Jungle1 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='GoBengals' date='10 January 2010 - 12:49 AM' timestamp='1263102582' post='855251'] you shake things up by getting talented players that allow your coaches to actually execute a gameplan.... a new gameplan with the same shitty players isnt going to accomplish anything.. and nothing will be shaken up, its the same shitty players under performing.. [/quote] These same "shitty players" swept the AFC North. So, Brat seems to know how to beat teams he plays a lot. But, can't seem to adjust outside of our division. Plus, how can you not blame the penalties on coaching? I know the players make the penalty, but coaches are the ones that have to fix it. Also, why do you think Brat has never been considered for a HC position (to my knowledge)---even when we were dominant. Brat has had a long run here, and I think it is time for some new blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-GoBengals- Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Jungle1' date='10 January 2010 - 12:56 AM' timestamp='1263102978' post='855252'] These same "shitty players" swept the AFC North. So, Brat seems to know how to beat teams he plays a lot. But, can't seem to adjust outside of our division. Plus, how can you not blame the penalties on coaching? I know the players make the penalty, but coaches are the ones that have to fix it. Also, why do you think Brat has never been considered for a HC position (to my knowledge)---even when we were dominant. Brat has had a long run here, and I think it is time for some new blood. [/quote] blame coaches.. blame coaches all day... bob isnt a coach.. he is the offensive coordinator.. call paul alexander with uor OL penalty problems... call zampese with palmers delay of game issues. call sheppard for the lack of WR development.. call hughes for the piss poor TE play, well after youre done blaming the shitting TE's left active on the roster.. give jim anderson a lifetime contract.. the OC sits in a booth calling palys for a reason.. the position coaches stand on the sidelines to coach their players for a reason.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jungle1 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='GoBengals' date='10 January 2010 - 01:00 AM' timestamp='1263103200' post='855254'] blame coaches.. blame coaches all day... bob isnt a coach.. he is the offensive coordinator.. call paul alexander with uor OL penalty problems... call zampese with palmers delay of game issues. call sheppard for the lack of WR development.. call hughes for the piss poor TE play, well after youre done blaming the shitting TE's left active on the roster.. give jim anderson a lifetime contract.. the OC sits in a booth calling palys for a reason.. the position coaches stand on the sidelines to coach their players for a reason.. [/quote] And all the men above answer to Brat....so, yes, Brat is responsible. We all think Mike Zimmer is magic for taking scraps and making a masterpiece. But, Bob gets a pass----and we know he has influence on draft, free agents, etc. At some point, he is making big money to assume big responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-GoBengals- Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Jungle1' date='10 January 2010 - 01:04 AM' timestamp='1263103474' post='855257'] [b]And all the men above answer to Brat....so, yes, Brat is responsible.[/b] We all think Mike Zimmer is magic for taking scraps and making a masterpiece. But, Bob gets a pass----and we know he has influence on draft, free agents, etc. At some point, he is making big money to assume big responsibility. [/quote] really?....he cant fire any of them.. you're gasping at straws now.. saying poor offensive players performance is an OC's fault is hilarious and ridiculous all at the same time. PS: i dont think many of those coaches, aside from sheppard should be in much hot water.. they havent had a ton to work with...at least not on the active roster.. lack of actual talent is the over all issue. and lack of being able to get scrubbs to play at nfl starter caliber is the secondary issue..mostly caused by the first issue.. as i stated, he has proven, given the tools, he has have TREMENDOUS success in the pass and run games, now its someones job to get him the tools.... zimmer got his tools.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoutforlife591 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 I just need to add into this that we NEVER threw to our extra eligble tackle. All that reporting, for what would seemingly be a surprise pass to Roland, and it NEVER happened. If anyone needed proof as to the unorignality. Although I loved the overload sets in general. I'd love for the conversation to continue for a few more pages, with less 12 inch rants and then eventually turn to who the replacement should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdubdub Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='GoBengals' date='10 January 2010 - 12:49 AM' timestamp='1263102582' post='855251'] you shake things up by getting talented players that allow your coaches to actually execute a gameplan.... a new gameplan with the same shitty players isnt going to accomplish anything.. and nothing will be shaken up, its the same shitty players under performing.. [/quote] What? This is the definition of coaching. Taking what your given and improving them. There are alot more efficient offenses with much less or equal talent. We aren't developing players either. Forget all the excuses and get down to results. We havefired two d coordinators for producing better results then our current offensive staff. Former players see it too. Quit trying to act like you know somthing everyone else doesn't. Marvin even tried to can him last year but wasnt allowed to for crying out loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MULLY Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='ValleyBengal' date='10 