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Posted

 

Hey - I didn't write it and I know it's bullshit....don't shoot the messenger.

 

 

Story by Matt Verderame
 

 

Sometimes, the right move is the toughest to make. The Cincinnati Bengals should get comfortable with that idea.

 

The Bengals, who are 4–8 and in third place of the AFC North, can’t repeat how they’ve operated the past several months. They’ve had trade requests from receiver Tee Higgins and edge rusher Trey Hendrickson. Cincinnati also dealt with a high-profile, summer-long holdout from wideout Ja’Marr Chase, which ended with Chase still wanting an extension.

 

Once the season began, things only went downhill. Joe Burrow has MVP numbers (3,337 yards, 30 TDs) and Chase is the league’s most productive receiver with NFL highs in receiving yards (1,142) and touchdowns (13). 

 

Still, Cincinnati needs a miracle to reach the postseason with a defense entering Week 14 ranked tied for 29th in sacks, 27th against the pass, 22nd against the run, 28th on third down and 30th in the red zone.  

 

All those factors explain why the Bengals should trade Chase this offseason.

 

Of the half-dozen front-office personnel and general managers I’ve spoken with around the league, almost all believe Cincinnati would either get a deal equivalent to or likely exceeding what the Kansas City Chiefs got when they traded Tyreek Hill in March 2022.

 

“I would think so,” says a prominent NFC talent evaluator. “He’s a better overall player and I would guess less baggage and younger at the time of the trade.” 

 

“Speed, explosion, ball skills and versatility," says another front-office personnel man when asked why Chase would command at least the same level of return. “Both are studs.”

 

In Cincinnati’s case, Chase is only 24 years old. He has one year left on his rookie contract, and doesn’t have the significant off-field issues Hill dragged into the NFL after pleading guilty to punching and choking his pregnant girlfriend while at Oklahoma State.

 

Ultimately, Chiefs general manager Brett Veach has used the Hill trade to rebuild an aging and declining defense, shore up the offensive line, and add skill-position talent after saving approximately $75 million in cap space—Hill’s projected guaranteed number in Kansas City. The moves by Veach since sending the dynamic receiver to Miami: 

 

  • He signed receivers JuJu Smith-Schuster, Justin Watson and Marquez Valdes-Scantling in free agency, drafted Skyy Moore and traded months later for Kadarius Toney. 
  • He used the draft capital to trade up multiple times, including selecting All-Pro cornerback Trent McDuffie in the first round and star receiver Rashee Rice in the second round.
  • He brought veteran defensive talents over the past two seasons, including safety Justin Reid, linebacker Drue Tranquill, defensive end Charles Omenihu and others to help rebuild a failing unit. 
  • He signed All-Pro center Creed Humphrey and defensive tackle Chris Jones to market-setting contracts. With Hill’s bloated number on the books, one or both deals might not have been possible.

 

In the immediate aftermath of trading Hill, quarterback Patrick Mahomes thrived during the 2022 season. He threw for a career-high 5,250 yards on his way to another MVP season, while Kansas City went 14–3 and earned the AFC’s top seed. In the playoffs, Mahomes and the Chiefs won their second Super Bowl in four seasons, before repeating the feat in ’23 to secure themselves as a team for the ages. 

 

It’s been a struggle at times this year offensively, but the Chiefs are 11–1 going into Week 14. 

 

For the Bengals, this could be the smart path to follow, although not everyone is in complete agreement.

 

“I struggle with trading real good players,” says one former longtime general manager. “How about we keep [Chase], pay him so his cap numbers don’t strangle us and still fix the defense?”

 

That said, Cincinnati has never been keen on giving out huge guaranteed money, save for Burrow’s contract. If the Bengals decide to pay market value for Chase this offseason, owner Mike Brown is likely looking at somewhere near four years, $150 million and north of $100 million guaranteed. Chase’s agent, Caitlin Aoki, will be working off the recent deals of both CeeDee Lamb and former LSU teammate Justin Jefferson. In Dallas, Lamb signed a four-year, $136 million contract including a record $38 million signing bonus. Meanwhile, Jefferson landed a four-year deal worth $140 million, with $110 million guaranteed in Minnesota.

 

For any team, it’s tough to pay quarterback money for a receiver. For Cincinnati, it’s borderline unfathomable. 

