The Beautiful, the Good, the Bad, and the Ugly, Oakland Edition

[T-Dub]

The halftime adjustment you guys are talking about took place in the 4th quarter & the adjustment was "this game's over, let's get the 2nd string some playing time."  

 

 

[SouthPaw]

I don't think you really understand what was being said. I don't think anyone is shitting on the Bengals. I know I'm not. I am just trying to identify areas where I think they need to improve. I thought their win in Oakland was very impressive. I won't take anything away from them by saying "a shitty Oakland team" or "Oakland sucks" because they are an NFL team, and any NFL team can beat any NFL team on any given Sunday. 

When someone points out the ugly in a thread that requests people to point out the ugly, it's not focusing on the negative. It's just pointing out things we saw that the Bengals need to improve on. When the Bengals make the playoffs this year, it won't matter that they beat Oakland in Week 1, but if they don't make better half time adjustments, that will matter. 

this probably made way too much sense to fly with some on this board.  

[T-Dub]

this probably made way too much sense to fly with some on this board.  

 

If garbage time scores in a week one blowout win indicate a problem with theoretical playoff coaching 3.5 months from now I'm going to have to question your judgement as to what is sensible. 

Are we going to do this every week or can we agree that mistakes are amplified in the postseason and worry about that if & when we reach said postseason? We're all aware of the 0-4 record.  I feel safe in saying that nobody here is responsible for that.

Dropping TD's is extra bad in the playoffs but, Blind non-reality-facing Homer that I am, I choose to believe that he will make that catch next time.  I know, optimism - literally Hitler.  

[SouthPaw]

 

If garbage time scores in a week one blowout win indicate a problem with theoretical playoff coaching 3.5 months from now I'm going to have to question your judgement as to what is sensible. 

Are we going to do this every week or can we agree that mistakes are amplified in the postseason and worry about that if & when we reach said postseason?

Dropping TD's is extra bad in the playoffs but, Blind non-reality-facing Homer than I am I will choose to believe that he will make that catch next time.  I know, optimism - literally Hitler.

i believe he will make it too.  it does get frustrating watching a player of that caliber have some of the drops he has.  however, most importantly from my point of view, was how Andy and Co. stepped up and annihilated the Raiders basically without Green having a major impact as far as splash plays are concerned.  His presence alone definitely has an impact on a defense for sure though.  Your point is well taken.  I am just excited to see if this thing stays on the tracks this week. Sunday's game was fun to watch.

[DudleyDawson]

 

If garbage time scores in a week one blowout win indicate a problem with theoretical playoff coaching 3.5 months from now I'm going to have to question your judgement as to what is sensible. 

Are we going to do this every week or can we agree that mistakes are amplified in the postseason and worry about that if & when we reach said postseason?

Dropping TD's is extra bad in the playoffs but, Blind non-reality-facing Homer than I am I will choose to believe that he will make that catch next time.  I know, optimism - literally Hitler.

Once again TDub I have to say that you're just not understanding what is being said. For that I recommend that when you read something and it doesn't make sense, always reread it. More often than not, it's probably that you didn't read it correctly. In my comment about half time adjustments, I wasn't referring to the late TD's by the Raiders. I was referring to coming out in the 2nd half and going 3 and out and said it was unacceptable to do that when you win the coin flip and defer. I also said it has been an issue with Marvin over the years. 

 

Here is my post. Reread it and you'll see ... 

"I agree with you HavePityPlease. When the Bengals defer to get the ball in the 2nd half, it's not so they can come out and go 3 and out. This has been a problem for many years under Marvin. It's not a matter of "oh well what's the score" It doesn't matter what the score is. You come out and put a drive together. It's one thing to get a couple marginal holding calls or something like that to set them back, but just 3 and out is unacceptable.

Some people seem to be happy with just making the playoffs, and some people want to go all the way. The Bengals know what it takes to make the playoffs, but they don't seem to know how to take it a step further. I believe trying to identify weaknesses is how to do it, and their inability to come out after halftime and get immediate points is an area that if they can improve, it will help their chances. When you have a team down 24-0 at half and you come out and drive down the field and score, you are making a statement that this game is over. Coming out and going 3 and out says to the other team that this game isn't over."