January 2010 - 09:47 AM' timestamp='1263084441' post='854791'] Agreed. Accountability is key here. Something has to change there. In most companies, if a department underperforms, managerial changes are made. We need to make changes how the offense is managed. And that cleary is on Brat's shoulders. With that said, we also need to have personnel upgrades at WR, TE and blockers for pass blocking situations. It's clear now that Chad can be shut down, and we have no one to counteract that. [/quote] Chad was only shut down because there was no other threat out there. They've been sticking to him like glue since Henry broke his arm. The Bengals need another threat at WR to keep the opposing defense honest. Although, with Chad's age he may be beginning to lose a step. We'll see next season. I sure hope this isn't another off season like we had before 2008. MULLY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonBlade Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 I haven't changed my opinion since a couple of years ago. Fire Brat. And anyone who tries to defend him, Zimmer proved that new coach + old players = better results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yanks Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 Ha. Like I said, predictable thread. Mentally outweighing someone is clearly something Brat and over four years of reading his personal attacks on people, Go, are not capable of. So..Let Go's completely uneducated personal attacks continue. How dare any of us question the great Brat. What could any of us other then Go and Old know about football? None of us are remotely smart enough to build a php board or post 15 things a day that someone else wrote. But again, wtf could I know.. I didn't make it to a game all season, obviously not a fan. " Repost: (insert insecure Go insult here) " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abu-Zayd Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='GoBengals' date='10 January 2010 - 01:10 AM' timestamp='1263103801' post='855258'] you're gasping at straws now.. saying [b]poor offensive[/b] [s]players[/s] [b]performance[/b] is an OC's fault is hilarious... [/quote] the last two years of offensive ineptness despite having the majority of the payroll dedicated to the offense is inexcusable. it is HIS offense, HIS plays & play design, his direction, his structure, his leadership that establishes the success/failure of the offense. when the offense fails, it is HIS fault ultimately. when we cannot score despite having CP, chad, benson, and other very talented players, accountability requires the OC is held responsible. this is why the former players, who happen to be astute football people, have called for a new offensive direction. and apparently ML thought the same thing a year ago bringing in hue jackson. brat is lucky a top4 pick RB fell into his lap due to drama. [quote name='VonBlade' date='10 January 2010 - 04:43 AM' timestamp='1263116635' post='855281'] And anyone who tries to defend him, Zimmer proved that new coach + old players = better results. [/quote] the same sort of defenses people make for brat could have been made for bresnahan and leslie frazier. remember all the LB injuries we had? geathers and ndukwe were playing LB at one stretch, and at times the defense still played well, but a change was made. are we happy a change was made? certainly. as rafiki said in the lion king, "IT IS TIME". and mark my words, brat would not be rehired as an OC anywhere. he will be a position coach again. what GM in their right mind would hire him as their OC after the last two years of our offense and this last game?! it was a nationally televised debacle for HIM. Mr. GoBengals, perhaps you should desist from calling people "dumb MF" and similar crass curses when people don't agree with you. your position as designer of the forum in no way gives you any superiority of football understanding or the right to verbally abuse people in the manner in which you consistently do. its a shame and everyone knows it, but this is the best bengals forum so people put up with it. just change that. please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yanks Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Abu-Zayd' date='10 January 2010 - 06:56 AM' timestamp='1263124609' post='855289'] the last two years of offensive ineptness despite having the majority of the payroll dedicated to the offense is inexcusable. it is HIS offense, HIS plays & play design, his direction, his structure, his leadership that establishes the success/failure of the offense. when the offense fails, it is HIS fault ultimately. when we cannot score despite having CP, chad, benson, and other very talented players, accountability requires the OC is held responsible. this is why the former players, who happen to be astute football people, have called for a new offensive direction. and apparently ML thought the same thing a year ago bringing in hue jackson. brat is lucky a top4 pick RB fell into his lap due to drama. the same sort of defenses people make for brat could have been made for bresnahan and leslie frazier. remember all the LB injuries we had? geathers and ndukwe were playing LB at one stretch, and at times the defense still played well, but a change was made. are we happy a change was made? certainly. as rafiki said in the lion king, "IT IS TIME". and mark my words, brat would not be rehired as an OC anywhere. he will be a position coach again. what GM in their right mind would hire him as their OC after the last two years of our offense and this last game?! it was a nationally televised debacle for HIM. [/quote] x2 Times 1000 But again, you're wrong because Go deems it. Good effort though in trying to think like 97% of the logical world and not being completely delusional. Can't win them all.. or a playoff in 20 years sometimes. But hey, stick with what works for you. Mediocrity is the key to sliding