 

By moving off Chase, the Bengals could acquire enough future cap space and draft picks to transform a roster riddled with issues. Cincinnati would undoubtedly spark a bidding war by putting Chase on the block, driving up what many in league circles say would already be a historic price. 

 

Looking around the NFL, there are a few teams I believe make the most sense. The New England Patriots and Washington Commanders are both intriguing, as each has extra draft picks, ample cap space and a rookie quarterback who needs more skill-position talent to reach his full potential. 

 

For both, here’s what a potential trade could look like:

 

To New England

  • Cincinnati receives: 2025 second- and two third-round picks; ’26 first- and fourth-round picks
  • New England receives: Chase

 

To Washington

  • Cincinnati receives: 2025 first-, second- and fifth-round picks; ’26 first- and third-round picks
  • Washington receives: Chase

In both deals, the Bengals would add a minimum of four top-100 selections over the next two drafts. 

 

 

Furthermore, Cincinnati would also have the ammunition to either sign Higgins to a lucrative, but lesser, extension, or allow Higgins to walk before breaking past tendencies and spending meaningful money in free agency. 

 

Looking ahead to this offseason’s available targets, Bengals general manager Duke Tobin could recreate what Kansas City did for Mahomes in 2022 by retaining Higgins to play the role of Travis Kelce, before signing second-tier weapons such as Darius Slayton, Greg Dortch and even an older player coming off injury such as Stefon Diggs. 

 

At the same time, the Bengals could shore up their defense with a youth movement, buttressed by quality veterans, including names such as defensive ends Dante Fowler Jr. and Chase Young, corners D.J. Reed and Rasul Douglas, and safeties Justin Reid and Justin Simmons. 

 

Ultimately, the idea would be to let Burrow elevate a lesser receiving corps while the rest of the team, the portion Burrow can’t elevate with his skills, improves dramatically while much of it plays on cheap, rookie contracts. 

 

If the Bengals let Higgins leave in free agency but sign Chase to a record-setting deal, the move will be lauded but also fraught with peril considering the rest of the roster, specifically the defense. 

 

By trading Chase, Tobin could fortify an entire unit, making Burrow’s job infinitely easier. And by extension, the trade would help Cincinnati’s offensive line, which wouldn’t be in the mode of obvious passing down from a snap-to-snap basis late in games. 

 

If the Bengals trade Chase, they’ll be ridiculed as cheap. They’ll be called lost. They’ll be ripped from coast to coast.

 

But they’ll also have made the toughest move imaginable. And if they nail their draft picks, they’ll also be right.

 

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/bengals-should-trade-ja-marr-chase-to-reopen-their-super-bowl-window/ar-AA1vk4Na?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=cac8952eb35c4377a85103a537d35027&ei=91

  • Like 1
Posted

Does anyone really trust this ownership on their ability in evaluating any kind of talent regardless if it is the players or coaches?  Mikey and his clan would screw this up.  Hell, they have $42 million of cap space and they didn’t spend it.  Total mis-management with current talent and they would miss-manage any additional evaluation future draft picks.  Their track record in evaluating draft and free agent talent is very suspect.  This is one reason the Team is in the state it is in now.  Trading Chase would take this team down another level of futility.  At least it is exciting to see him and burrow connect.  That’s the only thing I can look forward too this season because a large wins of isn’t going to happen.

  • Like 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, Griever said:

I'm with Paul, pass.

 

Screenshot_20241205-090704.png

Dehner absolutely nails the great opportunity for a roster reset with these two sentences. "They haven't really paid anyone except Burrow. Contracts with easy outs and dead weight everywhere." You can rebuild in a hurry in the NFL when you have a franchise QB and easy ways to lose the dead weight. The front office needs to drop the notion that all they need is Burrow and a halfway decent starting group. You need some playmakers on both sides of the ball to compete. They have to admit, at least to themselves, that they have overrated their own roster and decide to make significant upgrades across the board. 

 

They have easy ways to create all kinds of cap space, but they will have to want to spend the money to rebuild the roster while shedding the dead weight. Franchise QB contracts get restructured all the time to create more opportunities to sign impact free agents. But the key question remains.  Do they even want to spend the necessary money to rebuild the defense in a hurry? Because that's what it will take to get the team back to where it was a couple of seasons ago. 

