2024 O Line

[Jamie_B]

2 hours ago, JC said:

I do think Jonah is solid and he’s going to get paid handsomely. But he’s built for zone scheme with his size and he doesn’t have great short area burst so he’s pretty limited at that. Even if the Bengals didn’t have Tee as a tag option - I’m not sure they would use it on Jonah. I think they want big and athletic.

 

 

Big and Athletic is Mimms

 

I'm just not sure about his small sample size

[Jamie_B]

1 hour ago, spicoli said:

Yeah I mean, I don’t disagree…we don’t have Bill Callahan though. 

 

But we could fire Pollack and take the Browns assistant

 

This is the kind of stuff I am talking about when I say the Bengals are almost TOO loyal

[Le Tigre]

25 minutes ago, Jamie_B said:

 

Maybe. 

 

There is rumor that the Browns might release Conklin

Depends on how his torn ACL/MCL has recovered. For his quality, his last contract was reasonable. But…he is ALMOST 30!!!😱

[claptonrocks]

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

Maybe. 

 

There is rumor that the Browns might release Conklin

Big Jack Conklin has been a mainstay on the Browns Oline but injuries have taken toll on his body.

Demand Jones is the heir apparent.

Maybe Jack outta retire.

[claptonrocks]

1 hour ago, Jamie_B said:

 

 

Big and Athletic is Mimms

 

I'm just not sure about his small sample size

I'll chance it..

I want him..

[T-Dub]

2 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

 

But we could fire Pollack and take the Browns assistant

 

This is the kind of stuff I am talking about when I say the Bengals are almost TOO loyal

 

 

No almost about it, 9/10 times they stick with a guy until his contract runs out.  The coaches know it, the players know it, and the results show it.

[claptonrocks]

6 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

 

But we could fire Pollack and take the Browns assistant

 

This is the kind of stuff I am talking about when I say the Bengals are almost TOO loyal

Browns wont let any  top assistant go to the Bengals.

 

Jimmy Haslem   would pay any prized coach under the table than lose one to an AFCN rival..

 

No?

[Jamie_B]

1 hour ago, claptonrocks said:

Browns wont let any  top assistant go to the Bengals.

 

Jimmy Haslem   would pay any prized coach under the table than lose one to an AFCN rival..

 

No?

 

I know there is a rule if a coach gets a offer for coordinators you can't block him. Not sure if that applies to assist coaches getting a promotion to coach

[stan]

16 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

 

That is exactly why we need to be taking 1st round linemen, or at least first-round tackles. Don't mess around with this.

They took an OT in the first round a few years ago.His name was Cedric Ogbuehi.,How did that work out? Do not let Frank Pollack,pick the o-linemen.\He is a terrible talent evaluator.Anyone remember, Jackson Carman? Another Frank Pollack bust.

[spicoli]

Pollack didn’t have anything to do with Cedric Ogb

[UncleEarl]

Still think the line will look a lot better if some form of a running game existed, and I don't think its all on the OL that it doesn't. 

[Jamie_B]

2 hours ago, UncleEarl said:

Still think the line will look a lot better if some form of a running game existed, and I don't think its all on the OL that it doesn't. 

 

Who on the Oline do you think is good at run blocking?

[UncleEarl]

4 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

 

Who on the Oline do you think is good at run blocking?

 

It's not that simple.  Who could tell from the outset of Taylor's Bengals?  They don't emphasize the run at all.  They bail on the run after a series or two if it doesn't produce.  You have to stick with it.  Once the other team knows you won't run it gets ugly, and that is what we have seen. 

 

 

[Arkansas Bengal]

38 minutes ago, UncleEarl said:

 

It's not that simple.  Who could tell from the outset of Taylor's Bengals?  They don't emphasize the run at all.  They bail on the run after a series or two if it doesn't produce.  You have to stick with it.  Once the other team knows you won't run it gets ugly, and that is what we have seen. 

 

 

 

Hell, they bail on the run after a series or two even if it DOES produce...

[I_C_Deadpeople]

14 minutes ago, Arkansas Bengal said:

 

Hell, they bail on the run after a series or two even if it DOES produce...

They have really only run the ball with intention when they are up in the score and running out the clock. Otherwise, they lean far too heavily on the pass, we all know that , defenses know it so Zac should also know it. 

[sparky151]

On 1/21/2024 at 3:39 PM, JC said:

Jonah Williams/Cedric O./Andre Smith are the most recent first round tackles in the Tobin era.

 

Just because they’re throwing premium darts at the position doesn’t mean it’s going to guarantee success. They need to draft big guys who test well athletically and the tape is clean. Mims and Latham combines will be important.

 

Drafting big, athletic guys and developing them is a legitimate strategy but it's not one that's well suited for the Bengals. Pollack doesn't seem to get the best from his players so expecting him to turn rookies into starters by year 2 or 3 is unlikely to work. He's struck out so far with Adeniji, Carman, Smith, and Hill. And hasn't done much to improve the veterans we've signed either. Volson is so-so. 

[|BlackJesus|]

He thinks Jonah will get a big FA deal ...

 

[|High School Harry|]

58 minutes ago, BlackJesus said:

He thinks Jonah will get a big FA deal ...

 

Who cares?  It won't be out money.

[JC]

2 hours ago, sparky151 said:

 

Drafting big, athletic guys and developing them is a legitimate strategy but it's not one that's well suited for the Bengals. Pollack doesn't seem to get the best from his players so expecting him to turn rookies into starters by year 2 or 3 is unlikely to work. He's struck out so far with Adeniji, Carman, Smith, and Hill. And hasn't done much to improve the veterans we've signed either. Volson is so-so. 