[T-Dub]

 

Some people seem to be happy just making the playoffs

 

FTFY.  Nobody likes it when they lose, save those few who seem to be looking for validation for their own negativity. 

There may be one or two exceptions lurking but for most of us we're just watching the game same as you.  I think that can get lost in the heat of the moment when something goes wrong & we have a broader outlet here to discuss it.  None of us made that bad call or bad throw or have the power to fire/cut so-and so.  We all have ideas, some more outlandish than others & they're fun to kick around, but in the end we can't do shit other than change the channel.  If we're not willing to do that...

[Jamie_B]

Just want to take the time to welcome the new guys on this supposedly "dying" board. (lol at the two people still complaining about that)

 

[|SF2|]

 

If garbage time scores in a week one blowout win indicate a problem with theoretical playoff coaching 3.5 months from now I'm going to have to question your judgement as to what is sensible. 

Are we going to do this every week or can we agree that mistakes are amplified in the postseason and worry about that if & when we reach said postseason? We're all aware of the 0-4 record.  I feel safe in saying that nobody here is responsible for that.

Dropping TD's is extra bad in the playoffs but, Blind non-reality-facing Homer that I am, I choose to believe that he will make that catch next time.  I know, optimism - literally Hitler.  

You debating a point that has NOT been made.  Nobody cares about the 13 points given up in garbage time in the fourth quarter besides me who had the Bengals defense in fantasy.   The discussion is that the Bengals always seem to come out of the locker room after halftime and lay an egg.  What are the stats?

In 18 games since last year the Bengals have managed to score  only 4 times on their first 3rd quarter possession.   That is 4 scores out of 18 possessions or 22%.  That average in the NFL is 34% and the top 10 teams around 40% or higher.

Of those 4, 2 were after a turnover giving us excellent field position and another after Pac Man returned the kickoff 80 yards again giving us great field position.   Only one was from a sustained drive.   Marvin or rather our O coordinator, time and time again gets out-coached at halftime and the offense comes out flat.  

[scharm]

You debating a point that has NOT been made.  Nobody cares about the 13 points given up in garbage time in the fourth quarter besides me who had the Bengals defense in fantasy.   The discussion is that the Bengals always seem to come out of the locker room after halftime and lay an egg.  What are the stats?

In 18 games since last year the Bengals have managed to score  only 4 times on their first 3rd quarter possession.   That is 4 scores out of 18 possessions. 

Of those 4, 2 were after a turnover giving us excellent field position and another after Pac Man returned the kickoff 80 yards again giving us great field position.   Only one was from a sustained drive.   Marvin or rather our O coordinator, time and time again gets out-coached at halftime. 

That's Ugly.   Although I think it diminishes the problem too even as ugly as that is.

Sure you would love to score coming out of the second half.     In the Oakland game, they went 3 and out.   The 3rd down play was a delayed handoff to Hill out of shotgun that got stuffed.

They basically ran off a couple minutes.      The Bengals end up choking the life out of them anyway but that's a prime opportunity to eat up some clock and flip the field even if you don't score. 

[HairOnFire]

Are we going to do this every week or can we agree that mistakes are amplified in the postseason and worry about that if & when we reach said postseason? We're all aware of the 0-4 record.  I feel safe in saying that nobody here is responsible for that.

Of course they're going to do it every week.

For those who don't get it yet, the so-called season without joy is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Nutshelled, the people who talk about it the most are the same ones who try so hard to ensure it happens.

Best, because you already know who most of them are there's no need to actually name them.

Just round up the usual suspects.

 

 

[|High School Harry|]

For the Peko / watch much fotball crew...  Below are the defensive stats for Sunday's game.  Peko grades out at a -1.2 with negative scores in both Rush and Pass Defense. My original statement was that he is a liability and I stand by that.   Forget the "but, but, but", procrastination and personal shots at me.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/9/16/9333281/week-1-bengals-vs-raiders-pro-football-focus-grades-and-analysis?ref=yfp

[Bengals1181]

For the Peko / watch much fotball crew...  Below are the defensive stats for Sunday's game.  Peko grades out at a -1.2 with negative scores in both Rush and Pass Defense. My original statement was that he is a liability and I stand by that.   Forget the "but, but, but", procrastination and personal shots at me.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/9/16/9333281/week-1-bengals-vs-raiders-pro-football-focus-grades-and-analysis?ref=yfp

 

 

I don't have a dog in this fight, but its PFF man.  They also said this:

 

NT Dan Williams (+7.1) and DE Justin Tuck (+8.2) were absolutely dominant throughout the game. 