  • Upvote 1
Posted
22 minutes ago, BronxBengal said:

Does anyone really trust this ownership on their ability in evaluating any kind of talent regardless if it is the players or coaches?  Mikey and his clan would screw this up.  Hell, they have $42 million of cap space and they didn’t spend it.  Total mis-management with current talent and they would miss-manage any additional evaluation future draft picks.  Their track record in evaluating draft and free agent talent is very suspect.  This is one reason the Team is in the state it is in now.  Trading Chase would take this team down another level of futility.  At least it is exciting to see him and burrow connect.  That’s the only thing I can look forward too this season because a large wins of isn’t going to happen.

 

 

Where are you getting $42 million in cap space they didn't spend?  They have a little under $6.5 million in cap space. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/_/year/2024/sort/cap_maximum_space

  • Upvote 1
Posted

Yeah, I'm bat(mobile) shit crazy but I do not think the Cincinnati Bengals are on the critical list.

 

Our current wretched season is due to some degree of poor drafting (Murphy), free agency (Rankins, Stone),

injuries (up and coming Dax Hill, probably Mac, throw in Hubbard and Tee), poor player development (Cam Not Too-Swift, Mild M, Burton) 

and as a team some of the piss poorest

officiating in the history of the NFL going all the way back to Kansas City and the Rats, Squeels et al.  A few unscrewed

calls that affected us and, even as poor as our D is, we are seriously in the play off hunt.  Think about it.

 

Get a decent new D coordinator and crew, good draft (fuck it... tank and no dead cat bounces)

Wise free agent movies and trade some draft choices even at the trade deadline.

Sign Ja'Marr and maybe tag and trade Tee (great when he is on the game but misses too much time).

Keep Zac... I think he is the catalyst that makes the chemistry cook.

 

In other words... I don't think we are unfixable too bad off at this point.

Seriously, even with the poor D, Cam Taylor-Dumb Ass, and injuries

we are a few horribly blown calls from at least wild card contention this year.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 3
Posted
40 minutes ago, Randle P McMurphy said:

 

 

Where are you getting $42 million in cap space they didn't spend?  They have a little under $6.5 million in cap space. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/_/year/2024/sort/cap_maximum_space

You are right about the cap space, but the way the Bengals structure contracts aren't designed to create more cap space but instead to fill it up. According to the numbers, they are middle of the pack in terms of available cap space, but plenty of teams ranked above them in terms of space have more players extended to big many contracts.

 

Most teams in the NFL manipulate the salary cap to gain additional space, the Bengals do basically the opposite of that. That's why they are ranked number one in the league in overall cap health, which is very different than cap space. I would prefer the Bengals be middle of the pack in terms of cap health. If you are at the top of that ranking, then you aren't really trying very hard to win. Teams like the Eagles and the Browns (hasn't worked for them yet but no one tries any harder) are really trying to win.

  • Upvote 1
Posted

While I think it is ludicrous to think that this will happen, I did think Whit's assertion that had he been GM, he would have traded Tee was an interesting idea. Easy to say in hindsight, but his logic made sense - i.e., that it was unlikely they'd have paid two WRs and Joe big $, and they could parlay Tee for a lot of draft capital to address needs elsewhere, while his value was at a very high level. 

If I were GM now, I'd tag and trade Tee to extract more value than a 3rd round pick, but I wouldn't bet on it. 

  • Upvote 1
Posted
1 hour ago, dex said:

You are right about the cap space, but the way the Bengals structure contracts aren't designed to create more cap space but instead to fill it up. According to the numbers, they are middle of the pack in terms of available cap space, but plenty of teams ranked above them in terms of space have more players extended to big many contracts.

 

Most teams in the NFL manipulate the salary cap to gain additional space, the Bengals do basically the opposite of that. That's why they are ranked number one in the league in overall cap health, which is very different than cap space. I would prefer the Bengals be middle of the pack in terms of cap health. If you are at the top of that ranking, then you aren't really trying very hard to win. Teams like the Eagles and the Browns (hasn't worked for them yet but no one tries any harder) are really trying to win.

We have $100M in cap space to play with.

I've said it before... We had three generational talents on their rookie deals 3 years ago. Instead of going all in when they had a good hand, the Bengals made decisions about not signing Jessie Bates to potentially sign Higgins and Chase way off in the future. And now that plan is in jeopardy. Instead of front loading deals for guys while the top 3 were cheap...

