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Critically assessing Zac Taylor ?


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5 minutes ago, UncleEarl said:

 

I enjoy discussing the good and bad of the team.  That often involves being critical of even good players and coaches.  I agree that the organization seems to have turned a corner and is doing a lot of the right things.  I'm a big fan of Zac Taylor the head coach.  I'm not a fan of Zac Taylor the offensive coordinator/play caller. 

 

I'll really never understand the hatred for Tibor.  It's a shtick!  It's intended to be funny.  I can understand that some may not get or enjoy the humor, but the hatred sent his way baffles me.  Just ignore it.  As far as yesterday's show of Tibor going off on past players, you can blame me and a few other old timers from another board.  We goaded him into it because we wanted a laugh and some nostalgia from the past.

 

I thought the play calling yesterday turned a corner and was encouraged by it, hopefully that continues. I do disagree with your desire to see Callahan call plays, just because I'm not comfortable giving the reigns to a guy that has never done it. Otherwise I think we both agree about Taylor.

I never thought it was funny, but even so a joke that keeps getting told again and again even if some fined it funny the first couple of times, tends to not be funny anymore. Get a new schitck.

 

But I do still get pleasure out of my "Tell Cersei. I want her to know it was me." moment. :)

 

 

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2 hours ago, Jamie_B said:

 

I thought the play calling yesterday turned a corner and was encouraged by it, hopefully that continues. I do disagree with your desire to see Callahan call plays, just because I'm not comfortable giving the reigns to a guy that has never done it. Otherwise I think we both agree about Taylor.

 

 

I agree it was better.  More straight forward football and less cutsie "let me outsmart the other team" crap.  They have the players.  Let Burrow, Chase, and crew outperform the other team. 

 

I get the Callahan thing is debatable.  I just think he's an option if Taylor continues to blow games like he did against Baltimore.  Hell, the Bengals gave the reins of the entire team to Taylor and he had never been a head coach on any level.  The organization should know Callahan's mindset well enough to make that call.

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5 hours ago, UncleEarl said:

 

I enjoy discussing the good and bad of the team.  That often involves being critical of even good players and coaches.  I agree that the organization seems to have turned a corner and is doing a lot of the right things.  I'm a big fan of Zac Taylor the head coach.  I'm not a fan of Zac Taylor the offensive coordinator/play caller. 

 

I'll really never understand the hatred for Tibor.  It's a shtick!  It's intended to be funny.  I can understand that some may not get or enjoy the humor, but the hatred sent his way baffles me.  Just ignore it.  As far as yesterday's show of Tibor going off on past players, you can blame me and a few other old timers from another board.  We goaded him into it because we wanted a laugh and some nostalgia from the past.

I was on that board years ago with Tibor BFITO , Lost in the Jungle and more that i cant remember.

 

Tibor isn't changing his antics.. ever.

 

Were you Uncle Earl on that site or another name?

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6 hours ago, UncleEarl said:

 

 

I'll really never understand the hatred for Tibor.  It's a shtick!  It's intended to be funny.  I can understand that some may not get or enjoy the humor, but the hatred sent his way baffles me.  Just ignore it.  As far as yesterday's show of Tibor going off on past players, you can blame me and a few other old timers from another board.  We goaded him into it because we wanted a laugh and some nostalgia from the past.

Guilty as charged. 😂😉 But I have actually met Tibor and he’s an ok guy.

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1 hour ago, claptonrocks said:

I was on that board years ago with Tibor BFITO , Lost in the Jungle and more that i cant remember.

 

Tibor isn't changing his antics.. ever.

 

Were you Uncle Earl on that site or another name?

 

I had another name that was actually my REAL name.  I would rather not reveal that.  Joined in '01 or some time close to that.  Let's just say that I was internet naive.  Same avatar though. 

 

Sad that Lost was run off last season.  One of the most intelligent posters I can remember.

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3 minutes ago, UncleEarl said:

 

I had another name that was actually my REAL name.  I would rather not reveal that.  Joined in '01 or some time close to that.  Let's just say that I was internet naive.  Same avatar though. 

Gotcha...

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I think the biggest problem with the offense isn't the play calls. It's the play designs. There's very little deception and little creativity. Look at the Chiefs. They know how to design plays to get their guys open...wide open. Andy Reid creates mismatches and confusion on the opposing defense. Zac doesn't put our guys in motion; he doesn't create mismatches like by putting Chase in the slot. His mentor in LA does these things. I don't get why Taylor didn't pick this up while working for the Rams

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I mean, really. And I have been as frustrated with "play calling" etc of ZT as anyone but when you step back and look at the big picture, I think some of that chart has to go on ZT's side of the ledger, right?  Look at where Rodgers/LaFleur are, for instance. Or Herbert/Staley. Etc. Etc. 

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2 hours ago, membengal said:

 

 

 

Wonder how many of these are JB dropping bombs vs short/mid range passes & broken tackles.

 

edit: Chase is 9th overall in YAC and 5th among WR's with 234 yards, per ESPN stats.

 

 

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The Bengals offense has been markedly better in the second half when there have been no scripted plays and the Bengals are usually coming from behind.  Letting Joe Burrow make the decisions is what makes this offense go.  (along with a lot of talent at WR and RB)

 

I mean, the topic of the thread is "Critically assessing Zac Taylor."  The fact that it's critical shouldn't be surprising.