by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Yanks' date='10 January 2010 - 05:52 AM' timestamp='1263124342' post='855288'] What could any of us other then Go and Old know about football? None of us are remotely smart enough to build a php board or post 15 things a day that someone else wrote. [/quote] What the fuck dude? Why even mention my name? And why act like all I do is post shit others wrote? I clearly said in this thread that I would be OK with moving on from Brat. And I also said that even if he stays, Sheppard (the WR coach) needs to go. Don't you know that if the Offensive or Defensive units perform well, it is the Coordinator? And if they suck it is the shitty players? Yes that is sarcasm. It is something I have argued with Go about before. Anyway, I am getting pretty fuck sick of some motherfuckers here. I spend my time, MY time looking for info and shit to benefit them. I mean, it is shit I could just read myself and then post nothing but my thoughts on here. Instead, I post the shit here, and assholes want to talk down to me for it? Motherfuckers want to act like it is ALL I do? Fuck you. I wish I could put assholes on ignore and it made it to where they couldn't see a fucking thing I posted. Because I am sick of asshats like you benefitting, and then acting like it is a reason to talk shit to me. Seriously. Fuck you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Yanks' date='09 January 2010 - 08:31 PM' timestamp='1263087079' post='854937'] Dude! Like you're allowed to call out the board 'elite'.. They obviously have more football knowledge then the rest of us because they own the board or moderate or [b]have no other life but to post here.[/b] How could you ever call into question if Brat is actually a capable OC! I know I don't have a valid opinion because I had to move to Idaho for work so I can't make it to Cincy 8 times a year. This clearly makes me NOT a real fan and a complete fucking idiot. Brat sucks. Anyone defending him or shayne anymore clearly has an agenda or actually are complete idiots. But again, I'm just a (insert an insecure Go insult that's completely unheralded here) because I didn't go to the game so wtf could I know. [/quote] Screw you pal, I have a great life. I post here, I check back to see if anyone responded, throw a bag of chips at my little kids, post here some more, check back, kick my dog, post some more, check back...I do lots of stuff besides post here, all flaunting my supremo football knowledge and stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NASTYNATI Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 The injury excuses are all but stale... Look at the Colts, who the hell are Austin Collie and Pierre Garcon? Look at the Patriots all those years with no run game and a host of no name receivers? In this league your players need to be ready to go out and execute for 60 mins no matter who or what happens When they dont, Blame falls on the Coaches and rightfully so. The elite teams do this consistently, we make excuses. Last season Brat got a pass because of the injury to CP.This season no excuse, you cannot possibly defend how predictable we are on third down. I believe we kept Cedric in on one third and short yesterday, the rest of the time he was replaced by Leonard... If I can tell you what play we are going to call from my couch as soon as we leave the huddle, what do you think an opposing defense that has studied countless hours of film is able to do? GO, are you related to or a close friend of Brat and his family? I like many have noticed you get really defensive when anyone questions him and the job that he is doing here. Why are you so afraid of change? Zimmer came in and completely turned this thing around in 2 seasons, maybe we arent using our weapons to the best of their abilities... Its clear that Marvin and Brat are on two different wave lengths. Im ready for a change of scenery. 19 points per game with a Pro Bowl qb and a MAN at RB is unacceptable... BTW does anyone know when Brats contract is up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jungle1 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='GoBengals' date='10 January 2010 - 01:10 AM' timestamp='1263103801' post='855258'] really?....he cant fire any of them.. you're gasping at straws now.. saying poor offensive players performance is an OC's fault is hilarious and ridiculous all at the same time. PS: i dont think many of those coaches, aside from sheppard should be in much hot water.. they havent had a ton to work with...at least not on the active roster.. lack of actual talent is the over all issue. and lack of being able to get scrubbs to play at nfl starter caliber is the secondary issue..mostly caused by the first issue.. as i stated, he has proven, given the tools, he has have TREMENDOUS success in the pass and run games, now its someones job to get him the tools.... zimmer got his tools.... [/quote] I know you have your opinion, I just don't agree with it. I think it is time for Brat to go and from the rumors swirling lately, so does Marvin, JT and Willie Anderson. I trust all of them to be closer to the situation than us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Bunghole| Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't agree 100% with Go on Brat either, but I lay blame for this stinker of a game squarely at the feet of the man whom deserves it: Jim Lippincott. If he hadn't been mean to Pressly on camera when the Bengals cut him, our mojo would have been restored. Instead, the football gods invoked the karmaic justice rule upon us, and the rest was history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 There was some mention on several networks of how do you get Chad to beat Revis, all said the same "get him into motion before the snap" thing, didnt see any of that. What did they know that Brat didnt or what did Brat know that they