It's like looking at a guy who keeps a million dollars stuffed in his mattress and thinking he's smart with his money. I mean, look at all of that cash! The guy who invested it all doesn't have all of this cash! 

 

image.thumb.png.b403fa922656fc03ebfccd3bf5b6905f.png

  • Upvote 1
Posted
2 hours ago, Randle P McMurphy said:

 

 

Where are you getting $42 million in cap space they didn't spend?  They have a little under $6.5 million in cap space. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/_/year/2024/sort/cap_maximum_space

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-salary-cap-tracker-2024-offseason-free-agency-all-32-nfl-teams-ranked-cap-space
 

The $42 million was before the season started.

  • Upvote 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, Bleeds Orange said:

What if they traded him to Detroit for Penei Sewell?  :ninja:

 

Being serious, the only way trading him for a bunch of draft picks makes sense is if someone from some other organization makes the picks.

 

Yeah, the plan actually has some validity and logic...and seems to be working for the Chiefs.  But the above is where I stand on it in all honesty.  Plus the fact that I would absolutely hate to lose Chase...he and Burrow ARE the Bengals at this point IMHO.  Just so frustrating that we continue to waste the window of opportunity with those two guys in particular.  Joe would be the NFL MVP if we had a winning record.  Frustrating.

  • Upvote 1
Posted

Trading Burrow or Hendrickson would also get us more draft picks and cap space. Still wouldn't be a good idea.

 

Gaining draft picks doesn't mean much if they aren't developed into good players. That's a problem we already have and need to fix first. Tobin should be fired but letting Mike and Katie hire his replacement doesn't bode well either.

 

I'd like to see Hamilton County put a clause in the lease that adjusts the rent for the team's record. More wins equals cheaper rent as sales tax revenues will offset the lost rent for the county. It might motivate the owners to try harder. 

  • Like 1
Posted
5 hours ago, BronxBengal said:

Does anyone really trust this ownership on their ability in evaluating any kind of talent regardless if it is the players or coaches?  Mikey and his clan would screw this up.  Hell, they have $42 million of cap space and they didn’t spend it.  Total mis-management with current talent and they would miss-manage any additional evaluation future draft picks.  Their track record in evaluating draft and free agent talent is very suspect.  This is one reason the Team is in the state it is in now.  Trading Chase would take this team down another level of futility.  At least it is exciting to see him and burrow connect.  That’s the only thing I can look forward too this season because a large wins of isn’t going to happen.

 

1. Mike has nothing to do with shit, he is fucking 90, wtf do you think mike brown is doing? 10 years ago he stepped away from daily operations, A DECADE. but here we are.. same shit from this fanbase year after year.

 

2. You mean do i trust them to pull a free agent guys like, say: Dj Reader, Mike Hilton, Chidobe Awuzie, Larry Oganjobi, Good Vonn Bell, Useful Eli Apple, Trey Hendrickson, Ted Karras, Ted Cappa, Orlando Brown Jr. Bj Hill in a trade, etc? I do.. wanna know why?

 

3. Do I trust them to draft guys like: Joe Burrow, jamarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Joe mixon, Jessie Bates, jenkins, Chase Brown, Logan Wilson, Germain Pratt, David Gaither? I do.. wanna know why?

 

you are correct(and wrong) about one thing, there is ONE reason the bengals are in the state they are in right now...

 

That state:

 

top 5 offense in the nfl

bottom 5 defense.

 

the ONE REASON? i lied its two reasons.

 

Reason 1. The defensive free agents we brought in didnt pan out, it be like that sometimes.

Reason 2. We had record breaking injuries on the defensive side of the ball this season. last I check starters and key rotation snap guys were on track to miss 70 games. thats 40% of your defense missing any given game on average. Last year without a great defense at all, we gave up 22.6 PPG, this year its 28.1 PPG. so if we just had last years defensive production, we would have what? 9-10 wins right now?

 

i have openly laid out the 7-9 spots we need to upgrade, but even fixing half of them would have the defense in the middle of the pack, and the teams record battling for a top seed in the AFC.

 

 

  • Upvote 2
Posted
2 hours ago, Randle P McMurphy said:

 

They spent it, just on the wrong guys.  (Rankins and Stone on defense anyway!)  

 

One thing to note - fully HALF of that is being spent on just Tee, on the tag.