 

Again, I love ZT as head coach.  I also think his playcalling and design are not good.  Both can be true.

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1 hour ago, T-Dub said:

 

 

Wonder how many of these are JB dropping bombs vs short/mid range passes & broken tackles.

 

edit: Chase is 9th overall in YAC and 5th among WR's with 234 yards, per ESPN stats.

 

 

 

Doesn't matter - part of it is Burrow ball placement on intermediate stuff that allows good YAC (ball to chase to win game last week was good example of that), part of it is bombs, but in fairness to ZT - the play calling can't be THAT bad when you glance at that chart. 

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55 minutes ago, UncleEarl said:

The Bengals offense has been markedly better in the second half when there have been no scripted plays and the Bengals are usually coming from behind.  Letting Joe Burrow make the decisions is what makes this offense go.  (along with a lot of talent at WR and RB)

 

I mean, the topic of the thread is "Critically assessing Zac Taylor."  The fact that it's critical shouldn't be surprising.

 

Again, I love ZT as head coach.  I also think his playcalling and design are not good.  Both can be true.

you can think that. I can think that. Then I can also look at data like that chart and raise an eyebrow and consider my own criticism. what you do with yours is your own business. 

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40 minutes ago, membengal said:

 

Doesn't matter - part of it is Burrow ball placement on intermediate stuff that allows good YAC (ball to chase to win game last week was good example of that), part of it is bombs, but in fairness to ZT - the play calling can't be THAT bad when you glance at that chart. 

 

 

It's highly situational.  However, one could make the same argument about the OL.  They were just in the SB with an even worse group, right?

 

Fact is that JB is hard-carrying a very shaky offense.

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1 hour ago, membengal said:

 

Doesn't matter - part of it is Burrow ball placement on intermediate stuff that allows good YAC (ball to chase to win game last week was good example of that), part of it is bombs, but in fairness to ZT - the play calling can't be THAT bad when you glance at that chart. 


Stats are great, but the only stat that really matters are wins and losses.  Zac Taylor lost the Ravens game.  If that kind of play calling and play design continues he needs to be replaced as OC/play caller.  
 

Big plays are great, but you can win a lot of games controlling the ball.  

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On 10/17/2022 at 8:44 AM, CincyInDC said:

I like how Zack didn't call any cutesy dumbass plays and we won in New Orleans in Week 6. 

I had been seeing red since the Baltimore game right up until the Saints win helped wash away some of the taste of the ill fated Philly special. I referenced it, in a sort of generic, derogatory way as a flea flicker, but I haven't been able to stomach watching a replay of the game, or the play.  I remember Burrow being covered immediately, while simultaneously Boyd was flushed and tripped up seemingly as far from the goal line as possible. That's how I remember it, and yeah, it definitely didn't work. But here's the thing. I don't hate Zac having that in the playbook. In fact, I'm glad he's trying to put as many tools in the box as possible. You have to take chances to win in the NFL. You've got to force the issue to create first downs and scores. But you have to pay attention to game flow and do it intelligently. That was a really boneheaded time for that play. We were stuffing it down their throat with the run and needed to score badly.  I would've liked that play earlier to try and convert a short 3rd or 4th down, or as a dagger play later in the 4th to go up by a second score. The thing about Zac though. He seems much more willing to accept criticism than Marvin. If he keeps being willing to learn, I think it'll be okay one way or another. Meaning he gets better at play calling, or relinquishes some of the control.

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28 minutes ago, MOC said:

The question I've had is how do we know Callahan isn't calling the plays,  at least some of them? Several "feeds" into Taylor's headset. 

Taylor has commented several times now that it's not just him calling the plays...its a collective effort with coaches on the sidelines and in the skybox.  I guess ultimately one guy is responsible when there is a difference of opinion and we can assume that is Taylor at this point.  It's not just calls on Sundays either...it's what you game-plan and practice during the week...again that's a collective effort.

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13 minutes ago, esjbh2 said:

Taylor has commented several times now that it's not just him calling the plays...its a collective effort with coaches on the sidelines and in the skybox.  I guess ultimately one guy is responsible when there is a difference of opinion and we can assume that is Taylor at this point.  It's not just calls on Sundays either...it's what you game-plan and practice during the week...again that's a collective effort.

So Callahan is basically a spotter and relays what he sees on the field?

 

Pollack is the run game coordinator. exactl how  does that pertain to playcalling?

 

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42 minutes ago, esjbh2 said:

Taylor has commented several times now that it's not just him calling the plays...its a collective effort with coaches on the sidelines and in the skybox.  I

 

That sounds like an absolute train wreck.  This is an area where they need a single person to be quick, decisive & maybe most importantly, accountable when things don't work.  

 

Would definitely explain some of the BS we've seen.

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10 hours ago, membengal said:

 

You know how good it feels to be that dominant over your peers?  When you're that dominant, you already knew it.  But, it's justification to point out to all the others that here's the evidence on paper and they get to see it.  

 

That's the real Joe Burrow.  

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1 hour ago, Kingspoint said:

You know how good it feels to be that dominant over your peers?  When you're that dominant, you already knew it.  But, it's justification to point out to all the others that here's the evidence on paper and they get to see it.  

 

That's the real Joe Burrow.  

I like your comment but as realistic as Joe seems to be he's aware of others that are as good or possibly playing better than he...

 

He knows..

Its another incentive to know your the Best in the game..

Gut is he'll reach and keep it for awhile..

 

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