didnt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschooler Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='NASTYNATI' date='10 January 2010 - 07:31 AM' timestamp='1263130279' post='855300'] BTW does anyone know when Brats contract is up? [/quote] I am not sure, but I think it is up now. I will ask Joe Reedy on twitter and see though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble In the Jungle Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 since ex players think Hue would do better, then bring Hue back as the OC. Shepperd has to go Brat has to go Shayne has to go Daniel Coates has to go whoever the fucks idea to draft Simpson has to go Simpson has to go re-sign Tank ASAP either draft a WR with our first pick or get a Free Agent one for sure. Brandon Marshall type dude. get Chase Coffman on board quick and lets see what he could do need Safety depth and DT depth for sure. hell maybe even LB's and CB's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|Tigers Johnson| Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Rumble In the Jungle' date='10 January 2010 - 08:41 AM' timestamp='1263130866' post='855306'] since ex players think Hue would do better, then bring Hue back as the OC. Shepperd has to go Brat has to go Shayne has to go Daniel Coates has to go whoever the fucks idea to draft Simpson has to go Simpson has to go re-sign Tank ASAP either draft a WR with our first pick or get a Free Agent one for sure. Brandon Marshall type dude. get Chase Coffman on board quick and lets see what he could do need Safety depth and DT depth for sure. hell maybe even LB's and CB's [/quote] I would add one thing and i agree with the rest.... Sign Kevin Walter and draft a WR.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jungle1 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Bunghole' date='10 January 2010 - 08:38 AM' timestamp='1263130701' post='855303'] I don't agree 100% with Go on Brat either, but I lay blame for this stinker of a game squarely at the feet of the man whom deserves it: Jim Lippincott. If he hadn't been mean to Pressly on camera when the Bengals cut him, our mojo would have been restored. Instead, the football gods invoked the karmaic justice rule upon us, and the rest was history. [/quote] I thought Marvin talked to Pressly and then we signed him to the practice squad. But, Tampa Bay signed him to their active roster. You may be thinking about JD Runnells (sp?) I wish we still had Pressley, actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_B Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 The number 1 signing that needs to happen is Zimmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
high plains drifter Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 Both Palmer and Graham had a terrible game. Benson was fantastic! Graham was the hardest to understand, since the ball placement didn’t look that bad, and he had been making chip shots all year. I did notice his kick off after the half only going to the Jets 40 yard line, though the announcers didn’t seem to notice. Palmer has been lousy all year long except for a number of late game drives and the Green Bay and Chicago games. Other than that he has been a shallow shell of the quarterback we had back in 2005. Why? I don’t know. I suspect an inability to get over the fear of getting your knee mauled again has most to do with it. He also seems to freeze up trying to guide his throws instead of letting them go more naturally. Missing all but two or three throws all game and missing every field goal will sink any offensive coordinator’s game calling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengals1181 Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't think Brat's awesome, but firing him only wastes next year IMO. Players learning a new system equals wasting another year of Carson/Chad and a year with a great defense. There are changes that can be made while keeping the same coaching. As some have suggested, Sheppard needs to go. Also, the talent level is still a bigger issue than coaching on offense. I'd be curious to see where offenses with new coordinators typically rank at the end of the first year. If they were to bring in anyone, I'd want it to be Hue Jackson. He recruited Carson Palmer to USC and coached him. He has a track record of success as a WR coach. He's been a successful QB coach in Baltimore. He's been a OC twice, both times losing his job after head coaching changes. He knows the Bengals system, so minimal changes would need to be made and it would be a simple transition for the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
|kennethmw| Posted January 10, 2010 Report Share Posted January 10, 2010 [quote name='Bengals1181' date='10 January 2010 - 08:50 AM' timestamp='1263131438' post='855315'] I don't think Brat's awesome, but firing him only wastes next year IMO. Players learning a new system equals wasting another year of Carson/Chad and a year with a great defense. There are changes that can be made while keeping the same coaching. As some have suggested, Sheppard needs to go. Also, the talent level is still a bigger issue than coaching on offense. I'd be curious to see where offenses with new coordinators typically rank at the end of the first year. If they were to bring in anyone, I'd want it to be Hue Jackson. He recruited Carson Palmer to USC and coached him. He has a track record of success as a WR coach. He's been a successful QB coach in Baltimore. He's been a OC twice, both times losing his job after head coaching changes. He knows the Bengals system, so minimal changes would need to be made and it would be a simple transition for the players. [/quote] Agreed. If you're going to make a change from Brat I would want Hue. He is one of the few guys that I personally think could step in and tweak this offense without trying to do a complete re-do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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