 

I recently decided to look at the actual cap breakdown of the Bengals vs a few top teams.  It definitely looks more interesting from that perspective because you see how those teams are really not paying much to the lower majority of their roster, i.e. they're getting great value (Detroit is a very good example).   But I didn't see any of them paying anyone on the tag, at least not a large amount (feel free to give me examples of teams that are, it just wasn't true of the teams I looked at).  I mean, why would you?  If you seriously want to compete for championships, why in hell would you EVER allow yourself to be chewing off a chunk of your cap on a huge franchise tag salary?  Spread that love around to increase your chances, especially if you have holes, or sign the person to a team-friendly cap breakdown. 

 

Some things that are immediately obviously "different" about the Bengals:

  1. We appear to have a lot more guys on high regular salaries, i.e. large individual cap hits compared to other teams who find ways to spread the hit out.  
  2. We have far fewer players with guaranteed money - and if we do, I believe every one of them was a roster bonus.  Other teams have straight up guarantees, and as we know this is something the Bengals aggressively avoid.
  3. I better understand the Trey angle now - he has a $20M cap hit.  Extending him would be MUTUALLY beneficial, and that's probably why he or his agent went scorched earth in the offseason.  Why would the Bengals not do this?  Why let your back-loaded contracts balloon the cap hit?

So what's my argument here?  Simply said, it's wrong to just look at the base "cap space" number for a current season, because they are mandated to hit a minimum that is most of the cap anyway.  The story is told in the breakdown, and comparing that breakdown to how consistently successful teams are doing it.

  • Upvote 2
Posted
38 minutes ago, HavePityPlease said:

 

One thing to note - fully HALF of that is being spent on just Tee, on the tag.

 

I recently decided to look at the actual cap breakdown of the Bengals vs a few top teams.  It definitely looks more interesting from that perspective because you see how those teams are really not paying much to the lower majority of their roster, i.e. they're getting great value (Detroit is a very good example).   But I didn't see any of them paying anyone on the tag, at least not a large amount (feel free to give me examples of teams that are, it just wasn't true of the teams I looked at).  I mean, why would you?  If you seriously want to compete for championships, why in hell would you EVER allow yourself to be chewing off a chunk of your cap on a huge franchise tag salary?  Spread that love around to increase your chances, especially if you have holes, or sign the person to a team-friendly cap breakdown. 

 

Some things that are immediately obviously "different" about the Bengals:

  1. We appear to have a lot more guys on high regular salaries, i.e. large individual cap hits compared to other teams who find ways to spread the hit out.  
  2. We have far fewer players with guaranteed money - and if we do, I believe every one of them was a roster bonus.  Other teams have straight up guarantees, and as we know this is something the Bengals aggressively avoid.
  3. I better understand the Trey angle now - he has a $20M cap hit.  Extending him would be MUTUALLY beneficial, and that's probably why he or his agent went scorched earth in the offseason.  Why would the Bengals not do this?  Why let your back-loaded contracts balloon the cap hit?

So what's my argument here?  Simply said, it's wrong to just look at the base "cap space" number for a current season, because they are mandated to hit a minimum that is most of the cap anyway.  The story is told in the breakdown, and comparing that breakdown to how consistently successful teams are doing it.

 

lol

the bengals do NOT have higher salary cap hit salaries. you didnt even look at other teams caps did you? 

Other teams do not find a way to spread it out. Trey is a 20-26mil a year level player.. let me know the magic math that counts a player lower than his worth?!?!?! 

 

Trey is the #1 sack leader in the entire NFL.... he is the 11th paid... nick bosa makes 34 mil a year. the pretend spreading it out you talk about, is, again, fake years, he got 5 years 170mil, his last two years are 52 and 42 mil cap hits, which they can cut for prorated bonus hit of 16 mil. those are fake years they will never pay. 

 

You are sitting there saying, Bosa makes 34 a year and only counts 16 against the cap this year.. thats magic!!! they "moved it around". they sure did. he is a 42 mil cap hit year after next, and 30mil hit if cut that year.. they fucked themselves later to make room now. the bengals dont fuck themselves later. ever. it fucks the player and it fucks the team.

 

why do you want to do that? why do you think thats good? 

 

PS: how ARE the 49ers doing this year?

 

the two things you think you are talking about are:

 

1. Giving fake years you are just going to cut and never pay like Dak Prescotts deal, he wont be seeing that 72mil cap hit in the last year. Bengals dont offer fake years. This is a good thing, its the proper way to do business.

