again with another Northwestern left tackle, because Peter Skoronski’s arm length is even shorter than Slater’s (likely somewhere between 32 and 32 1/2 inches). While Skoronski could make the transition inside and be an outstanding NFL guard, I believe he has the movements and processing to survive outside. I hope he gets that opportunity.

 

11. Paris Johnson Jr., OT, Ohio State*

After starting at right guard last season, Paris Johnson Jr., has moved to his more natural left tackle position in 2022 and thrived. He keeps his feet underneath him with terrific body control to adjust to pass rushers and protect the pocket. Through eight games this season, Johnson has allowed zero sacks and committed zero penalties.

 

20. Broderick Jones, OT, Georgia*

In his first full season as the starting left tackle, Broderick Jones has been impressively consistent in pass protection. He comes close to losing his balance more than you’d like to see, mostly due to inconsistent punch timing, but Jones moves well laterally and actively reworks his hands to counter rushers.

27. O’Cyrus Torrence, OG, Florida

At 6-5 and 347 pounds, O’Cyrus Torrence is a massive man with huge, vice grip hands to bounce defenders around the field. He is guilty of leaning in pass protection, but his athleticism at that size is impressive. With his play strength, Torrence strikes with authority at contact and quickly gains control.

 

36. Dawand Jones, OT, Ohio State

The second Ohio State offensive tackle to make the top 50, Dawand Jones is a massive human at 6-8 1/2 and 360 pounds with 36 1/8-inch arms and an 89 1/8-inch wingspan. On his junior-year tape, he struggled with his balance and posture against wide rushers. As a senior, though, Jones has made substantial strides with his control and strike timing mid-slide to counter speed and protect the pocket.

Jones, still just 21 years old, is one of the most unique players in this draft and continues to rise.

 

50. Cody Mauch, OT/G, North Dakota State

North Dakota State has had a good run of producing draft picks along the offensive line, but Cody Mauch has the talent to be the best of the group. A former walk-on tight end, Mauch has impressive athletic traits with the glass-eating personality that NFL coaches covet up front. Regardless if he stays at tackle or moves inside to guard, Mauch has NFL starting potential.

 

Paris went to my high school and my friends coached him when he was younger...I would love to see him back home protecting Burrow's blindside. 

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On 11/1/2022 at 7:01 PM, Kingspoint said:

 

 

Look at what's happened to the RAMS after Whitworth retired.  It was predictable.  That's how important the LT spot it.

the exact same thing that happened here when the begals  let him leave , 

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2 hours ago, PatternMaster said:

5 cheese coneys...must have a been a lot of Jameson 

 

 

Now I'm craving an Irish Coffee..  Used to have a couple bartender friends at this cafe in Clifton that would serve me iced ones so strong I could see through them.  Think they felt sorry for me after a doomed fling with one of the baristas. 

 

I regret nothing.

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