 

 

The Bengals RB's averaged 4.7ypc, Dalton completed 74% of his passes, and he was only touched once. That doesn't happen if 2 of the starting DL are dominant. They also gave Khalil Mack a great grade for 3 tackles, 2 pressures (out of 28 rushes) and 0 QB hits.

 

 

PFF does a lot of good things, player grades isn't one of them.

 

[membengal]

"I agree with you HavePityPlease. When the Bengals defer to get the ball in the 2nd half, it's not so they can come out and go 3 and out. This has been a problem for many years under Marvin. It's not a matter of "oh well what's the score" It doesn't matter what the score is. You come out and put a drive together. It's one thing to get a couple marginal holding calls or something like that to set them back, but just 3 and out is unacceptable.

This is absolutely correct. And, frankly, one of the reasons they don't win playoff games. Coming out of the half-time locker-room seems to befuddle Marvin-coached teams. It happened again Sunday. Didn't matter because game was well in hand, but definitely something worth noting. Was hoping for at least a few first downs and bleeding some clock. Against better teams, if you give them some light, they will take it. 

[membengal]

Also - PFF is generally trash - but especially their player grades.

[B.A.B.]

But anyone who is being objective can see that Peko is a bad football player and has been for years. 

 

The end. 

[scharm]

Not to be insulting but you ALL are being a bunch of idiots in regards to Peko.    This is objective:

Is Peko's role more of a run stuffer or pass rusher?   Objective: Run stuffer.

The Oakland Raiders ran 16 times.   According to the table above Peko played 29 plays of which 9 were runs and 20 were passes. 

DUH!  Figure it out.

On to PFF,  don't really care but is it their job to grade players on role or face value?   I'd say face value.   The Raiders were throwing and Peko isn't a pass rusher.    Which accounts for his low actual play count of 29

Figure it out and move on with your lives.   Thank you.

[T-Dub]

"Dude he's on my fantasy team and my bro's cousin said he met him once at a party and he was cool as hell bro..  +3 grade!"

 

-PFF, probably.

[membengal]

I don't give a shit about Peko - I just know that PFF's grades are fucking weird. Any system that has the Raiders d-line as being "dominant"  after what the Bengals offense did to them is seriously fucked. Don't know why the weird need to defend PFF from some. They are pretty shit.

 

I also would never bother having to know that about them if their diarrhea analysis wasn't sprayed about this place all the time. And it's shit analysis whether it is saying good things or bad things about Bengals players. It's just pretty much completely useless. 

[Dautcom08]

PFF just rated Dalton the 2nd most accurate passer from Week 1.  So I think everyone on this board can at least now agree to discredit their player grades.

[|Elflocko|]

PFF just rated Dalton the 2nd most accurate passer from Week 1.  So I think everyone on this board can at least now agree to discredit their player grades.

[|kennethmw|]

I don't give a shit about Peko - I just know that PFF's grades are fucking weird. Any system that has the Raiders d-line as being "dominant"  after what the Bengals offense did to them is seriously fucked. Don't know why the weird need to defend PFF from some. They are pretty shit.

 

I also would never bother having to know that about them if their diarrhea analysis wasn't sprayed about this place all the time. And it's shit analysis whether it is saying good things or bad things about Bengals players. It's just pretty much completely useless. 

Well said, but if it's a bad thing certain posters will hang on every word like it's the last rope over a lake full of alligators.

[T-Dub]

I would suggest Football Outsiders if you're going to put stock in player grades assigned by people watching the game on TV.  They may be just as arbitrary but at least they aren't afraid to admit it when numbers don't add up or they get weird results.  You know someone's "analysis" is bullshit when it always confirms their opinions.

[|Numbers|]

[|SF2|]

Welcome to our world circa 2002 bro.

[scharm]

Clearly this guy doesn't work for PFF.