 

2. Giving a huge chunk in a early year out of pocket, so lesser hits in future years. Bengals so this literally all the time. Joes deal doesnt count over 55 against the cap until 2029, Dak hits at 89 mil next year, then 68, 62, and 72 mil. his deal averages 60 mil a year, joes averages 55 mil a year.Trevors deal, same as joes in tota, he is a hit of 78 and 72 in the last year years. those are the fake years, not guaranteed at all, he will be cut before those years hit. so 150mil of fake money in his deal. 

 

PS how ARE the cowboys and Jags doing this year?

 

Trey is a steal at current salary, he agent pissed himself because he is worth 28 mil a year or more, probably 30, and gets paid 20, and he is aging, hitting 30, and knows he will only see one more deal most likely, cashing in when you are a top sack leader in the league is a good time for that for his client and his pockets, aside from his agent saying he wants a trade (which accomplished what?) the bengals are getting the steal of the decade RN. and you are knocking it..

 

hilarious

  • Upvote 2
Posted
29 minutes ago, HavePityPlease said:

 

One thing to note - fully HALF of that is being spent on just Tee, on the tag.

 

I recently decided to look at the actual cap breakdown of the Bengals vs a few top teams.  It definitely looks more interesting from that perspective because you see how those teams are really not paying much to the lower majority of their roster, i.e. they're getting great value (Detroit is a very good example).   But I didn't see any of them paying anyone on the tag, at least not a large amount (feel free to give me examples of teams that are, it just wasn't true of the teams I looked at).  I mean, why would you?  If you seriously want to compete for championships, why in hell would you EVER allow yourself to be chewing off a chunk of your cap on a huge franchise tag salary?  Spread that love around to increase your chances, especially if you have holes, or sign the person to a team-friendly cap breakdown. 

 

Some things that are immediately obviously "different" about the Bengals:

  1. We appear to have a lot more guys on high regular salaries, i.e. large individual cap hits compared to other teams who find ways to spread the hit out.  
  2. We have far fewer players with guaranteed money - and if we do, I believe every one of them was a roster bonus.  Other teams have straight up guarantees, and as we know this is something the Bengals aggressively avoid.
  3. I better understand the Trey angle now - he has a $20M cap hit.  Extending him would be MUTUALLY beneficial, and that's probably why he or his agent went scorched earth in the offseason.  Why would the Bengals not do this?  Why let your back-loaded contracts balloon the cap hit?

So what's my argument here?  Simply said, it's wrong to just look at the base "cap space" number for a current season, because they are mandated to hit a minimum that is most of the cap anyway.  The story is told in the breakdown, and comparing that breakdown to how consistently successful teams are doing it.

And constantly signing FA's to one or two year prove it deals without a lot of guaranteed money means you don't get the best guys. (And on a very meta level, it doesn't make the player feel like you believe in them.)

There's a reason that guys like Geno Stone and Sheldon Rankins were available a week into FA. And there's a difference between getting a great value and getting a great player.

The franchise tag represents a failure to negotiate... And for the 50 years I've been watching Bengals football, I can't think of one guy we franchise tagged that DIDN'T sandbag through that season. Players hate it... They're getting paid, yes, but they're also being controlled. And that rubs raw. (And if you think Franchising Tee didn't make Chase's negotiations a little tougher... They're friends too.) You're playing for a club that wants you to put your body and future on the line but they won't make the same commitment to you.

Having $60M in cap space every year is not the same thing and sound cap management. NFL Films has yet to make an epic video about the most fiscally responsible teams in NFL history. "The Bengals, coming off a 4-12 season are optimistic, they have the league's 5th highest cap space and they have value players they hope to target in the second week of Free Agency. They got better than expected performance for Eli Apple and are hoping to catch lightning in a bottle again. They may let foes fill up the scoring sheet, but they are the undisputed kings of the balance sheet." (Slo-mo footage of Katie spiking a laptop in the endzone)

  • Like 2
Posted
9 minutes ago, GoBengals said:

PS: how ARE the 49ers doing this year?

The Bills have $70M in dead money and are 10-2. Equal to the 49ers. I don't think dead money is the deciding factor our FO thinks it is.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Posted
21 minutes ago, LostInDaJungle said:

The Bills have $70M in dead money and are 10-2. Equal to the 49ers. I don't think dead money is the deciding factor our FO thinks it is.