That’s fair. We haven’t seen much development. On the same token - they are the worst at drafting athletic linemen in the league. Their whole approach needs to change. Stop drafting linemen who don’t test at the combine/pro days and don’t score near the 8 RAS threshold.

 

 

[|High School Harry|]

14 minutes ago, JC said:

That’s fair. We haven’t seen much development. On the same token - they are the worst at drafting athletic linemen in the league. Their whole approach needs to change. Stop drafting linemen who don’t test at the combine/pro days and don’t score near the 8 RAS threshold.

 

 

But...but...but... all that money in big name free agents....

[-GoBengals-]

On 1/16/2024 at 11:43 AM, High School Harry said:

Kind of a bite in the patoot when we hear the Bengals talk about how much

$$ they have spent on OL Free Agents (free is an odd term) and see how much they

suck.  Can't blame it all on Volson.

 

you know what i can blame on volson?

 

volson FUCKING SUCKS

 

he is one of the worst linemen in the entire league. year after year now, one of the absolute worst.

[-GoBengals-]

we live in a maden hellworld where realities arent a factor i guess.

 

1. there arent very many good linemen in the NFL, college game has ruined them, someone here even posted an article about it here last year.

2. Drafting them is a crap shoot, roughly a 30% success rate.

3. the ones who are proven good are very expensive. like top WR expensive.

4. An Oline is only as good as its weakest link. wherever they line(as a team) must "help" the weak spot it opens vulnerabilities for those aroun the weakest link.(and by weakest link obviously its Volson, who fucking sucks.)

 

Evidence for the above:

 

1. There are 32 OT's rated a 70 or above, there are 64 starting tackles in the NFL(50%). There are 16 guards rated a 70 or above, there are 64 starting guars (25%). 13 Centers rated 70 or above, 32 starters(40%). That lands you a 5% chance of having 5 starters on averages alone, above a rating of even 70.0 but please tell me more about how we need to go get 5 good starters and have some goo OL depth as well.

2. as stated many times, in first and second round drafted OL, 30% either earn a return contract for a 5th year OR are a starter elsewhere at that point. so less than 1 in 3 will still either be on the team(starting or not) or starting elsewhere. those are the numbers, it took over 4 hours to track down all of them and check their career status. 

 

3. i mean you can just look that up, i guess but here are few:

• Ravens offensive lineman Ronnie Stanley: $19.8 million.
• Saints offensive lineman Ryan Ramczyk: $19.2 million.
• Vikings offensive lineman Brian O'Neill: $18.5 million.
• Falcons offensive lineman Jake Matthews: $18.5 million.

4. Also pretty common knowledge, not sure how to convince someone who doesnt think its true so is what it is.

[T-Dub]

On 1/22/2024 at 6:47 AM, spicoli said:

Pollack didn’t have anything to do with Cedric Ogb

 

Pretty sure Carman is the only OL draft pick he's been involved with before the 4th round or later.

 

On 1/22/2024 at 6:49 AM, UncleEarl said:

Still think the line will look a lot better if some form of a running game existed, and I don't think its all on the OL that it doesn't. 

 

While I'd call the OL the biggest weakness I agree with this, the scheme doesn't help and I still wonder how often Joe is checking out of run plays.

 

It's also not helping when the RB won't block, so you want to take him off the field when passing, thus telling the defense they can drop into coverage. Or blitz, considering, I have to say, that they aren't exactly HoF pass blockers either as a unit.

 

The Bengals ranked 30th in rushing attempts/game this season.  That'd make sense if they were a 4-13 team constantly playing from behind, but they weren't. Even in 21/22 they were bottom 1/3rd at best.

 

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/rushing-attempts-per-game

[T-Dub]

7 minutes ago, GoBengals said:

we live in a maden hellworld where realities arent a factor i guess.

 

1. there arent very many good linemen in the NFL, college game has ruined them, someone here even posted an article about it here last year.

2. Drafting them is a crap shoot, roughly a 30% success rate.

3. the ones who are proven good are very expensive. like top WR expensive.

4. An Oline is only as good as its weakest link. wherever they line(as a team) must "help" the weak spot it opens vulnerabilities for those aroun the weakest link.(and by weakest link obviously its Volson, who fucking sucks.)

 

Evidence for the above:

 

1. There are 32 OT's rated a 70 or above, there are 64 starting tackles in the NFL(50%). There are 16 guards rated a 70 or above, there are 64 starting guars (25%). 13 Centers rated 70 or above, 32 starters(40%). That lands you a 5% chance of having 5 starters on averages alone, above a rating of even 70.0 but please tell me more about how we need to go get 5 good starters and have some goo OL depth as well.

2. as stated many times, in first and second round drafted OL, 30% either earn a return contract for a 5th year OR are a starter elsewhere at that point. so less than 1 in 3 will still either be on the team(starting or not) or starting elsewhere. those are the numbers, it took over 4 hours to track down all of them and check their career status. 

 

3. i mean you can just look that up, i guess but here are few:

• Ravens offensive lineman Ronnie Stanley: $19.8 million.
• Saints offensive lineman Ryan Ramczyk: $19.2 million.
• Vikings offensive lineman Brian O'Neill: $18.5 million.
• Falcons offensive lineman Jake Matthews: $18.5 million.

4. Also pretty common knowledge, not sure how to convince someone who doesnt think its true so is what it is.

 

 

I get this but it's the team's apparent conclusion of "just stop drafting OL" that seems faulty.

 

Obviously we need a good OL, obviously we can't afford to pay 5 good FA OL, so we need people that are good at identifying college talent and making sure they reach their potential.

 

Those people exist and they don't cost 20 mil a year.  They may not, however, be current employees of the Cincinnati Bengals or be related to the Brown family.

 

If only roughly 1/3rd of rookie OL picks pan out then you draft 3. To me, that's the reality of it.

[UncleEarl]