The 49ers have had a rash of injuries on offense.

The defense shows aging..

 

Their window to the SB has ended.

They'll start a new 3 yr plan again ..

Is that where the Bengals are at?

  • Upvote 1
Posted
3 hours ago, GoBengals said:

 

1. Mike has nothing to do with shit, he is fucking 90, wtf do you think mike brown is doing? 10 years ago he stepped away from daily operations, A DECADE. but here we are.. same shit from this fanbase year after year.

 

2. You mean do i trust them to pull a free agent guys like, say: Dj Reader, Mike Hilton, Chidobe Awuzie, Larry Oganjobi, Good Vonn Bell, Useful Eli Apple, Trey Hendrickson, Ted Karras, Ted Cappa, Orlando Brown Jr. Bj Hill in a trade, etc? I do.. wanna know why?

 

3. Do I trust them to draft guys like: Joe Burrow, jamarr Chase, Tee Higgins, Joe mixon, Jessie Bates, jenkins, Chase Brown, Logan Wilson, Germain Pratt, David Gaither? I do.. wanna know why?

 

you are correct(and wrong) about one thing, there is ONE reason the bengals are in the state they are in right now...

 

That state:

 

top 5 offense in the nfl

bottom 5 defense.

 

the ONE REASON? i lied its two reasons.

 

Reason 1. The defensive free agents we brought in didnt pan out, it be like that sometimes.

Reason 2. We had record breaking injuries on the defensive side of the ball this season. last I check starters and key rotation snap guys were on track to miss 70 games. thats 40% of your defense missing any given game on average. Last year without a great defense at all, we gave up 22.6 PPG, this year its 28.1 PPG. so if we just had last years defensive production, we would have what? 9-10 wins right now?

 

i have openly laid out the 7-9 spots we need to upgrade, but even fixing half of them would have the defense in the middle of the pack, and the teams record battling for a top seed in the AFC.

 

 

 

The team's biggest problems aren't day to day issues, they are systemic. Mike Brown gets the final say on all the big decisions such as who the coach and de facto GM's are, which expensive free agents we pursue, and who our day 1 and 2 draft picks are. He hasn't improved with age.

 

2 hours ago, HavePityPlease said:

 

One thing to note - fully HALF of that is being spent on just Tee, on the tag.

 

I recently decided to look at the actual cap breakdown of the Bengals vs a few top teams.  It definitely looks more interesting from that perspective because you see how those teams are really not paying much to the lower majority of their roster, i.e. they're getting great value (Detroit is a very good example).   But I didn't see any of them paying anyone on the tag, at least not a large amount (feel free to give me examples of teams that are, it just wasn't true of the teams I looked at).  I mean, why would you?  If you seriously want to compete for championships, why in hell would you EVER allow yourself to be chewing off a chunk of your cap on a huge franchise tag salary?  Spread that love around to increase your chances, especially if you have holes, or sign the person to a team-friendly cap breakdown. 

 

Some things that are immediately obviously "different" about the Bengals:

  1. We appear to have a lot more guys on high regular salaries, i.e. large individual cap hits compared to other teams who find ways to spread the hit out.  
  2. We have far fewer players with guaranteed money - and if we do, I believe every one of them was a roster bonus.  Other teams have straight up guarantees, and as we know this is something the Bengals aggressively avoid.
  3. I better understand the Trey angle now - he has a $20M cap hit.  Extending him would be MUTUALLY beneficial, and that's probably why he or his agent went scorched earth in the offseason.  Why would the Bengals not do this?  Why let your back-loaded contracts balloon the cap hit?

So what's my argument here?  Simply said, it's wrong to just look at the base "cap space" number for a current season, because they are mandated to hit a minimum that is most of the cap anyway.  The story is told in the breakdown, and comparing that breakdown to how consistently successful teams are doing it.

 

Tee's tag isn't the issue. His cap number is 21.8 mil and that's probably a fair value for his services. Michael Pittman makes 23 mil per year and plays more snaps but Tee is likely the better player. The Bengals do a poor job of contract structuring. They should backload, rather than frontload deals and put more into prorated signing bonuses than roster bonuses. That would give them more flexibility and optionality in who to keep and who to let go. It would also give players more incentive to ball out so their job is secure for the following season when their cap number increases.

 

 

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